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Republican Party Leadership

post #1 of 101
4/9/10 at 2:10pm
Thread Starter 
Political jockeying intrigues me and there is a whole lot of it going on with the GOP right now. I don't want to debate opinions, I'm just curious about your opinion on these 3 questions:

1) Who do you think is the current leader of the GOP?

2) Who would you like to be the leader of the GOP?

3) Who do you think will evolve as leader of the GOP?

I'd love to hear why you answered the way you did, and if you care to share, what your political affiliation is.
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post #2 of 101
4/9/10 at 7:30pm
To answer your questions:

1) I don't know.

2) I have no idea.

3) I wish I knew.

I am a Republican, but I have never seen such a mess as we have now. I liked Palin okay when she came on the scene, but she seems to be getting more fanatical every day. I don't believe she would ever be elected as President. Gingrich is putting himself out there more. And I always thought Lindsay Graham made a lot of sense, but he doesn't seem to have aspirations toward running...
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post #3 of 101
4/9/10 at 10:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by threecatowner View Post
To answer your questions:

1) I don't know.

2) I have no idea.

3) I wish I knew.

I am a Republican, but I have never seen such a mess as we have now.
To all of it.

I really haven't seen any single person in Congress that stands out. John Boehner is the face of "NO!" and definitely not anyone who can bring the independents toward the GOP. Newt Gingrich has some good ideas and is more of what the party needs right now - solid conservative values (fiscal, governmental). Mitt Romney still reminds me of a greasy used car salesman, and the whole healthcare in MA that was pushed and signed into law by him as governor pretty much kills his credibility. Sarah Palin...yikes. Maybe McCain's people were right to try to muzzle her, at least to an extent.

I'm really hoping that with the Tea Party continuing even after a year, even after the healthcare legislation was passed, that someone in power is taking notice. The people want old fashioned fiscal conservatism, and the economy is definitely the #1 issue on the people's minds no matter the party affiliation. You didn't give it to us with 8 years under Bush. You didn't give it to us as a real option in the last election. If you don't give us someone we can believe in and who reflects what WE want done in government, we'll make our own damn party and you won't be invited!

The unfortunate thing with the Tea Party is that if the GOP doesn't get their stuff together by 2012 at the latest the conservative movement will be so fractured that it may take years for one or the other to gain enough support overall to go up against the Democrats. That is, unless the Democrats have the same kind of fallout - by the people, against the fat cats in Washington.
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post #4 of 101
4/10/10 at 2:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by valanhb View Post
That is, unless the Democrats have the same kind of fallout - by the people, against the fat cats in Washington.
That isn't out of the question. Even people wanting change can be handed too much, too soon...and that makes people nervous. If they stay the course of "change for change's sake", things could indeed backfire.
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post #5 of 101
4/10/10 at 6:08am
Thread Starter 
I didn't answer my own questions because I was hoping to get ideas from people before I commented.

I have always considered myself a moderate democrat, and while I have empathy for people who have difficulties in life (some people call this extreme liberalism), I'm fiscally conservative. I believe in a balance of power within government, and even though I have typically voted democratic, I have counted on moderate republicans to keep things balanced.

With that said, I'm surprised at the republicans that are getting press time right now, which in my mind, are the ones that are trying to claim leadership in the party. People like Boehner, Cantor, Bachman and Palin are getting the press, and they are not moderates. It doesn't help that the conservative media is fueling the extreme voices in the party. Many of the talking points within the party are coming straight out of the mouths of the media pundits, which leads me to believe that Fox Network is the current leader of the GOP. What scares me is that they are admitting to be "entertainers" rather than news reporters. And these entertainers are simply there to keep their ratings up so will say anything to keep their audience.

I've been hard pressed to find a moderate GOP candidate. I know they are out there, they are just not given a voice right now. If one were to rise up and lead the party, I would want that person to lead the GOP.

Palin is positioning herself as the head of the Tea Party and getting huge media coverage. While I love grass roots movements, the way that they are portrayed in the media leads me to believe that they are a Libertarian group claiming to be fiscal conservatives. Just read the signs being held by members and you will see the conflicting messages - keep government out of my business but keep your hands off my medicare. Last I checked, Medicare is a government run program. They appear to be attracting a lot of fringe supporters without any clear common objectives of where they stand. Palin is pushing the fears in people for her own political gain while ignoring the facts behind her statements. She is nothing more than a media sound byte with no substance and I hope that people see her for what she is. If they don't, the likes of her will be the future of the GOP. I asked my DH the other night his opinion on why she gets so much press and his answer intrigued me: It's similar to the phenomena of the gapers block - traffic slows down from a bad accident because everyone wants to stop and see the accident. The worse the accident, the longer people stop and look.

Based on the media coverage I see, the GOP is going in a direction counter to its principles. If anyone in the party tries to reclaim it for what is has historically been, the party will splinter. If it continues the direction it is going right now, it will become a Libertarian party. I watched an interview with a republican gubernatorial candidate last night who was an admitted Libertarian, but is getting attention because he claims to be anti government. When asked how he would propose to pay for government programs such as the military, his response was to implement a national sales tax. How is this republican?
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post #6 of 101
4/10/10 at 1:44pm
There's a funny opinion piece in today's NYT regarding female Republican candidates and the entertainment factor:
The Curse of the Wow Factor
Quote:
Meanwhile, two of the hottest names in politics are Sarah Palin and Michele Bachmann.

They held a joint rally in Minneapolis this week, and it was one long wow. Palin called the crowd “you who love your good hunting and fishing.” Bachmann sounded like a combination of an ancient Roman matron preparing to send her sons off to die for their country, and one of those people who walk around yelling that enemies implant secret radios in their brains while they’re sleeping.

Their superstardom is a very bad development, even though there is no reason to believe either is ever going to be elected to a position where they could do serious damage. (If Sarah Palin was seriously planning a presidential run, do you think she’d have agreed to be speaker-for-hire at the Wine and Spirits Wholesalers of America Convention at Caesars Palace in Las Vegas this week?)

The problem is that they’re all wow and no substance. Palin is living proof that you can be popular without having to try very hard. It appears she’s never going to respond to all the pundits who urged her to go back to Alaska and read up on current events.

And Bachmann’s fame has increased by leaps and bounds despite the fact that she, um, makes stuff up. In February, she said she had it on good authority that in Japan the government puts people who criticize the health care system “on a list” and denies them treatment. (“That takes us to gangster government at that point!”)
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post #7 of 101
4/10/10 at 2:54pm
Hey, Momofmany, you just keep on thinking that. That is exactly what you should be thinking. :

FTR, John McCain is a moderate, people, for whatever reason, do not WANT a moderate, on either side. Such is why they elected the most far left Democrat in America as POTUS.
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post #8 of 101
4/10/10 at 3:10pm
I, also think many have Sarah Palin pegged all wrong.

If it wasn't for the left Sarah Palin would still be Governor of Alaska and would be busy governing her state.

But as soon as McCain chose Palin as his running mate the hate on the left began. Good grief, it was everywhere and it was immediate. Even on this forum people knew nothing about her but they hated her anyway. I heard it said here that she couldn't be VP, she had a special needs baby, she had kids to raise.

Then the left descended on Wasilla and started digging for dirt, any dirt, it didn't matter what it was, just give them some dirt.

What they found was a woman of integrity, a woman that walks the walk, that rooted out, and made public, corruption in her own party.
Oh my gosh, we can't have a person like that in Washington.

Fast forward to after the election, Barack has won. But the Left can't help themselves, it wasn't enough that McCain and Palin lost the election, Sarah Palin MUST be destroyed. And the frivolous law suits and ethics violations continued, unabated. And the legal fees were mounting, mounting.
State law of Alaska does not permit state funds to be used for legal fees of a sitting Governor. So the Palin family is responsible for paying to defend themselves from phony, made up, lies by the left. THAT is what the far left is made up of, mean, hateful, rotten people that had to destroy this woman for the simple fact that she walks the walk. Then they start to go after her family, her children.

Sarah Palin resigns as Governor because, quite simply, she cannot afford the legal fees to defend herself against the lies of the left. Then she is ridiculed, insulted and constantly harassed by the left for resigning.

The left was happy, they achieved their goal, they got rid of Sarah Palin.

Little did they know, there IS still some justice in this world.

The left should have left enough alone, I think it is freaking hilarious.

And Barack Obama, our PRESIDENT is reduced to defending himself against a private citizen, Sarah Palin, on National TV, Good Morning America regarding his nuclear policy. What a buffoon that man is.
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post #9 of 101
4/10/10 at 3:14pm
I love how women turn on their own, it's no wonder women just can't quite get equal to men. They have no one to blame but themselves.
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post #10 of 101
4/10/10 at 3:27pm
Forgot to tell you guys, I went to the Tea Party Rally in Searchlight two weeks ago, The Showdown in Searchlight as the Tea Party Express kicked off their third cross country tour in a year.

Why the little, dusty town of Searchlight, an hour south of Las Vegas?
It's Harry Reids home town and Harry Reid is going down. Pelosi better start looking for a new Senate Majority Leader because this one is history.

10,000+ people show up. It was incredible, absolutely incredible.
And no problems, no trouble, no racism, no litter, just ordinary Americans that don't like the direction their country is headed. I saw Sarah Palin there, she was good, she is real, she isn't some phony, lying, back stabbing politician that says one thing and does another. But America doesn't really want good people in Washington, we like the snakes much better.

FTR, the only trouble at the Tea Party in Searchlight was by the Harry REid supporters and the left, including the Union, IBEW. They got ugly, threatening people and throwing eggs at Tea Party Buses. I can post pictures and video if anyone wants to see them.

And I notice no one on the left has taken Andrew Breitbart up on his offer of $100,000.00 to the person that can prove that there was racial slurs and spitting going on at the Tea Party Rally in Washington the day before the Health Care Vote. Thousands of video cameras there, heck, even the aides of the Congressional Black Caucus had cameras but no one heard or saw anything, isn't that odd?

One has to wonder why the Congressional Black Caucus chose THAT day of all days to wade through the Tea Party protestors. Hmmmmmm, isn't to hard to figure out. But it didn't work so they had to lie and their lies didn't work either. This is the Left, this is what they are.
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post #11 of 101
4/10/10 at 4:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Hey, Momofmany, you just keep on thinking that. That is exactly what you should be thinking. :

FTR, John McCain is a moderate, people, for whatever reason, do not WANT a moderate, on either side. Such is why they elected the most far left Democrat in America as POTUS.
He USED to present himself as a moderate. Now that he is in a primary against a fellow GOP challenger that appears to be a bit more conservative than he, he is promoting himself as full blown, party faithful right wing. Gotta pander to those votes, ya' know.
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post #12 of 101
4/10/10 at 7:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skippymjp View Post
He USED to present himself as a moderate. Now that he is in a primary against a fellow GOP challenger that appears to be a bit more conservative than he, he is promoting himself as full blown, party faithful right wing. Gotta pander to those votes, ya' know.
I hear ya, but I will STILL take John McCain over any of those pork-barrel earmark-laden politicians any day of the week.

FTR, I have voted for Harry Reid every single election since that man was elected to the Senate, but no more.
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post #13 of 101
4/10/10 at 8:06pm
In answer to the original question, I don't think we have seen who will eventually shake out as a leader. Remember, as I pointed out some time back, if Scott Brown ran for President, he would actually have more experience in national politics than Barack Obama did when he started his run. And I wouldn't be surprised if something like that happens (not necessarily Brown, but someone who is not on the current national radar).

I can say with some conviction it won't be Sarah Palin. Now watch them prove me wrong!
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post #14 of 101
4/10/10 at 8:38pm
now make up approx. 40% of those attending tea party rallies. They are fed up with "hoax and chains". Moderates apparently have decided they must take a stand to the right against the radical left who are bent on destroying this country. Even some democrats are now saying this is too far, and we're not "down for this cause."

Republicans won't win when they run moderates like John McCain. They tried it with Bush 41 after 2 terms of truly conservative leadership under Reagan. While he did win his first election on the heels of Regan conservatism, 41 lost to Clinton because he raised taxes and governed as a moderate.

Bush 43 while heroic in defending our nation, (his most important responsibility), was a moderate and big government spender ( but pales compared to BHO). His unwillingness to defend our southern border against illegal alien invasion didn't sit well with conservatives and he lost his base by placating moderates like John McCain and Lindsey Graham on anmesty and Gitmo.

The republicans don't need a head right now beyond Michael Steele. When a presidential candidate is selected he/she will become the party head. Sarah Paline energizes people because she speaks plain truth without fancy nuances that are meaningless. Try asking Exxon how dumb she is after she brought them to their knees in Alaska. She will balance the budget, and cut waste and fraud, and produce domestic energy in abundance and cut taxes. Last, just like Reagan when she speaks the Iranians, Chinese, and Russians are going to listen. Reagan would never have sold out Poland and neither will Palin.
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post #15 of 101
4/10/10 at 8:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueyedgirl5946 View Post
Sarah Paline energizes people because she speaks plain truth without fancy nuances that are meaningless. Try asking Exxon how dumb she is after she brought them to their knees in Alaska. She will balance the budget, and cut waste and fraud, and produce domestic energy in abundance and cut taxes. Last, just like Reagan when she speaks the Iranians, Chinese, and Russians are going to listen. Reagan would never have sold out Poland and neither will Palin.
Yeah, I liked that Sarah Palin. But is she still in there?
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post #16 of 101
4/10/10 at 9:39pm
Good post Blueyedgirl. While I am for Immigration Reform I think it is horrendous what has been allowed to happen on our southern border by Bush and Barack.

I just want Barack to show some freaking SPINE, for ONCE.
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post #17 of 101
4/11/10 at 4:01am
Thread Starter 
I'm going to ask that you get back to the original topic and not make this another Obama bashing thread. I asked for your opinion on the GOP, not the democrats.

The discussion about what is moderate versus right and left is interesting in relation to what people may chose in their GOP candidate.

Stevens just announced that he is retiring from the Supreme Court. When he was appointed under Ford, he was considered a moderate conservative and now he is considered the extreme liberal on the bench. Has the definition of conservative shifted so far right that moderate conservatives are now liberals? I heard a quote from someone in the GOP about the potential replacement and I'll have to paraphrase it, but it was something on the line of they didn't want another fanatic empathetic liberal on the bench. So the implication was not so much that he was liberal, but because he showed empathy, he was a fanatic.
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post #18 of 101
4/11/10 at 5:43am
Quote:
Originally Posted by threecatowner View Post
Yeah, I liked that Sarah Palin. But is she still in there?
Yes Palin is definitely still in there.

I'm going to ask that you get back to the original topic and not make this another Obama bashing thread. I asked for your opinion on the GOP, not the democrats. (Posted by momofmany)

I was only pointing out why moderates can't make it in the Republican Party. I didn't bash Obama any more than I did the moderates who have run; ie John McCain.
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post #19 of 101
4/11/10 at 5:45am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueyedgirl5946 View Post
I was only pointing out why moderates can't make it in the Republican Party. I didn't bash Obama any more than I did the moderates who have run; ie John McCain.
I agree and appreciate your perspective on moderates.
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post #20 of 101
4/11/10 at 7:20am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momofmany View Post
I agree and appreciate your perspective on moderates.
The problem, of course, is that moderates don't do well in any party, because they don't have any beliefs that are strong enough to drive them into a party where they might not agree with some of the major tenets of the party. In other words, rabid pro-abortion activists will never abandon the Democrats, and anti-abortion activists will never abandon the Republicans. And there are any number of those "single issue" voters on both sides.
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post #21 of 101
4/11/10 at 7:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momofmany View Post

With that said, I'm surprised at the republicans that are getting press time right now, which in my mind, are the ones that are trying to claim leadership in the party. People like Boehner, Cantor, Bachman and Palin are getting the press, and they are not moderates. It doesn't help that the conservative media is fueling the extreme voices in the party. Many of the talking points within the party are coming straight out of the mouths of the media pundits, which leads me to believe that Fox Network is the current leader of the GOP. What scares me is that they are admitting to be "entertainers" rather than news reporters. And these entertainers are simply there to keep their ratings up so will say anything to keep their audience.

I've been hard pressed to find a moderate GOP candidate. I know they are out there, they are just not given a voice right now. If one were to rise up and lead the party, I would want that person to lead the GOP.

Palin is positioning herself as the head of the Tea Party and getting huge media coverage. While I love grass roots movements, the way that they are portrayed in the media leads me to believe that they are a Libertarian group claiming to be fiscal conservatives. Just read the signs being held by members and you will see the conflicting messages - keep government out of my business but keep your hands off my medicare. Last I checked, Medicare is a government run program. They appear to be attracting a lot of fringe supporters without any clear common objectives of where they stand. Palin is pushing the fears in people for her own political gain while ignoring the facts behind her statements. She is nothing more than a media sound byte with no substance and I hope that people see her for what she is. If they don't, the likes of her will be the future of the GOP. I asked my DH the other night his opinion on why she gets so much press and his answer intrigued me: It's similar to the phenomena of the gapers block - traffic slows down from a bad accident because everyone wants to stop and see the accident. The worse the accident, the longer people stop and look.

Based on the media coverage I see, the GOP is going in a direction counter to its principles. If anyone in the party tries to reclaim it for what is has historically been, the party will splinter. If it continues the direction it is going right now, it will become a Libertarian party. I watched an interview with a republican gubernatorial candidate last night who was an admitted Libertarian, but is getting attention because he claims to be anti government. When asked how he would propose to pay for government programs such as the military, his response was to implement a national sales tax. How is this republican?
When you post that Palin is an extremist you have to expect a rebuttal, you posted the above and got a reply. I did go off on a bit of a tangent, but Sarah Palin is far from an extremist.
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post #22 of 101
4/11/10 at 7:49am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblanche View Post
The problem, of course, is that moderates don't do well in any party, because they don't have any beliefs that are strong enough to drive them into a party where they might not agree with some of the major tenets of the party. In other words, rabid pro-abortion activists will never abandon the Democrats, and anti-abortion activists will never abandon the Republicans. And there are any number of those "single issue" voters on both sides.
I would like to think that whichever party claims the moderate field for iteself will be the one to be sucessful in the next electrion as I don't care for extremists on either end.

And for clarification, there is no such thing as a "pro-abortion activist." There are however pro-choice activists who want to keep government hands off of women's bodies. In an ideal world, no woman would ever be faced with the need to make that choice.
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post #23 of 101
4/11/10 at 9:39am
Actually, there ARE pro-abortion activists. In fact, Planned Parenthood was founded by one.

However, it IS true that whatever party claims the independents is the one that wins. Right now, the independents are leaning very heavily Republican...but the election is still seven months away, and a lot can happen in that time.
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post #24 of 101
4/11/10 at 12:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momofmany View Post
Has the definition of conservative shifted so far right that moderate conservatives are now liberals?
Unfortunately, that's the impression I get.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2dogmom
I would like to think that whichever party claims the moderate field for iteself will be the one to be sucessful in the next electrion as I don't care for extremists on either end.

It's really about time that our elected representatives stop pandering to special-interest groups and serve the middle-of-the-road constituents.
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post #25 of 101
4/11/10 at 12:21pm
If the Reps had any descent candidate, no way would Obama have been elected, IMO. Nothing against McCain personally, but he was old and boring and couldn't relate to a younger voting populace (who values the wrapping over the content of the package). We need a candidate who has charisma, youth, wisdom and who doesn't have a boatload of bitter ex-wives (or husbands), and who places personal character at the forefront of his/her qualifications. Are there any Reps with those credentials for a run in 2012?

Newt Gingrich is definitely not the one. I think his shabby personal life, leaving wife #1 while hospitalized with cancer, to take up with wife #2, and then leaving #2 while dating #3 before the divorce is on paper puts him in the same moral category as John Edwards. Newt is a very smart person, but his moral choices will bring him down just as it did to Edwards and Guilliani. It's time Republicans find a good role model and start vetting their potential candidates on a national level before they come up with a bunch of losers like what happened in 2008.
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post #26 of 101
4/11/10 at 1:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
I hear ya, but I will STILL take John McCain over any of those pork-barrel earmark-laden politicians any day of the week.

FTR, I have voted for Harry Reid every single election since that man was elected to the Senate, but no more.
That's one way to look at it, I suppose. Of course, the other way is, with pork-barrel earmark laden politicians, you know exactly what you have most of the time. You have a politician who is using the political system to "bring home the bacon" to his/her home district. People from any other district will look on with jealousy as "pork-barrel earmark-laden politicians" do all they can to funnel money into their home districts, and will berate them for it, all the while defending their own "bring home the bacon" politicians.

On the other hand, a "highly principled" politician, who will kick those principles to the curb when they get in the way of them getting the votes needed to win a primary, is someone who's principles are, and always will be, for sale.
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post #27 of 101
4/11/10 at 5:28pm
Of course, the old saying is that an honest politician is one that, when he's bought, stays bought.

Gingrich is making too much money from his current organization to run for President, and, as you said, his personal life looks like something stuck on the bottom of someone's shoe.

But I don't think ANY Republican could have beaten Obama. There was just too much wind against them. What happens in the next election will probably be determined by events that have not occurred yet.
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post #28 of 101
4/11/10 at 7:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skippymjp View Post
That's one way to look at it, I suppose. Of course, the other way is, with pork-barrel earmark laden politicians, you know exactly what you have most of the time. You have a politician who is using the political system to "bring home the bacon" to his/her home district. People from any other district will look on with jealousy as "pork-barrel earmark-laden politicians" do all they can to funnel money into their home districts, and will berate them for it, all the while defending their own "bring home the bacon" politicians.

On the other hand, a "highly principled" politician, who will kick those principles to the curb when they get in the way of them getting the votes needed to win a primary, is someone who's principles are, and always will be, for sale.
Well, if you want to put pork and earmarks ahead of what is best for the country, that's fine. I don't.

I haven't seen McCain kicking his principles to the curb to get votes to win the primary. As far as I know he is still against pork and earmarks.
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post #29 of 101
4/11/10 at 7:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Well, if you want to put pork and earmarks ahead of what is best for the country, that's fine. I don't.

I haven't seen McCain kicking his principles to the curb to get votes to win the primary. As far as I know he is still against pork and earmarks.
So that's all it takes eh. If you are against porks and earmarks, then nothing else matters? "By golly, I don't try to obtain ANYTHING for my constituents, so that would make me a just dandy President!".
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post #30 of 101
4/11/10 at 8:06pm
I think it would be safe to say there is a big difference between porking up the earmarks on a must-have bill and having a real vote on individual items. At least, Obama thought so before the election. Apparently he now agrees with you!
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