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What are the odds?

post #1 of 16
1/30/10 at 12:41pm
Thread Starter 
[color="Indigo"]What are the odds of a feral cat getting pregnat a second time? Last year we had a female brindle cat who gave birth to 3 orange kittens. I want to make sure that shes not going to give birth again with kittens this year. I can not take in another cat. I have 3 cats and a dog.

She is hard to catch. She comes to my house every day for food and water. I have a cat house for her too> http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y19...s/cathouse.jpg But now its moved to the little deck. Which is better because it stays out of the rain there.

Here is a picture of Ms.Brindle with her orange kittens last spring>
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y19...twokittens.jpg



Another question... Do you think this cat could be the father? http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y19...ats/smokey.jpg He is the only male cat that ive seen around. My mom and i are tryn to figure out how ms.brindle gave birth to orange kittens if the parents are grey.

Thanks.
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post #2 of 16
1/30/10 at 2:04pm
Very big. Being outside and healthy? Nearly a sure thing. Unless she is very dominant - perhaps lesser....

Try with a human trap.

Where do you live? I understand the Pill isnt allowed in US, but in other countries giving them crossed pill with wet food may be an alternative.

No good solution in long run, but may work for buying some time.


ps. Try also to a solution with spaying of this grey male. If he has an owner, talk with the owner.
If not, try to catch him too and get him neutered...
IF it is possible for you.
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post #3 of 16
1/30/10 at 2:12pm
If she is not spayed, she will get pregnant, again and again and again.

If you are having problems trapping her, I would suggest posting a question getting ideas on how to trap a cat. Im sure you will get some great answers.
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post #4 of 16
1/30/10 at 2:13pm
Your girl kitty is known as a dilute tortoise shell pattern. She carries the orange fur gene, so that's where the kittens got it from. It's anyone's guess who the father could be.

Get a humane trap and leave it out where she frequents. Try some sort of stinky canned fish (salmon, mackerel) or if she proves really difficult to lure in - KFC chicken skin.
Once trapped, take her in the trap to the vet and get her spay. It is the only way to stop the kitten cycle. If you want to keep caring for her as an outside cat, so be it.

I also suggest you find somewhere else to stash her food. Keeping it inside her intended shelter won't work because it will attract other cats and animals in there which can put her at a serious risk if another animal wants to fight her for it.
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post #5 of 16
1/30/10 at 6:43pm
If she's not spayed, she WILL get pregnant twice a year, EVERY year, until it kills her or she's spayed. That's how cats are. They breed like rabbits if not fixed. Some rare females only have one litter a year.....but most have 2.
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post #6 of 16
1/31/10 at 4:42am
Like the others said, there are no odds - she's going to get pregnant again, if she's not already.

May I ask what happened to the kittens? If they're still hanging around, the females will be pregnant soon as well. You'll need to trap them as well as their mother.

Torties are good breeders and most seem to be born trap savy. It may take awhile but please make the effort. She'll be a great outside cat and once spayed, will probably keep other cats out of her "territory" (your yard).

Whether the grey cat was the dad - I am not too familiar with cat genetics; someone else may be able to answer. I do know, however, that male cats will travel miles for a female in heat, so the daddy might not be a male living nearby.
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post #7 of 16
1/31/10 at 4:13pm
Thread Starter 
Thank you everyone for your help on these 2 outdoor cats.

*knock on wood* i havent had any problems with the cats fighting for there food inside the house. As a matter of fact...ive only seen 1 or the other go in the house. Not both of them at once. This morning when i went to put food out...smokey(the grey male)was in the house eatting.. So i had to make some noise to get him to leave so i can add more food. The other day i saw Ms.Brindle at the house. They never come together to eat.

The kittens... I took 1 and the other 2 went to the vet to get adopted out. We took them in on Oct.2009. The one orange cat i have..his name is simba. The other 2 orange kitties.. i named them tiger and fuzzball..but who knows that there names are now..since they are new homes. I want to find out how they are doing..

Thank you for telling me about the ms.brindle having the orange gene. But can you explain to me why 2 of the kittens are short hair and one is medium hair... i have not seen a *fuzzy* feral male around here. So why did the kitten come out that way?

Thanks.
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post #8 of 16
1/31/10 at 7:52pm
I don't know about breeding, and you may want to ask your question in the breeder's forum here. I do know that cats can become pregnant by more than one male for each litter. !!!! I suspect the first litter we rescued had three fathers. The mom was dilute gray and orange. The five kittens were two black & white males - one short hair, one longer - kind of medium hair length, one brown,orange and cream tortie-like female with tabby markings (a real runt of the litter, so probably conceived after the others were already), a gray tabby male with brown splotches, and a long-haired orange and white male that was twice the size of all the other kitties (even taking into account his long hair).

...and as the others have pointed out, the odds are... 100%. An unspayed female with unneutered males around will continue to get pregnant again and again - and unlike one of the posters suggested, it can happen more than twice a year.

I don't know where in NY you are, but I can help you search for low-cost spay/neuter places, and if you want ideas on where/how to borrow/rent a trap and trapping tips, just let us know.
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post #9 of 16
1/31/10 at 8:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by LDG View Post
and unlike one of the posters suggested, it can happen more than twice a year.
Well, it can, but that's rare, especially for ferals in temperate climates. A well-cared-for pet cat in a tropical area may have more than 2 litters a year but odds are against it for a feral in NY state. But it could still happen.

My feral mama cat would NOT go in the trap, no matter how hard I tried. She had 2 litters before I finally got her. The thing that worked was putting out a carrier with a rope attached to the door. I put canned food in the carrier and she went right in! I never expected to catch her (I was trying to get her babies) but I'm glad I did. I didn't need more litters to trap.
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post #10 of 16
1/31/10 at 8:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by NyCatgirl View Post

Thank you for telling me about the ms.brindle having the orange gene. But can you explain to me why 2 of the kittens are short hair and one is medium hair... i have not seen a *fuzzy* feral male around here. So why did the kitten come out that way?

Thanks.
The breeders on the board are welcome to correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the gene for short hair is dominant. In other words, if a cat has short hair, he could still carry the gene for long hair. If he mates with a short-haired female who also carries the gene for long hair, then they can have both short-haired and long-haired kittens.

Your kitties are gorgeous, by the way. I love dilute torties!
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post #11 of 16
2/1/10 at 5:06am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Willowy View Post
Well, it can, but that's rare, especially for ferals in temperate climates. A well-cared-for pet cat in a tropical area may have more than 2 litters a year but odds are against it for a feral in NY state. But it could still happen.

My feral mama cat would NOT go in the trap, no matter how hard I tried. She had 2 litters before I finally got her. The thing that worked was putting out a carrier with a rope attached to the door. I put canned food in the carrier and she went right in! I never expected to catch her (I was trying to get her babies) but I'm glad I did. I didn't need more litters to trap.
This is not true. An un spayed feral female will have three or more litters a year. As soon as the kittens begin weaning she will be in heat and ready to quicken again.


I agree with the others on getting a havahart trap and getting her spayed. Find a low cost clinic who handles strays and TNR (trap neuter return) programs.

A female cat can mate with many males and, as I think was already mentioned, every kitten in the litter could have a different father.


Let us know how it goes!

(by the way, if you can get that close with a camera she is probably not truly feral, just a lost or dumped house cat turned stray) It's wonderful of you to care, she is a gorgeous dilute calico, and her red kittens are adorable.
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post #12 of 16
2/1/10 at 5:14am
The blue tom can not be the father of red kittens by the bluecream queen. Two dilute cats can only get dilute kittens.

Like motoko said before, in order to get longhaired kittens the mother must be a longhair carrier and the father must be either a longhair or a shorthaired cat who carries the gene for long hair.
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post #13 of 16
2/1/10 at 9:20am
Hi there,

I agree that you should get this kitty trapped and spayed very soon. You're doing a great job taking care of her - spaying her will really help her out. If you need tips on how to trap, you'll get lots of advice here. Usually you can borrow Havahart traps from an animal shelter with a deposit and hopefully your area has a low cost spay and neuter clinic. Where I live, I was able to borrow a Havahart trap (with a deposit down) and then get kitties spayed for $35. My feral - Patches - was in heat when I got her trapped to get spayed so I was very lucky I got her before she had another litter!!

Patches is a short-haired calico and her 4 babies were very different from each other. 1 was a DSH orange tabby, 1 was DSH all black, 1 was DSH white and black, and 1 was black with a white patch in the chest and way more fuzzy - more of a medium type coat. That led me to believe that there are many male kitties that roamed to breed with Patches - another reason to get the females spayed (as males will travel far to find mates).

Good luck!!!!!
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post #14 of 16
2/2/10 at 3:07pm
Thread Starter 
Thank you everyone for reading my posts and helping me out with this.

Are brindle and tortishell the same? Ive been calling the mom cat Ms.Brindle..since shes a tortishell color..maybe i should call her something else.

I don't know if shes a feral or a stray...but she is a bit scared though. When i see her eatting in the house,then she darts out and runs off.

The other day i saw her coming from the woods...my dog was outside..so i had to get her inside so she could come to the little house and eat some food.

I also have a heated water bowl so they can drink fresh water during these cold months. :o)
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post #15 of 16
2/2/10 at 4:41pm
She doesnt need to be outside, as long as she isnt spayed, she will definitely get pregnant. Have you checked into having her spayed yet? If you need help in finding some low cost programs, you can PM me.
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post #16 of 16
2/2/10 at 7:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by NyCatgirl View Post
Are brindle and tortishell the same?
Tortoiseshell is used for cats. If the cat has white, then it's a calico.
Brindle is used to in dogs and other animals, and I don't think there's any orange coat gene involved - only brown. There's no sex-link for that.
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