New food?

hypancistrus · Feb 21, 2010

Our 3 year old male tabby has issues with regurgitating undigested food. We are currently feeding Purina ONE Urinary Tract Health. Last summer ('09) I changed him over to Blue Indoor Cat formula, which has more meat and less grain. The regurgitating stopped. Then in August, he ended up with a bad UTI that cost us several hundred in vet bills. We put him back on the UTH formula and he hasn't had issues since, but the regurging has started happening again.

Does anyone have any suggestions for a happy medium here? Is there a higher-meat food that is safe for a male cats urinary tract since he seems sensitive??

sharky · Feb 21, 2010

I would suggest looking at Nutro and Royal canins OTC UTI formulas ... Nutros pm me and I will give you names as they NO longer state ON THE bag UTI health claims...

Blue Indoor is a VERY VERY grainy food so I personally would think most simplier foods would have = to more meat... ie one meat to one grain

hypancistrus · Feb 22, 2010

Our local Petsmart carries both Royal Canin and Nutro. I think I'd prefer Nutro. Which brands are safe for UT?

nosykitty · Feb 23, 2010

First of all, if these are all dry food, than that is what your problem is.

Purina ONE UTH is COMPLETE crap. This is why - The primary ingredients are: Corn gluten meal, ground yellow corn, chicken, brewers rice, wheat flour.

In other words: Filler/allergen, Filler/allergen, meat (should be the FIRST ingredient), allergen, allergen.

The reason why your cat keeps having regurgitating problems on this food is because it is made primarily of allergens and completely species-inappropriate grains.

Blue Buffalo is a better product, but the reason he is developing the UTIs is because he is on a dry food.

Dry food is dehydrating, and cats, who obtain ALL of their water from their prey, do not have a strong thirst drive, will not drink enough water, and therefore remain in a constant state of dehydration. Dry food is the main cause of UTIs in cats.

It is very important, especially for your cat now to be on a wet food diet, or atleast mixed wet/dry.

Pretty much any wet food is better than dry food, but brands like, By Nature, EVO, Wellness, Blue Buffalo etc., are a higher quality.

If you absolutely can't/won't switch to wet, both Royal Canine and Nutro dry food are horrible, atleast go with a higher quality dry such as By Nature, EVO or Wellness. I prefer By Nature because its first ingredients are quality meats, it contains no by-products, no grains/no corn, no wheat, no soy(no allergens) and it is free of chemical preservatives like BHA, BHT and Ethoxyquine.
This is what you want to look for in any food you choose.

Good Luck.

sharky · Feb 23, 2010

Originally Posted by NosyKitty

First of all, if these are all dry food, than that is what your problem is.

Purina ONE UTH is COMPLETE crap. This is why - The primary ingredients are: Corn gluten meal, ground yellow corn, chicken, brewers rice, wheat flour.

In other words: Filler/allergen, Filler/allergen, meat (should be the FIRST ingredient), allergen, allergen.

The reason why your cat keeps having regurgitating problems on this food is because it is made primarily of allergens and completely species-inappropriate grains.

Blue Buffalo is a better product, but the reason he is developing the UTIs is because he is on a dry food.

Dry food is dehydrating, and cats, who obtain ALL of their water from their prey, do not have a strong thirst drive, will not drink enough water, and therefore remain in a constant state of dehydration. Dry food is the main cause of UTIs in cats.

It is very important, especially for your cat now to be on a wet food diet, or atleast mixed wet/dry.

Pretty much any wet food is better than dry food, but brands like, By Nature, EVO, Wellness, Blue Buffalo etc., are a higher quality.

If you absolutely can't/won't switch to wet, both Royal Canine and Nutro dry food are horrible, atleast go with a higher quality dry such as By Nature, EVO or Wellness. I prefer By Nature because its first ingredients are quality meats, it contains no by-products, no grains/no corn, no wheat, no soy(no allergens) and it is free of chemical preservatives like BHA, BHT and Ethoxyquine.
This is what you want to look for in any food you choose.

Good Luck.

The red is a OPINION and should be labeled as such
Dry food is dehydrating.. But the One I mentioned ACTUALLY are certified for UTI health via the FDA ... Do you know how long the testing is for this certification? I do

18-24 months

Grain free is THE WRONG way to go in a dry for UTI health ... Corn gluten , corn and to some extent rice , oats and barley actually balance out the meals used in higher end foods ... The BRANDS mentioned by you while decent to good NOT one is certified nor have any of them been( two of them have more grain than some grocery brands

) ... they do contain the WRONG amount of key minerals for a UTI prone cat..

Yes, for MOST wet is a better way to go for UTI health.. Wet food is far easier to find a proper balance on uti minerals

nosykitty · Feb 23, 2010

Hypancistrus,

I apologize for the confusion going on in your thread. When it comes to things like the health of our pets, there are and will always be many old theories, many new theories, many myths, many facts and many opinions. When I make a post I don't go by popular belief or my own opinion. I present researched and proven scientific facts from legitimate sources only.

The basic ingredients I have listed to go by when choosing a food are not my opinion. I don't know why Sharky would say that, as this is common knowledge you will find from any knowledgeable vet or reputable internet source. Here are some references regarding ingredients in your cats food:

http://www.vetinfo.com/look-for-canned-cat-food.html
http://www.bornfreeusa.org/facts.php?more=1&p=359
http://www.preciouspets.org/report.htm

As for a dry food formula for UTI prone cats, they work by acidifying the PH levels in the cats urine which will dissolve struvite stones and prevent recurrence of struvite and calcium oxalate stones.

"The current trend towards dry food with urine acidifiers (for urinary tract health according to pet food manufacturers) can cause metabolic acidosis, resulting in impaired kidney function and mineral imbalance that includes potassium depletion." This excerpt and other scientifically proven information can be found in the following links:

http://www.blakkatz.com/dryfood.html
http://www.catinfo.org/

I highly recommend against feeding any dry food to a cat who has already developed issues from eating dry food. Cats CAN develop non-food related UTIs, but it is more rare for a cat to develop a UTI from a wet food than from dry. It is also very common for a UTI prone cat to completely stop getting UTIs after they have been switched to a wet food. Hydration is a big issue, this goes for humans as well. When we don't flush our bodies enough, problems will start to occur. More on UTIs and FLUTD here: http://www.littlebigcat.com/index.ph...=show&item=017

The way to get rid of reoccuring UTI's is:
-Water, Water, Water!!
-No dry food, period!
-No free feeding of dry food.
-No supplements (can cause Urine to become either too acidic or too alkaline)
-No dry prescription food.
-Remain stress free as much as possible.
-Feed a wet only high protein grain free food.
-Clean the litter box everyday.
-Water, Water, Water!

I'm a little confused at the grain free comment that Sharky has made because they seem to be contradicting themselves in their previous post about BB being very grainy and foods which are more simple have more meat or something. It doesn't really make sense, and it's not exactly accurate either, but this is a whole different vast discussion which I do not care to go into right now.

The fact is that Cats are obligate carnivores. They have no need whatsoever for any food which is not meat, and they do not even have the enzymes in their saliva to actually break down carbohydrates and starches, so their pancreas is forced to produce large amounts of this enzyme to deal with these starches.

In short, carbs/grains/starches are a completely unnecessary and species-inappropriate source of energy for the cat and you will have a very hard time finding any dry food which contains less than 50% of carbs. Here is another reference confirming this: http://maxshouse.com/feline_nutrition.htm

All said, it is clear that your cats body is practically yelling at you, telling you there is something wrong. The regurgitating and UTI combined, are a pretty damn sure sign that what your cat is eating is NOT natural to him and is absolutely not doing him any good. Truly, the very best thing you can do for this cat is to feed him a raw, or at least a partially raw diet. By feeding raw, you are giving the cat a food which his body is actually designed to consume and thrive on. I would not be surprised in the least if every problem your cat has, disappears completely after being fed his species-appropriate diet. If interested, links are in my last post.

From the links and information I have supplied, you should now have every bit of information you need to properly care for your kitty, regardless of what I or anyone else says.

Good luck with him.

katkisses · Feb 24, 2010

Wet is best for a UTI cat, but there are many UTI friendly drys too. I have had a lot of success with Nutro dry and 50% wet food for my UTI cat Cody. I have heard of some cats that just can not go off of the Rx foods. My Bear is one of them, when I take him off of C/D he gets crystals again, but he had crystals so bad that he had to have p/u surgery so it's not surprising.

Another thing that really helped my cats was getting them off of well water. Well water is full of minerals. There is speculation that certain minerals contribute to crystals in cats urine. Since I started them on store bought water, they haven't had any issues urinary wise. There was a point that I started giving them the well water again, thinking I was just doing 'overkill,' but both of my boys flared up again.

A water fountain can help increase his water intake too.

I am not so sure about "no free feeding." I have read that free feeing is ideal for UTI cats, because when a cat only eats 2 meals a day there is a spike in something (someone help me here) and that it is best for them to eat several small meals a day, like they would free feeding.

That said, I do not free feed because 3 of mine turn into porkers when I free feed. Some members put a measured amount of food out each day, and just let the cat eat it throughout the day. That may work for you.

As you can already tell, there are many different views on UTI foods. I had to use a process of elimination before I figured out what worked for my cats. Every cat is different anyway's, Nutro is fine for Cody but doesn't work for Bear.

It sound like your cat is allergic to something in the Purina, or is just sensitive.

Good luck, I know it is overwhelming and frustrating.

sharky · Feb 24, 2010

NosyKitty;2827077 said:
Hypancistrus,

I apologize for the confusion going on in your thread. When it comes to things like the health of our pets, there are and will always be many old theories, many new theories, many myths, many facts and many opinions. When I make a post I don't go by popular belief or my own opinion. I present researched and proven scientific facts from legitimate sources only.

The basic ingredients I have listed to go by when choosing a food are not my opinion. I don't know why Sharky would say that, as this is common knowledge you will find from any knowledgeable vet or reputable internet source. Here are some references regarding ingredients in your cats food:

http://www.vetinfo.com/look-for-canned-cat-food.html

Yes the AMVA does and has for a very long time recommended all cats get some wet food ... DO you know when and what the recommendation is? I do .
http://www.bornfreeusa.org/facts.php?more=1&p=359
http://www.preciouspets.org/report.htm

As for a dry food formula for UTI prone cats, they work by acidifying the PH levels in the cats urine which will dissolve struvite stones and prevent recurrence of struvite and calcium oxalate stones.

Very true... If you read the Actual vet manual you will get the real stats.

"The current trend towards dry food with urine acidifiers (for urinary tract health according to pet food manufacturers) can cause metabolic acidosis, resulting in impaired kidney function and mineral imbalance that includes potassium depletion." This excerpt and other scientifically proven information can be found in the following links:

http://www.blakkatz.com/dryfood.html
http://www.catinfo.org/

I highly recommend against feeding any dry food to a cat who has already developed issues from eating dry food. Cats CAN develop non-food related UTIs, but it is more rare for a cat to develop a UTI from a wet food than from dry. It is also very common for a UTI prone cat to completely stop getting UTIs after they have been switched to a wet food. Hydration is a big issue, this goes for humans as well. When we don't flush our bodies enough, problems will start to occur. More on UTIs and FLUTD here: http://www.littlebigcat.com/index.ph...=show&item=017

The way to get rid of reoccuring UTI's is:
-Water, Water, Water!!
-No dry food, period!
-No free feeding of dry food.
-No supplements (can cause Urine to become either too acidic or too alkaline)
-No dry prescription food. DID you get a DVM and a degree in animal nutrition? if not this is a Dangerous thought for many cats... thou I will 100% agree with discussing all the options With a Vet
-Remain stress free as much as possible. We all should
-Feed a wet only high protein grain free food. This is very easy to say and hard for Most to do
-Clean the litter box everyday.
-Water, Water, Water! For some a fountain will work for added drinking.... Many Cats do NOT drink as they are not programed to

I'm a little confused at the grain free comment that Sharky has made because they seem to be contradicting themselves in their previous post about BB being very grainy and foods which are more simple have more meat or something. It doesn't really make sense, and it's not exactly accurate either, but this is a whole different vast discussion which I do not care to go into right now. Blue outside of Wilderness is a very Grainy food ... You seem you want to know so Pm me and I will help you ....

The fact is that Cats are obligate carnivores. They have no need whatsoever for any food which is not meat, and they do not even have the enzymes in their saliva to actually break down carbohydrates and starches, so their pancreas is forced to produce large amounts of this enzyme to deal with these starches.
That is the Ideal in the perfect world ...
In short, carbs/grains/starches are a completely unnecessary ( very true NO need )and species-inappropriate source of energy for the cat and you will have a very hard time finding any dry food which contains less than 50% of carbs. Here is another reference confirming this: http://maxshouse.com/feline_nutrition.htm
Very old link and today very inaccurate .... the Ave carb level in a grain containing DRY food is 25-35%.. Many grain frees are under 15% .. But with a dry food which Millions to Billion of cats eat daily a carb is needed to process and keep the shape..
All said, it is clear that your cats body is practically yelling at you, telling you there is something wrong. The regurgitating and UTI combined, are a pretty damn sure sign that what your cat is eating is NOT natural to him and is absolutely not doing him any good. Truly, the very best thing you can do for this cat is to feed him a raw, or at least a partially raw diet. By feeding raw, you are giving the cat a food which his body is actually designed to consume and thrive on. I would not be surprised in the least if every problem your cat has, disappears completely after being fed his species-appropriate diet. If interested, links are in my last post.
Raw is a good option for some, many will not eat it others cant handle it ( both cats and owners)... It can Kill if done wrong and even advocates often feed other foods to create a true balance ... I have done it as part of the plan for a very long time... It should be Done only with the guidance of a Vet , that is not a hard person to find.

From the links and information I have supplied, you should now have every bit of information you need to properly care for your kitty, regardless of what I or anyone else says.
A quick talk with a qualified vet will do far more than any link!

momofmany · Feb 24, 2010

I have a chronic UTI boy (Muddy). His issues arise from the fact that he has idiopathic cystitis, which causes an inflamation in his bladder, which in turn causes crystals, and all of this makes him prone to UTI's. His immune system is weak.

You can find just about any advice on the Internet, but I have found thru trial and error what works for Muddy. I tried Purina dry and frankly he wouldn't eat it. Same for the Royal Canin prescription formulas. He did OK on the Nutromax for a while, but then he started to block again so I had to switch him over to prescription. As much as I don't like it, he's on Science Diet CD. He gets it because he remains healthy on it.

But this is only a small portion of what I do for him. I have 2 water fountains and other sources of water throughout the house. I'll throw ice cubes into the water bowls to attract him to them. I put L-Lysine powder in the water bowls to boost his immune system.

I feed 2 meals of wet food a day - one of them prescription formula and the other a mid-grade brand. He will not touch grain free wet foods. Muddy gets roughly 75% of his daily food from wet food. The dry CD is only a supplement in case he wants to snack throughout the day.

In a household of 10 cats and 3 dogs, I do what I can to keep him stress free. Yes, the more critters in your household, the more stress they will all be under. I take the time to snuggle, play, groom, and just pick up and hold him as often as I can. I have over 10 cat condos all over the house, chairs placed in windows with bird feeders outside the windows (great entertainment) and cushy beds scattered around.

I work closely with my vet on what to do to keep him healthy. And I will be honest. I've yet to meet a vet that has a good handle on animal nutrition. Science Diet has poisoned the minds of most vets these days and I always take what they say with a huge grain of salt.

Dry food didn't cause Muddy's chronic condition, as he's eaten mostly wet for his entire life. Some cats are simply prone to them. Once it becomes chronic, you have to keep trying things until you find something that works for you. And frankly, if a cat won't eat a food, stop giving it to them. It would be great if Muddy would eat some of the grain free or prescription foods available, but since he won't touch them, it is better for him to eat than to not eat at all. Being stressed about being forced to eat something they don't like defeats the purpose.

otto · Feb 24, 2010

First, anyone can find anything on the internet to substantiate their opinion. I'm not saying everything is wrong, just saying, links are not proof of anything.

Secondly, UTI and crystals in the urine are two different things. Urinary tract infections are bacterial infections. Crystals in the urine are brought on by stress or diet or UTI, or a cat is simply prone to having this condition.

Cats can have UTIs without crystals, they can have crystals without UTIs or they can have both. This is why urine cultures are so important, not self diagnosing via the internet.

Third, while it is true that an all canned diet may help some cats with Feline Lower Urinary Tract Disease, it will not help ALL.

I have a female cat with Lower Urinary Tract disease. She forms struvite crystals. She was on the Hills Prescription c/d multicare kibble for a long time, then I decided against my vet's better judgment to try to switch her to an all wet diet of Wellness, who made all these claims about healthy urine pH etc etc.

Big mistake. Within 2 months of the switch Mazy's urine was chock full of struvite AND phosphorous.

Mazy will now remain on Hills Prescription c/d for life as it has been proven to control her FLUTD. I would love for her to be on canned food, but she won't eat the canned Hills Prescription c/d. For Mazy, the lesser of two evils had to be chosen.

I can't remember who said that corn is used for a reason, with FLUTD cats, but they are correct. Corn gluten meal is a low ash source of protein and acts as a urine acidifier for cats who have special dietary needs.

To the OP: I would not be feeding a male cat with Lower Urinary tract Disease any grocery store brand food. Ad I would never recommend Nutro brand anything. I would find a prescription food wet or dry or both, and stick to it. My opinion.

Male cats prone to UTIs or crystal formation can block suddenly, and a blockage is fatal if not attended to by a vet within 24 hours. And the pain they suffer is terrible. That is fact.

New food?

hypancistrus

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sharky

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hypancistrus

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nosykitty

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sharky

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nosykitty

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katkisses

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sharky

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momofmany

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otto

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