Are some of us overzealous in giving advice???  

Well, most of the posts are made by people who are having some kind of trouble with their cats....you don't see a lot of "my kitty is perfect!" threads going around. Because a lot of people only join a cat forum when they're having trouble. So that does kind of skew the results a bit, and makes things look worse than they are.

No, keeping a cat isn't complicated. But there is a lot of wrong information out there, and those of us who have had a lot of cat experience can pass on our knowledge to the new cat owners, and save them the trouble of figuring it out for themselves.

Are you referring to my vet and wait before intros post? Because it's simply common sense. New pets are cute and new, but you don't want to put your other animals at risk. It's irresponsible.
I've also owned other animals, and still do. Experience there is always the same. With reptiles it's suggested 90+ days and not having them even in the same room as each other - much the same with birds and other small exotics. Again, common sense.

As Willowy said, most of us have had some health problems with our pets. No cat has ever came to me 100% healthy.

I see what the OP is talking about, though. I don't think anyone should take this thread personally, but sometimes I do agree that some responses can be a bit..."strongly worded". We have found that advice given nicely and respectfully will yield a better result than advice that's given forcefully. The people coming to this site, and particularly this forum are looking for advice, but maybe do sometimes do get scared off when everyone is piling on, and being less than tactful in the presentation of their advice. Nobody likes to feel like they're being judged as a bad owner (and yes, sometimes that's exactly what's being said).

It's often a case of not "what's being said", but "how it's being said".

Many of the sections of the forum here are much like a newspaper. They don't publish good news or even ordinary events. They publish extraordinary events and unusual happenings.

Same here. When someone has a problem, they ask about it. They rarely ask questions like, "My cat always uses the litter box, he pees normal amount, her poop is completely normal, and he curls up to me and keeps me company with never a worry in the world."

I don't think the OP is saying to never give advice. The issue is how advice is given. I think the point is, and I agree completely, is that sometimes that advice is shoved down the throat rather than offered, often with dire predictions that may or may not be accurate. The idea is to actually help the person and their kitty, and not drive them away by everyone piling on, and getting worked up.

I agree, sometimes we come on too strong and sometimes with unfounded 'facts' as recently mentioned in a declawing thread - it gets to the point where we have this doomed attitude to something that is already done that we turn people away from TCS and they dont learn anything or in other cases, dont read and put the person off by 'go to the vet' without reading that they have been to a vet - it all puts new people off.

I'm relatively new here, but yes, I do agree that some people can come off as...unpleasant. It's not the advice, but the way they give the advice. It isn't even advice anymore when it's, "Do this, this and this, or this, that, and that will happen."

I personally don't want someone else raising my cat for me as if I can't raise him myself. Sometimes the way people say things make us feel like we can't raise our own pets, as if we're inadequate pet owners. It's why I'm hesitant about asking anything after reading several dozen threads. I realize they aren't intentionally saying that, but it comes off as such. A simple, "I think perhaps you could blah blah blah..." would go over better. It's just how you word things.

There's a world's difference between:
1. I think maybe you should get your kitty checked by the vet just to make sure kitty might not be suffering from something serious.
2. Make an appointment with your vet asap. If not, your cat is going to be in some serious pain.

Uhhh... which is friendlier and seems like 'advice'? Instead of a doctor's note?

Also, I noticed that some people will skim the OP's initial post and then comment. So they skip out on facts. Sometimes it seems like they don't read the rest of the thread either before replying with their advice that has been repeated a million and one times already. And a lot of replies consist of, "Go to the vet" when we've already been to the vet or have said we've made an appointment. It really upsets me. It's great to think of the cats we own, but perhaps you should think of the owners a little more as well.

Yup, I agree. There are ways to communicate that a situation may be serious without being overly dramatic about it. Including a bit of calm, rational explanation about why the situation may be serious is helpful to the poster and can mean the difference between understanding and blind panic. They are more likely to react appropriately if they understand.

Some people write emotionally, some write rationally. Some provide explanations, some don't. It's a public board, and obviously a message is better received when presented rationally, not emotionally, but people are free to contribute in their own ways.

Yes, people not reading entire posts is frustrating. I find it somewhat disrespectful, myself.

That said, I do think part of the issue is that people tend to speak from experience, and often when "scare tactics" are used, it is because of something that happened to one of their kitties and they just want someone else to not have that happen. The motivation is from the right place.

I agree but in those cases I say, my cat had the same symptoms and it turned out to be xxx please get your cat checked soon to be sure its not something like my cat had rather than 'go to a vet now or your cat will die'

It is still all in how you present the information

You're right about that!

I will have to agree with some people come across as highly overzealous.

There are people who believe their way is the right way, and it shouldn't be questioned just do it that way..... (health, food, behaviour...)

There are people who give misinformation because thats what they've been taught (not deliberate misinformation)

There are people who don't agree with things, and cannot agree to disagree.

There are people who speak without emotion, which in turn, makes their posts seem harsher.

There are people who are brutally honest.


IMO: I think posts like this are great because it does help people to step back and think about how they may sound......

Advice only helps if it is listened to, which it won't be if its "forced down" a persons throat, or if they are made to believe that they are wrong for doing things their way.

I know my animals are raised differently than a lot of peoples... my reptiles are raised substantially different than the "standard".... That doesn't make me wrong... nor does it make anyone else who does it differently wrong either.

And you are right. Keeping a cat is NOT as complicated as some make it out to be.

This drives me crazy too. I recently read a post where there were box problems. The OP said they'd tried Cat Attract and it didn't work. The second reply suggested using Cat Attract.

The topic of this thread is something that's bugged me for a while. You know the old saying, "You can catch more flies with honey?" I think you can help more cats live in a happy home if you're friendly and helpful rather than accusatory and rude. That's really what people want to do here after all. Shouldn't we do the best we can?

I second the let's "be nice" sentiments. Until and unless we know someone is choosing to be cruel, there's no need to go all rambo on them. So many cat owners already feel bad about past mistakes; to my mind, compassion is far more called for than accusations or condemnations.

I also agree that the "go see your vet" line too often seems to be used in lieu of actually offering helpful advice. Excepting trolls, of course, people who come here seeking advice genuinely care for their cats and are looking for help to make their furbabies lives better. If they're not allowed to get it here, and can't get it through a vet (because they're waiting for an appointment, the vet is stumped, or they can't find one who has any knowledge about the subject, etc.), they're left with few resources and a bad taste for the forum. Yes, definitely, vets are wonderful resources! But so are many of the people here - let's make offering opinions easier (even when they are differing opinions!).

And in line with that, I'd like to add yet another thought to this thread.... Can we please stop turning every request for help into a competition about who's advice is more "expert"? This doesn't help the people in need and is another turn-off for visiting members. I, personally, am weary of the character attacks. It is solely due to the encouragement and support of other TCS members that I am still here to share any advice at all.

I like to think of TCS as a place of support and encouragement, as well as a venue for sharing with people who are as passionate about their cats as I am. Can we perhaps use this discussion as an opportunity to make TCS a more safe and supportive environment for everyone, posters and responders alike?

I agree that sometimes we tend to get over-zealous - I know I do but I tend to do it more when a poster comes looking for vet advice instead of taking their cat to a vet because they either cannot afford it or do not want to spend the money. And I do it again when everyone has given good advice and the person says, well thanks anyway but I won't be doing that (not in those words but you can tell they didn't want to hear the advice given and aren't going to act on it anyway). As for whose advice is best, it's more of a question of whose advice is correct and not heresay and/or misinformation or incomplete information. Sometimes when someone offers blatantly bad or wrong information, it is very, very important to correct that information in the thread in a way that the OP will not act on that misinformation and do harm to their pet. And if emphasizing that the information is erroneous seems too over-zealous, so be it.

I agree some information needs to be dealt with in a better way such as things like if your cat doesn't eat for 24 hours it will die of liver failure - nonsense! Bijou was lost for 4 days and hiding under a bush in a back yard so I'm pretty sure he didn't eat for 4 days and he was fine. We need to not use scare tactics but we also need to stress the importance of certain things to new people coming to the forum.

Being all rainbows and lollipops is fine to a degree but the information offered needs to be taken seriously at times and it needs to be delivered in a manner that the poster will sit up and take notice.

Well, I don't know if anyone is referring to me. I tend to write very long and often detailed posts. But I am not aware of enging in "whos the better expert" competition, and if it comes across that way, I'm sorry. I simply try to provide advice I would like to receive.

I doubt there would be any problem with your posts Laurie. Your posts are detailed but accurate and backed up by research which you link. Your experience and knowledge here are well known to most of us and your delivery is always polite and gentle and greatly respected.

I agree with you guys, maybe we need to run some sort of campaign, maybe sigs with some sort of cute slogan? Or avatar?

I think alot of people do this without realizing, also things get misinterpreted...

Throwing in my 2c here because I'm "super-new," being totally new to both this site, and to cat ownership in general (2 months and counting into this new adventure!), and therefore one of the completely clueless types who might pop up with silly questions from time to time. :P So thought my opinion might help put this in perspective!

I don't know what I'd do without TCS. My Sophie came to me totally out of the blue, crying on the porch of an abandoned house, and while I'd had no plans to get a cat any time soon (and had never had one before), she was mine the instant I laid eyes on her. I am so head-over-heels in love with her that I want to know every little thing I can. NOTHING beats actual real-life experience for that, and the second I found this site, after frantically googling "kitten care" the first day I had Sophie at home, it became my Kitten-Raising Bible. I would choose you ladies and gents over some "article from the experts" any day. I mostly lurk here, because 99% of my questions are answered just by skimming the boards!

That being said, I have seen ONE post here (out of the hundreds I've read, not a bad record!) where a single replier went too far and actually insulted the person asking the question (and then replied a second time and made it worse!). That one post has stayed with me, only because it stands in such a contrast to the usual attitudes here, and in that case, may have had a negative impact on the questioner's choices. I think this might be the kind of thing the OP is talking about, and this is why I'm seconding the sentiment. I can't speak for people who might be a little more sensitive/touchy (I tend to have a thick skin!), but I think that as long as the tone is not condescending or insulting (mostly not insulting - I don't mind being put in my place by someone more knowledgeable as long as it's done "gently"!), you guys are fine.

So, just had to throw that in there, because you all deserve huge thanks for the time you put into educating all us "kitty newbies." As long as the tone isn't outright rude or an obvious put-down to the person asking the question, I believe you'll end up with mostly positive reactions.

The timing had me very suspicious...

Since I started the "competing experts" topic... Absolutely not, LDG. I love reading your posts, specifically because you don't just make bald statements and walk away; you give me information from which I can learn. Offhand, I can't recall you contradicting me or anyone else, but I have no doubt at all you'd do it in respectful manner. (In fact, that's probably why nothing comes to mind!)

I'm a long time member of this site and I've seen the negative posts that the OP referred to. I think what prompts them are usually a couple of things: the responder simply lacks experience and is highly opinionated, the OP really doesn't want advise but is looking to rationalize their choices (and gets slammed for it), and sometimes a responder is simply tired and doesn't think thru their response.

It is everyone's responsibility to take anything we read on the internet and apply it to our unique situations. There are people that post here that I know well enough to trust their judgement completely. Once people are around for a while, they identify these people and learn to trust them. But when advice is offered, particularly to a new member, by someone who lacks experience and is strongly opinionated, it is the mods / advisers role to intervene and try to set the facts straight. I think this is why Laurie questioned herself about her own advice (my mind did the same thing).

I honestly believe that what starts the worst of these threads are the ones where people simply want to justify their choices, and really don't want anyone's opinion, they just want people to agree with them. And people here accommodate them. Trust me when I say that I have to lift my hands from the keyboard and walk away from some of these threads. But many people don't.

But as a whole, those threads a few and far between compared to the outstanding topics that come across this board. My advise is that if you don't like the way a thread is going, simply walk away.

I've been wondering something for a while. What happens when it's the mods that are doing it or attacking people? There was a recent post that was quite bad and the OP was obviously offended. Anytime there's a declaw related thread everyone, even mods, gain up because of the strong feelings everyone one has on the subject - yet this is allowed to happen over and over again.

Indeed.....a very very good question.

I am going to take a stab at this... Mods are under the same rules as all of us on here ( ie for those who forgot check the link under every reply box) ... If you feel someone singled you out use the exclamation point and signal who ever is on duty ... OR and likely a better option use a PM to that person and see if it is a mis communication issue( yeah I know all of us are perfect )

But, and maybe I'm not the only one concerned about this - What if reporting a mod or PMing them turns the person spiteful - that they take it out on the person later whenever possible. It's a common human fault not to let stuff go, to repeatedly dig at another person or outright make things difficult. When someone has some power in a social situation like a forum it can turn ugly - I know I'm not the only one to have witnessed that before due to stories others have shared.

Is anyone else ignoring stuff/refusing to speak up due to a mod or a popular member being involved?

I am pretty sure this is directed at me, so I am using my right to respond...
Well, yes, he was fine and I am glad, however HL is no nonsense and in an obese cat can take place in a few days if not in a couple of days (it has been cases of compete anorexia in 24h onset BTW in obese cats). In a Skinny, or healthy weight cat, like Bijou, it can take a few WEEKS -FYI. It is Very very very serious, and in many cases Lethal... So when a member comes here saying that my cat hans't eaten since Thursday and it is now Sunday.... Sorry to bother whoever it is bothering, BUT I AM going to bring up the HL issue because it IS true, AND I have seen it happening right here in the site...
I saw a very long thread where I told this person over and over again to feed his little girl, and unfortunately he preferred to listen to the people who was as you call "lollipopping" him. Feeding his cat was at the time the easiest at hand thing he could have done... Guess what -next thing I read, his cat had Hepatic Lipidosis. That HURTS. All It would taken was to feed that cat.
So yes, it is not non sense and there is plenty, plenty plenty of research about it EVERYWHERE.
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Now going back to the topic...

I think that what happens is that sometimes we read so many threads and respond to so many of them, that we want to get right to the point.
We don't think about the OP as a pet parent, we think about someone who came here for an answer, and we objectively give an answer.
I also think that the person reading can do a little searching before posting, perhaps?
Like litter for example - this is a cat forum... search litter before posting...
And... Also I think the same way we can write a little nicer, the reader can also read the answers for what they are, and not take them personally, because they ARE NOT personal, since we don't know you, especially when it comes to a new member.
When it comes to an old member, we get used to it - sometimes one word will do it- question, answer... we get to know each others' style, and so on...

I am seeing a lot of things in this thread...
One - the vet issue: I agree - we do send the person to the vet, but I agree we do need to, and that we are right to do so...
One thing that I learned from TCS that I didn't know before, is that Cats are notorious for hiding pain, and when they show symptoms, generally means the situation is not so good anymore.
Also, things like a kitten sneezing for example - you might think you are saving $35-40 by not taking the kitten to the vet, but in a couple of weeks that can result (I said can, and not will) in a large bill for a kitten with pneumonia that you can't pay, and you watch your beloved kitten die...
If your male cat is peeing outside of the box and we tell you to go to the vet during the day time and you don't.... All of the sudden it is 3 am and you are frantically here looking for help because you think your cat is blocked and you don't have the money to take him to the ER... Next day he needs to have surgery, stay in the hospital, yadda yadda...
So, that is why we do say go to the vet... In my opinion, at least, for all that's worth. Things can go wrong with a cat, and fast.

Of course your cat can be completely fine.... but there is a chance that the worst can happen too, and we here, being away, with no credentials... really, how much can we help?

All we can do is share experiences, and hope that that helps someone.... But as Yosemite said, there are a lot of people who come here instead of a vet, and we can't accommodate those people, because we might do more harm than good... There are no vets or credentials in here.

And one last thing we do welcome you new members and your kitties nad please please please never feel afraid of asking questions - it is NOT personal!!

If it is not made known to someone , If you are not comfortable with the Mods or Directly approaching the person via pm I would suggest contacting Anne or one of the "Super Mods". Ignoring will definitely not make an issue go away