Enabling - Page 2

People suffer low self-esteem for a reason. It's instilled in them from a young age or through being bullied or constantly being put down. Abused women/men are a prime example of being put/knocked down, to a point where they have no self-worth.

For starters (IMO), we can analyze how often it happens - Then ask ourselves if they seem perennially stuck in their ways and/or get defensive/hostile to hearing advice that's not in-step with their unchanging ways. You can also ask "What progress have they made? How long did it take them?" In the case of B, he claims he does not go out to bars to drink anymore like he did 10 years ago, but he still drinks daily at home. He said the last time he went to a bar, he only had 1 drink (versus 8-10 drinks!) and he said he was proud of himself. I said "I'm proud you did that too sweety." (and I meant it, assuming he was telling me the truth)

Speaking only for myself (IMO), I would say if he/she is abusing your empathy as a weekly or daily "crutch", and you don't put your foot down, then that's enabling.

I hope this doesn't come off as too cold.

Ask any of my friends who know me very well, i'll be there for anyone who's having a rough time, but when it becomes too often with that person i take a step back because i find they start to drag you down with them.

Someone i worked with at my old place was known as a constant moaner and complainer, and it got to the point where i would pick up the telephone and pretend i was on a call if he came into my office just so i didn't have to hear him.....Terrible of me?, to some it will be but when it's week after week it gets too much

A friend who ruined so many weekends for me due to her moaning and crying over her boyfriend has lost me as a friend. She would ask for my opinion and when i gave it she didn't like it. two kids later and now on her own because he'd also had enough she can see now where she went wrong, but too late was the cry.

Personally, I don't really see the connection between the question about enabling a chronic complainer and helping your roommate. Perhaps I just don't have the full story or the background right, but I don't get the connection between not having the confidence to do things and complaining. Maybe it's just a lack of experience on my part. I've known and been friend with someone with low self-esteem, but to my knowledge I haven't known a chronic complainer.

To friends with self-esteem issues, I've always been encouraging - but there are times for empathy and there are times for a good kick in the patoot.

I have known people where everything not good that happens is someone else's fault. Those people were never friends, because I'm not drawn to that kind of person, and fortunately we have none in the family.

...and just as it has been pointed out there's a big distinction between enabling and encouraging, I think there's a big distinction between complaining and venting. While venting may sound like complaining, I think the semantics is important when discussing issues like this. I did have a friend that "complained" a lot (we are no longer friends but that has nothing to do with this issue). But she didn't blame other people for things and she didn't have self-esteem issues. She was a very passionate person, and stuff got under her skin very easily. I offer a willing ear in such a situation.

So in answer to your question, I wouldn't even be in a position to offer platitudes to a chronic complainer, because that person wouldn't be a friend. But I would offer support and encouragement to a friend with low self-esteem problems - sometimes empathetic and other times motivational in my approach/communication. I'd be a willing ear and sympathetic to someone who needs to vent.

....now if you're talking about online issues, I believe that as Karen pointed out, there's no way to know the back story, so if it struck me as something I can relate to when it comes to venting, I'd probably say "that sucks!" ...otherwise I'd leave well enough alone. If someone were to repeatedly post here at TCS, for instance, only complaints, just like in "real" life I wouldn't be friends with that person, I'm sure I'd ignore them. I see no benefit to providing either platitudes or trying to "make them a better person" by calling them out on their issue. If it were someone who seemed to complain a lot, but offered support and encouragement to others, I'm pretty sure I'd be sympathetic without needing to judge.

As to someone who complains a lot? I see nothing wrong in just complaining. Not everyone is born into a "half glass full" kind of world. There's a reason there's a label, a "gloomy Gus." I've got no problem with providing platitudes to someone like that. ...or just ignoring them.

People who moan all the time really just p*** me off - I don't have the patience for them and I will just tell them straight out. I am not very nice that way, but life is too short to be complaining about these things - there are people worse off.

I understand if something truly horrible happened to someone, I am sympathetic, but there are those that are "emotional vampires" and just drain the happiness out of others by their complaining and usually its those that complain about others that make me angry. Simply - if it has nothing to do with you, don't say anything. Just shut up and get on with your life.

Sorry if I seem cold and heartless but I prefer to save my energy for those who actually do deserve the sympathy.

You're fortunate - as am I - to have none in your family.

I'm not sure I really believe in enablers. The people I've known who were busy with self-destruction weren't really affected by other people at all. If someone wouldn't act/react the way the self-destructive person wants, she or he would just find other people who would.

By complainers if you mean negative people, they don't listen to anybody, either. If someone is complaining, they are talking and they are not listening. I doubt if my responses ever had an effect, either way. *shrug*

Thats probably true.

Exactly Kellye, and weve all been in a horrible situation with something.

Lifes too short to moan and complain over non serious matters

I have this friend that I worked with - she is SO direct - if people moaned or gossiped about other people at work, she will tell them straight out that she doesn't stand for that - I love her! People at work didn't like her because of her directness but I just absolutely loved her - its so hard to find someone who is as blunt/honest as she was.

Most of you know about the family deaths we had in such a short space of time, and i remember a few of you asking how did i do it, as in carrying on as normal?.

I always say you can go down 2 paths in life, the path where you wallow in self pity until it gets you so depressed that it makes it harder to get back to a normal life, or the other path where you grieve but you take each day at a time but live your life as normal as you can, and eventually you can see a light at the end of it.

Well said Susan!

My best friend is like that. I am no longer friends with her. I tried to give her advice, but she never took any of it. When she came over, she would always complain. I told her what her options were and to do something about it. She is in the situation she is in because of her choices and I explained that to her. That she was the only one that could help herself. I finally got tired of her controlling, selfish and childish behavior that I told her I was done with her in hopes that she would learn some lessons on her own.

I saw her last night for the first time in 4 months and she still is angry and has not learned any lessons. I was very nice to her, acknowleded her and asked what she was having done. I even said good bye to her when I left, which she was not very friendly in return. I was very disappointed, but not surprised. She did not look very happy and she does wallow in self-pity. I do not feel sorry for her. I also think she was jealous that I was happy despite not having her as a friend. She once accused me of being negative, which I was, but I have made so many changes to include removing toxic people such as her out of my life. I have realized that you are the only one that can make yourself happy and if you don't like your life you have to do something about it. She should take her own advice because she has been nothing but negative since she has gotten here. I didn't realize how much she was dragging me down along with her pathetic bf.

I never gave her any platitudes because I knew she could do better, but she does not apply herself. I hope that one day she will grow up and realize the world does not revolve around her.

That is pretty much how I handle people at work. When someone starts to complain about something, I start the conversation with "would you like me to do something about it, or are you just venting?", and if the answer is no, I'm just venting, then I ask them what they are doing about it. The true complainers have learned to stay away from me because I offer no sympathy. But I also have the reputation of being one of the best "listeners" on the team.

My FIL was the ultimate chronic complainer. I'm not sure that he could get thru 5 minutes of a day without complaining about something. When DH is in a funk, he gets just like his father. What I've found over many years of marriage is that you have to find a way to weed out the venting from true complaints. It's not an easy thing to do. Chronic complaining is always a sign of some underlying discontent, and if I spend time with a person dealing with their problems, it's to find the cause that is triggering the need to complain, rather than the complaint itself.

my my. if he's married or with someone i feel sorry for that person! next time he gets negative on the phone with you you needn't say you're going to bathe the cats,just say "y'know what, i'm hanging up because you're going into WC mode"

"what's WC mode?"

"whining & complaining" click

If my Uncle were still alive I'd introduce you! Sweetest, kindest man you could ever know. But man! Could he complain!!!

It took me years to learn that when you said "Hi Uncle! How are you?" that it resulted in a 2 hour rant about his various illnesses/aches/pains etc. Complaints about the neighours upstairs, across the hall, on another floor etc. And anything else that put a bee into his bonnet. He barely stopped to take a breath!

Eventually I learned to say "Hi Uncle! You're looking great today!" and then quickly turned the subject to something else.

I remember when I was a student nurse I did my practicum on a hospital ward that he was a patient on. None of the nurses knew that he was my Uncle. We had the same last name but they hadn't yet found out my last name. On my first day while we were sitting waiting for report to start, several of the nurses in the room went on and on and on about what a difficult person my Uncle was and about how he always complained about everything and nothing. I didn't say a thing. It was the manager that came in and spoke up and pointed out that I was his niece. That made for a rather uncomfortable moment for the other nurses. However, I completely understood what they were saying and decided to let them vent it out with each other, because he could be very exasperating!

Remember the PM's I sent you a couple of years ago? Lord, I got close!


Honestly, in my life, I have been at both ends. I really believe certain people are wired differently (whether from their upbringing, genetics, or life lessons). Some will see the glass half full and some will always see the glass half empty, and others drink until it's half full.

And some, have a daily battle on pushing the negative away and hanging on with dear life for any positive.

In my experience/life? I never really spend much time around those who are always on the half empty bandwagon. They can really suck the energy out of you. I usually listen for awhile, then give some basic advice. But, if they come back week after week, month after month, not progressing forward at all, and bringing the same problems/complains with them then I usually back off. If I have listened, given some words to help them and they don't move, then I can't do anything more for them.

I'm always trying to balance. I've had enough issues the last 8 months to send me off balance but I am fully aware of how selfish I sound when I start talking about my issues. There is always someone out there who is worse off than me and each day I look to the positive to keep my path straight.

BUT, I do have bad days. And many of you know me when I'm riding the pity rollercoaster.

As I get older, I'm realizing how much my energy has an effect on those who are around me and that's why I now pay more attention on the energy I cast off and the daily words I use.
Every action has a reaction.

I'm just trying, on a daily basis, to be more of a positive influence rather than a negative one. To live the healthiest life possible for me - through words and actions.

Very well said, Susan!


Very true. I've noticed many people throughout my work life that need to complain at work because they are not being listened to in their home environments. But, I didn't come to that realization until I actually listened.

For better or worse I disconnect with the continual complainers. I can still talk and say comments, but not really be there. I do feel sorry for them though, life is too short to spend that way. Many I feel have underlying issues, mental issues, and really need some help and coaching by a dedicated professional.
Life is very hard for many people. Life is very good for many people. Those same people might be in the exact same situations too, it is all perspective. And a multitude of other things.
It boils down to this:
I can't handle a lot of negativity and drama, it is very draining for me. And life is too short.

I honestly have to work at it in order to not be a complainer and an overall negative person.

I suffer from depression and on top of that I have MS which means constant pain, mind numbing fatigue, and a host of other real fun stuff that I deal with on a daily basis. It's SO easy to focus on the negative! It takes work to focus on what positive things are happening in my life.

One of the big wake up calls I had was when I was complaining, again, about my boyfriend (who I later married, so I did love him a lot ), and one of my friends asked "So why are you still with him?" Kind of set me back on my haunches and made me realize that I really never talked about him in a good way. I was always complaining about him, not talking about the reasons I did love him.

And even though I hadn't learned my lesson about it, I was doing the same "hard love" to him. He had a rough childhood - stuff no child should have to go through. When I met him everything that ever went wrong was because of that. Because his father was a jerk (family site ). If he lost a job, that was the reason. He didn't communicate well in our relationship, that was the reason. Seriously if it was bad it was his father's fault. So I basically told him that I was real sorry for what happened to him in the past, but today is his. It is up to him to succeed or fail and it is nobody's success or failure but his. His life is no longer controlled by his father.

Both of us have worked hard to be where we are today. He's moved past the excuses, I've moved past being always negative. It takes time and a lot of work. Sometimes it takes one person whose opinion they care about making the right comment. That's it.

So do I mollycoddle them? Not on your life!