trying to understand the way ferals act

hello good thing is i am niot alone with the ferals in my yard as i have help that will be comming to help trap them and get them vet checked i do not have a car till the end of the month so i needed help


here is the thing i am trying to understand the way ferals work i noticed the house beside me is vacent the grass has grown up to my knees and i think thats where a queen and tom live

ive seen the tom cat act really friendly towards the queen she hisses at him afte but he doesnt care and i really think the queen is living with him becuase they both come and go from the exact same area

question is after the tom cat mates with the queen do they become friends and kinda hang out with each other as in he wont fight with her? ? THe tom cat is very aggressive towards other cats and i see him fighting with other cats a lot.

DO u think the queen already has kittens or is pregnant? SHe eats so much shes constantly pigging out and chows down a LOT of food but shes a long haired siamese so its hard to tell how big her belly is

i am shocked a cat like this is actually feral

i have cats comming to eat my food from all over but soon we will be catching our first 1 hopefully it is the queen

one thing i wonder about what if she has kittens hidden somewhere we can't find them and we catch her?? they will die??

Unspayed free living females do get pregnant. My guess is she has a litter there.

Yes, it is an complication to catch the mom and leave the kittens out there. They will almost surely die. So it IS a little tricky.
Now, you know roughly where they are, so it should be possible to find them.
But if not, some solve such situation by spaying the queen, and leave her back in 24 hours.
Tough? Yes, but semiferales are survivors. They manage things which most homecats wouldnt. If they didnt, they would be dead painfully perished and died long ago....

Best is of course if you can catch them all. Possibly even the kittens first, and use them as bait for the mom.
When mom sees you are nice and friendly towards the kittens, she will very soon soften she too.
Thus, fostering a feral mom with kittens is often easier than fostering an alone feral cat.


Queen friendly with the Tom? Not common, but it certainly happens now and then.
In home mating (breeders for example), they get almost always good friends after the mating is done. Even in the cases they werent at all friendly before the mating...
(Some pedigrees get god pals also before the mating - sometimes you can see real love stories - but this is another story )

The queens are taken back home later, so I dont know if they would go on and be friends. But homecats usually do get friendly with each other... Not so few Sires are also acting extra mom or at least a well wishing uncle.

So yes, as principe it isnt impossible at all yours two are really a pair, althought with free living ferales not so common.


VERY good you are going on with a TNR-work. Tx and Congrats!
Giving the hungry food is good and nice, but it becomes great first when you also do TNR and preferably also some fostering and adoptions.


Good luck!

Cats can bond with each other. Even toms (more likely to be younger cats that are siblings) can bond and pal around if there's not too much competition. I suggest you read up on lion behavior as there are a lot of overlapping similarities.
I'm not sure what sort or if hissy has any articles online anywhere - she's a wealth of information on ferals.

today the tom cat and his wife waited for me at the corner of my property i filed up their food bowl she ate so much she ate enough for 4 cats but he did not touch his food i took a good look at his face its full of nasty cuts and scars his ears are chewed up torn up with holes in them his nose is split in half

he has missing patches of fur and and wounds on him

it is going to be a week more the lady said before i can get my vouchers to have these cats fixed and vet checked god they are so slow why does it take a week to get spay and nuter vouchers i wish they would come out and look s for themselves how horrible state these cats are in what if in a week the queen has her kittens? that is another 10 unwanted feral cats its so depressing because i see a new cat every day eating out of my cat feeder i dont know whos homeless and who is wild.

so one week more for my vouchers then someone has to come out and set a trap for them i think the tom cat is going to be dead soon he wont touch his food all hes doing is comforting the queen while she eats i think these 2 r in love they are always together

hes eating now shes lifting her tail up and rubbing his face while ehe eats is this a mating thing?

Could be, or they just could be two cats that really get along. He's obviously working hard to keep his territory and female. He's going to look rough. You don't see any major swelling or limping do you? If not, he should make it through a week - he's had to make it through a lot more.

I know it's hard. Several years ago I had to round up and systematically spay and neuter a large group of semi ferals and ferals that came about because someone just upped and moved - leaving several unaltered cats living in an old trailer. I think I still have an early picture of them somewhere... it was rather daunting.

There was a mixed group of related cats, one dominate male, one mature but not dominate male that always deferred to the other male, and some immature male kittens. The top females appeared to have probably been sisters or sister and mother + their kittens. There was definitely some interesting interactions among them all.
I never did catch the dominate alpha male - as soon as I started trapped he left. I had to eventually move all of the cats to a farm due to the area being dangerous and people being willing to shoot them.

They may be both old and recent--unneutered toms will fight for both territory and mating rights, and while often ritualistic (lots of noise but no real fighting) those fights can get nasty.

It's kitten season--at our clinics we're seeing more pregnant females and more males with abcess wounds. The abcesses are usually bite wounds that become infected; those are also the primary way FIV is transmitted.

If you catch the tom it's worth extra to have him tested for FIV/FELV; he sounds like he has a history of fighting. If he's positive and feral his prospects are not good; if he's showing symptoms of any other infection and cannot be treated the most merciful thing you may be able to do is have him euthanized--you'll spare him a miserable and ugly death that I've seen....

im pretty sure the beat up toms are fiv positive i mean how could they not be with that many battl scars and he has his own queen

they seem to be very close and more and more bonded the more often i see them its a real relationship

i dont want him to be put to sleep because he has fiv i mean most dominat male wild cats must have it he will get nutered and stop fighting and calm down

Depending on the overall health of the local cat community it's no surprise to find even a badly chewed-up male that is FIV/FELV negative--one does not necessarily follow the other.

But those fights also lead to deep abcess wounds, and once those become infected they can be just as threatening. Feline bite wounds tend to be straight puncture wounds which close quickly and easily, but at the same time trap the bacteria from a cat's mouth and teeth in the wound. This results in a messy and painful infection--I've been bitten enough times to know that--and left untreated can become a real problem. I saw one cat that had a third of its back shaved, cut open, drained and then sutured back together because of infected bite wounds--it made a nice recovery.

The problem with FIV and ferals is that it may be difficult or impossible to retrap the cat later if it starts showing signs of a secondary infection such as a bad upper respiratory infection. It's the latter that will do the damage; the FIV just compromises the cat's immune system and lets the other infection spread and worsen. An FIV positive housecat really isn't a problem--if it's not fighting or reproducing it isn't spreading FIV, and if it gets sick it can be taken to a vet and treated. That's seldom the case with a feral that has not been neutered.

If you have a vet who will work with ferals (many sadly won't) trap the tom and have him tested; have any infected wounds treated. You may have to hold him in a cage for a week or so while you treat him with antibiotics. This can easily be done by mixing the meds in wet food.

Don't worry about being clawed or bitten when you change the food, water or litter--as long as the cat can retreat to another part of the cage it will, and if you're blocking the door it''s unlikely to try to run past you. While the cat is being treated you can observe it to see if it's really feral or just a frightened stray; and if it's FIV/FELV negative it can be released once treatment is completed....

Would you guys suggest chausiefan use fish mox for these wounds?

I know its a bit controversial - but i used it because my tom got another abscess (i treated it early this time) but because I cant trap him and get him to my clinic OR afford antibiotics - I tried this. Seven days later and it seems to have worked.

Also... (sorry to interrupt) once infected how soon would FIV/FELV show up in a test? Ive taken in a stray who had a horrible bite wound - he tested negative - I would think if it took months to get real results they wouldnt give him back to me - but thought id ask.

thanks...

Originally Posted by ipw533

Depending on the overall health of the local cat community it's no surprise to find even a badly chewed-up male that is FIV/FELV negative--one does not necessarily follow the other.

Click to expand...

None of the strays I've taken in have ever been positive. It just doesn't seem to be that common in my area - maybe it's because this is a rural town and there's a lower density of cats than in cities?

Sherman had his face torn open (no punctures) when I caught and took him to the vet. He's negative. But I'm not 100% that wound was from another cat as he could have also got it from a small dog that runs in that neighborhood or from prey that he didn't know how to handle.

I know FeLV can throw false positives. Not every cat that gets infected with it ends up having it - while their bodies are fighting it off they can look positive, yet go on to have their immune systems destroy it. The ELISA tests look for both by looking for the antibodies, so a cat who's fighting the viruses off or who has the antibodies from their mother will make for false positives. (plus the ELISA has a higher fail rate in general even when used for looking for human viruses)

the female cat has huge nipples but id ont think she has kittens yet

If they are friendly it is likely they are brother and sister which leads to inbreeding and all sorts of problems with the kittens. If he is a dominant male, he will fight with other toms to keep them away from the area. He is likely spraying the bushes outside warning other toms to keep away. Most submissive males will respond to his message, but the older alphas will approach and the fights can get intense.

Best thing to do is trap him and neuter him. This saves him from himself and prevents anymore inbreeding. Have him tested for all the diseases in your area before you neuter. If the vet tells you to put him down, then follow that advice.

Don't kid yourself, when he gets into the mood, he will kill her kittens. This is common with feral cats (not so much the strays) but the mourning process throws the queen into heat and he can mate again. It is survival of the fittest. If those kittens aren't his, he may also harm them considering them rivals for his throne.

If you have him captured, don't mess with him. Don't expect that if you open up the carrier or cage that he won't rush past you or aggressively attack you- because it is quite likely he will. You are his predator now and he must protect himself. If he is a true feral you need to work with him slowly and safely.

If he is a stray with strong feral tendencies (depending on how long he has been on the outside) the same applies. He can still hurt the kittens and he can indeed hurt you.

Before you do anything, get your tetanus updated. Wait 48 hours after the shot before interacting with these cats. If you take her kittens, even the queen might attack you. Wear long sleeves (I always wear a thick sweatshirt and one of my husband's overshirts) Keep your pants tucked into your socks and shoes and just be careful.

Once the queen knows her nest has been discovered, she will move the kittens. Again, survival instincts kick in. It is better IMO to trap the male, get him out of the way and just start feeding the queen several times a day at the same spot. Once she trusts that food will arrive, she will bring the kittens to you when they are weaned. They are easier to work with then and she is anxious for them to leave her teats and is less to attack you.

A long-time rescuer, I get the toms captured, tested and neutered, and the queens fixed so there are no extra kittens in the world to worry about. it is hard enough to find homes for the ones that are here already. If she has kittens on the ground, then it is highly possible she is pregnant again.

they cant be related she is a long haired himalayan and hes a short haired tabby cat total diff builds and looks they look like two diff species

they are so bonded i know this sounds silly bit it seems like real love he will wait and let her eat her fill and then slowly start eating with her yet he will savage and attack any other cat he sees anywhere near i feel like a monster splitting them up i hope one day they can again be happy together?

Just how close can you get to these two? If fairly close - within 2-3 yards or less you don't have ferals.
It's possible that they could have been dumped from the same home. Growing up together would form the same sort of bond you'd see in litter mates.

One way to test if they're strays. Take a can of cat food out and open it when they'll be able to clearly hear you. If they respond to it in any way that doesn't involve running away they're probably familiar with a human opening canned food for them. They may still keep their distance, but if they know what it is they'd probably run straight to the food as soon as you're completely out of sight.

the tom cat i can get about 40 feet of but he wont eat when im around

i can get in 20 feet of the himalayan and she will eat but any closer she will run off


i think she might of been someones pet at one point and very badly abused or something now she hates humans and shes pregnant

i bought this house on forclosure so she might of even been left behind and could of livedi n this house before me ?

yes i agree i would not dare touch him or her if they were trapped i have a feeling even she would be very aggressive if someone held her and would probably bite and scatch like hell i have been attacked by a cat in the past a horrific experience i dont ever want it to happen again

Hmm. Could be either way. Try the wet food test - if not, the food would be good to leave for them anyways.

I have a house cat that has darted out in the past. I have no idea what is wrong with this cat mentally, once he gets outside he won't let you come closer than 10 yards. We had to herd him towards and open door. Inside he's a big furry lump that after 20 minutes or so will often come out to harass strangers into scratching his butt.

"the female cat has huge nipples but id ont think she has kittens yet"

Does she have an enlarged belly? Does she look like she's carrying near-term kittens, or does she look thinner, like she already had the kittens and is nursing them? If she has not yet had the kittens trap her immediately; you can either hold her until she delivers and while she nurses the kittens--a few weeks that--or have a spay/abortion surgery done.

I won't make a recommendation either way because I really don't know what your situation is. Are you capable of caring for a nursing mother with kittens and do you have a veterinarian willing to work with stray/feral animals...?

A male tom rarely stays around a female cat unless she happens to live in a choice area. He will fight and drive off any male cats that enter that area.

I'm with Hissy - catch him and get him neutered first, then get the female to trust you with regular feedings before you catch her. She will bring the kittens up to the feeding station when she's tired of feeding them herself. We call it "teaching them to hunt the mighty-mighty food bowl".