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Trapping for 2nd time?
- Thread starter killerapple
- Start Date
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #122
Not much to report on Patches. But I wanted to run an idea by you all.
Right now she has a few hiding areas from me and one is a box that very much hides her completely - it's a deep box that is not very tall, but she can crawl all the way into the back and hide. I am thinking this box is not being helpful... I was going to remove it from the room and just keep her more open box (which she still can hide in, but I can make myself sit near that) and the cat carrier and the little plush cube. My thought was that maybe if she's in these more open areas, it'll help things.
Or is that a bad idea?
I know I can be spending more time in there too to speed things up but I'm doing the best I can - just need to figure out other times to work time in there with her.
My husband thinks I need to try harder and be more forward with the socialization - but then he also understands he has no clue about it. But maybe he's right that I need to be more forward (which is why I think I should remove that one box).
Batman brought another toy to her door today. It's really cute!
Right now she has a few hiding areas from me and one is a box that very much hides her completely - it's a deep box that is not very tall, but she can crawl all the way into the back and hide. I am thinking this box is not being helpful... I was going to remove it from the room and just keep her more open box (which she still can hide in, but I can make myself sit near that) and the cat carrier and the little plush cube. My thought was that maybe if she's in these more open areas, it'll help things.
Or is that a bad idea?
I know I can be spending more time in there too to speed things up but I'm doing the best I can - just need to figure out other times to work time in there with her.
My husband thinks I need to try harder and be more forward with the socialization - but then he also understands he has no clue about it. But maybe he's right that I need to be more forward (which is why I think I should remove that one box).
Batman brought another toy to her door today. It's really cute!
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #123
I've been in Patches' room for the past 2 hours. I kept the light off this time (yeah... basically in the dark on the computer, aside from some night lights). I put treats in her box like usual. About 15 minutes ago, I heard her eat them!!!! So... she actually ate with me in the room! That said, she's not visible to me and vice versa... but I think that's a good thing!
It's really dark in here... so I'm not sure if she's taken a peak at me, but it's good she ate the treats with me here. Usually she waits until I'm gone!
It's really dark in here... so I'm not sure if she's taken a peak at me, but it's good she ate the treats with me here. Usually she waits until I'm gone!
Honestly you could probably remove that big box a long as shes not in it at the time.
I've found the dark helped me with EG. He always seemed more comfy at night in the dark... Perhaps you can start making a calling noise (do you have one?) when you do it put some treats down on the floor and walk away from it. It will teach that you want her to go to the spot where you made the noise. Once she gets the hang of it start moving less and less away from it until the treats are right beside you. Again don't look at her or make moves when she approaches at first. Then look sideways hold the treats out with your hand and put them down. Eventually you can do it with an open hand. If you can get her to headbutt your hand she will get used to petting as well. You can put the treats down and leave your hand stationary, let her sniff. If she headbutts you then give her one gentle pet. Be sure to not move your hand when she is headbutting you, pet her after. Eventually you should be able to get her to come to you with a hand with no treats as the come hither for petting. This is how I eventually taught EG to come to me, that and I used Isabell as an example too.
Maybe it will help. I enjoy reading updates on dear Patches, even if I don't always reply. It's been cool to hear her story.
I've found the dark helped me with EG. He always seemed more comfy at night in the dark... Perhaps you can start making a calling noise (do you have one?) when you do it put some treats down on the floor and walk away from it. It will teach that you want her to go to the spot where you made the noise. Once she gets the hang of it start moving less and less away from it until the treats are right beside you. Again don't look at her or make moves when she approaches at first. Then look sideways hold the treats out with your hand and put them down. Eventually you can do it with an open hand. If you can get her to headbutt your hand she will get used to petting as well. You can put the treats down and leave your hand stationary, let her sniff. If she headbutts you then give her one gentle pet. Be sure to not move your hand when she is headbutting you, pet her after. Eventually you should be able to get her to come to you with a hand with no treats as the come hither for petting. This is how I eventually taught EG to come to me, that and I used Isabell as an example too.
Maybe it will help. I enjoy reading updates on dear Patches, even if I don't always reply. It's been cool to hear her story.
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #125
Aw thanks! Glad you are enjoying reading about Patches!
Yeah, I think I need to remove this one box in particular.. it can't be helping. I just have to wait until she gets out of it. She generally rotates between boxes every few days.
When she was outside, I could lure her close to me with a trail of dry food. It'll be a while before I can do that with her inside, but you're totally right - eventually I'll be able to do that with her inside. Even if it means waiting 90 minutes for her to go for the treat
Once I get that hidey box out, I'll see if she goes for the treats with me being visible to her (but not too close). She hasn't yet, but I think lights off variable may be helping. Thanks for your advice!!
Yeah, I think I need to remove this one box in particular.. it can't be helping. I just have to wait until she gets out of it. She generally rotates between boxes every few days.
When she was outside, I could lure her close to me with a trail of dry food. It'll be a while before I can do that with her inside, but you're totally right - eventually I'll be able to do that with her inside. Even if it means waiting 90 minutes for her to go for the treat
It was easy/hard with EG because he lived in my bedroom when we first got him. So I was always with him once I came home from school (I was 12 at the time..). The trail of treats didn't work with him because it was too much movement. Remember EG is my traumatized kitty, he is afraid of humans and sudden movements even to this day, 12 years later. So this is what I did instead.
Also sometimes you have to take away the hiding spot. It can be a crutch. Another thing I had to do with EG was take my bed off its stand. For the first 3 months he rarely ever came out. After 3 month I decided that was enough of that when we took him to the vet for a check up he came back home with my bed on the floor so he couldn't hide under it. Of course he had other hiding areas like the closest, behind my mirror, etc. That seemed to be a turning point in his socialization. EG was introduced to Isabell after 6 months, because that was when we felt he was big enough. Isabell is very territorial of a cat we feared if we allowed her access to the 4 week old kitten she would kill it. By then he trusted me enough to come to my hand for pets as well but still wary. EG's trust amplified when I defended him from Isabell by seperating their fights. Of course when we got EG, she was pissed cause she wasn't allowed on my bed anymore. But I always sat down with her and played with her everyday. After about 9 months we stopped separating them at night because Isabell got the idea that EG wasn't going anywhere. She was no longer picking fights, only warning him to not come close to her. It was a hard about 2 years before EG and Isabell tolerated each other. Now they are good friends, not lovey-dovey but good friends. They play together and such.
With Batman and Patches it seems that Batman is less of a bully then Isabell is so it should be easier. Isabell doesn't get along with other cats. Even though she didn't want another kitty living in her space she was dreadfully lonely and craved other feline contact. She wasn't allowed to go outside anymore so we had to hunker down on this idea.
Also sometimes you have to take away the hiding spot. It can be a crutch. Another thing I had to do with EG was take my bed off its stand. For the first 3 months he rarely ever came out. After 3 month I decided that was enough of that when we took him to the vet for a check up he came back home with my bed on the floor so he couldn't hide under it. Of course he had other hiding areas like the closest, behind my mirror, etc. That seemed to be a turning point in his socialization. EG was introduced to Isabell after 6 months, because that was when we felt he was big enough. Isabell is very territorial of a cat we feared if we allowed her access to the 4 week old kitten she would kill it. By then he trusted me enough to come to my hand for pets as well but still wary. EG's trust amplified when I defended him from Isabell by seperating their fights. Of course when we got EG, she was pissed cause she wasn't allowed on my bed anymore. But I always sat down with her and played with her everyday. After about 9 months we stopped separating them at night because Isabell got the idea that EG wasn't going anywhere. She was no longer picking fights, only warning him to not come close to her. It was a hard about 2 years before EG and Isabell tolerated each other. Now they are good friends, not lovey-dovey but good friends. They play together and such.
With Batman and Patches it seems that Batman is less of a bully then Isabell is so it should be easier. Isabell doesn't get along with other cats. Even though she didn't want another kitty living in her space she was dreadfully lonely and craved other feline contact. She wasn't allowed to go outside anymore so we had to hunker down on this idea.
That's brilliant! Never used the "in the dark" idea, but I'm so glad she ate while you were in there!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sweetie, you are truly an angel.
Your patience is amazing, and you are SUCH a love for doing what you are for Patches! It IS going to be worth it!!!!!!
Sweetie, you are truly an angel.
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #128
Thanks everyone!
Gosh, I wish she would stop hiding out in that box. I can't remove it until she does and that's her claimed safety spot now. I may have to do a surprise visit when she's not expecting so she's possibly somewhere else in the room and then doesn't go into it... I do think that one low box is hindering the process.
So I've been in there on the floor, with no lights on, the past few nights for a couple hours. Aside from that first time where she ate the treats 90 minutes into it, she hasn't since! Go figure. She's just letting me know that this will be a slow process.
It'll be interesting for Batman. When we first had him, we thought he had to be an "only cat" because he didn't open up to us until his brothers got adopted. But he's changed so much - I doubt he would regress on us. Hard to predict how accepting he will be of another cat, but I'll just do that slow and steady when it's time. (I have a feeling after his initial 'who are you?' with her, he will probably want to play and she will probably get frustrated.) If all goes well, we will be putting in a door/screen door to that room after her 2nd combo test comes out ok in a few weeks.
Getting her to the vet sure will be interesting again... I'll clean out that carrier with bleach and spray with Feliway and... hope for the best. She has a good memory though so I'm sure she associated that carrier with the vet.
Well, she's just going to have to get used to me in the room with her.
This is probably gross to non cat lovers, but how she covers up her pee/poop makes me giggle every time. I guess it's because she was a feral kitty. Patches makes the most GIGANTIC covered litter mounds ever. Let's say she pees. She covers up that pee so darn good - there's this huge mountain of litter in her box where she carefully covered it all up. It cracks me up.
I guess that is a benefit of getting a feral - they are so darned determined to hide their scent. Some friends of mine had cats that never cover their poop in the box. Don't think I'll ever have to worry about that with Patches.
That said I understand issues may come up when the cats are introduced but I'm hoping not
but if it does, we'll deal.
We'll see how the next few weeks go! If not, then probably nothing exciting until her combo test comes back fine and then we get that screen door on. Which is kind of scary - what if she bolts out when we're putting up the door? I figure we'll put Batman in the bathroom when we put up the door and hopefully the noise will scare Patches so much that she just hides in her box and doesn't try to run out the room... Ah well, we'll get to that bridge when we have to.
Gosh, I wish she would stop hiding out in that box. I can't remove it until she does and that's her claimed safety spot now. I may have to do a surprise visit when she's not expecting so she's possibly somewhere else in the room and then doesn't go into it... I do think that one low box is hindering the process.
So I've been in there on the floor, with no lights on, the past few nights for a couple hours. Aside from that first time where she ate the treats 90 minutes into it, she hasn't since! Go figure. She's just letting me know that this will be a slow process.
It'll be interesting for Batman. When we first had him, we thought he had to be an "only cat" because he didn't open up to us until his brothers got adopted. But he's changed so much - I doubt he would regress on us. Hard to predict how accepting he will be of another cat, but I'll just do that slow and steady when it's time. (I have a feeling after his initial 'who are you?' with her, he will probably want to play and she will probably get frustrated.) If all goes well, we will be putting in a door/screen door to that room after her 2nd combo test comes out ok in a few weeks.
Well, she's just going to have to get used to me in the room with her.
This is probably gross to non cat lovers, but how she covers up her pee/poop makes me giggle every time. I guess it's because she was a feral kitty. Patches makes the most GIGANTIC covered litter mounds ever. Let's say she pees. She covers up that pee so darn good - there's this huge mountain of litter in her box where she carefully covered it all up. It cracks me up.
We'll see how the next few weeks go! If not, then probably nothing exciting until her combo test comes back fine and then we get that screen door on. Which is kind of scary - what if she bolts out when we're putting up the door? I figure we'll put Batman in the bathroom when we put up the door and hopefully the noise will scare Patches so much that she just hides in her box and doesn't try to run out the room... Ah well, we'll get to that bridge when we have to.
When putting up the door close as many doors as possible. Especially to the bedrooms. It's hellish getting a feral out from under beds! If it does happen though, nothing works quite well like a soft broom. (Don't touch her just slowly push it at her.. it should be scary enough that she'll run out.)
Just close as many doors as possible to minimize where she can go if she does bolt. That will be interesting with the screen door. You'll be able to play with Batman with Patches watching.
For getting her to the vet!
Just close as many doors as possible to minimize where she can go if she does bolt. That will be interesting with the screen door. You'll be able to play with Batman with Patches watching.
For getting her to the vet!
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #130
I realized I could have my husband install the door when I'm at the vet!!!
Hopefully all goes smooth. That's 3 weeks away... time is flying by!
She has NOT left this particular box!! Well, I hear her exploring about but every time I come in now, she's hiding out in there. I think she realized it's a much better hiding spot than the others. Hoping she gets out of it soon so I can remove it.. It can't be helping.
Batman has been really obsessed with her room - shoving his paws under the door. His eyes get all wide, but he hasn't fluffed up yet. It'll be interesting.
Sorry nothing to report! I sat closer to her box last night and she did eventually start closing her eyes to nap.
One day at a time
I just wish there was more progress - it's been kind of at a standstill, but I think it'll get better once she's not in that box and then when she can interact with Batman. (But my husband is worried she'll just hide and Batman will climb the screen door - we'll see!)
She has NOT left this particular box!! Well, I hear her exploring about but every time I come in now, she's hiding out in there. I think she realized it's a much better hiding spot than the others. Hoping she gets out of it soon so I can remove it.. It can't be helping.
Batman has been really obsessed with her room - shoving his paws under the door. His eyes get all wide, but he hasn't fluffed up yet. It'll be interesting.
Sorry nothing to report! I sat closer to her box last night and she did eventually start closing her eyes to nap.
One day at a time
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #131
Patches finally is done hiding in that box!!!
Now she's back to the bigger box in corner of room that is much easier for me to sit near her (at an angle) so she can watch me.
WHEW! So the other box is getting removed...
This will leave Patches with her big box, her crate, and her insulated cube thing. So 1 less hidey space, but that box was too deep and not tall enough.. it was letting her be more timid than necessary, I think.
I'll try to get a picture of the room layout later this week.
Anyways.. that's it for now!
Now she's back to the bigger box in corner of room that is much easier for me to sit near her (at an angle) so she can watch me.
WHEW! So the other box is getting removed...
This will leave Patches with her big box, her crate, and her insulated cube thing. So 1 less hidey space, but that box was too deep and not tall enough.. it was letting her be more timid than necessary, I think.
I'll try to get a picture of the room layout later this week.
Anyways.. that's it for now!
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #132
She's asleep already, with her little head flat on the blanket in the box. Looks so cute.
My loud typing on my laptop isn't bothering her. I'm sitting about 6 feet away, facing 90 away from her (so she is facing my side).
Finally I got through reading your thread! Patches is just gorgeous. We have never had a calico but I heard they have very unique personalities
Do you have any idea how old she is?
Marina
Marina
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #135
Laurie - Aw thanks!
She just seemed special. I wouldn't have tried doing this if she wasn't progressing outside but it felt like the right thing to do.
It was also hard to see Batman's mama outside and then hearing/seeing some of the crazy drivers on our street.
She's my cute little furry project.
The whole thing has been good for me - finding the kittens in June, to networking to find someone to socialize the 4th kitten later, to now working with Patches. The kittens were more exhausting than her because I was spending much more time with them since it was a race against time - whew! But they were so dang cute - no complaints.
Marina - You read the whole novella!!
I'm enjoying reading about your progress too! Patches was estimated to be 2-3 years old - probably closer to 3. We don't know what her kittenhood was like but she was first spotted in the neighborhood a couple years ago and was fed off and on by people (and had a couple litters) before we even saw her! (Didn't see her until she moved her kittens to our yard! We got the kittens inside and started feeding her, TNRed her, then started trying to gain her trust outside - that's how this all began.)
So this morning she was in her little cube when I went in to do morning chores. That cube probably doesn't feel as safe to her as her boxes. She nervously poked her head out to watch me, then when I was in other side of room, she crawled out - super low to floor - then froze. A couple minutes later, she scuttled to her box. That's the first time I've seen her move in weeks! (We hear her moving at night, but just don't see it.) So even though that moving was probably because she felt too exposed in that box, it's good she was able to move with me being in the room - and not have me eat her.
Batman tried to dart in her room today when I went in to feed her... He realllllly want to know what's going on in there.
Marina - You read the whole novella!!
So this morning she was in her little cube when I went in to do morning chores. That cube probably doesn't feel as safe to her as her boxes. She nervously poked her head out to watch me, then when I was in other side of room, she crawled out - super low to floor - then froze. A couple minutes later, she scuttled to her box. That's the first time I've seen her move in weeks! (We hear her moving at night, but just don't see it.) So even though that moving was probably because she felt too exposed in that box, it's good she was able to move with me being in the room - and not have me eat her.
Batman tried to dart in her room today when I went in to feed her... He realllllly want to know what's going on in there.
It's a saga allright! Ok now I know, so you TNRed first and then after a while you decided to bring her inside. I know Batman is her son...I love how he brings toys to her and drops them at the bedroom door.
Our twins Tubi and Chloe are very curious about Sweet Pea , they talk to him and he answers them and when he was in the cage we petted them several times in the doorway so that he could see. However the leader of our kitty group, our youngest boy (he is a 2 year old orangie) is very apprehensive about Sweet Pea and is acting very jealous (more jealous I should say). So we will have to take it veeeeeery slow with the intro...
The cube that she has, is it the toy one made of nylon fabric?
Marina
Our twins Tubi and Chloe are very curious about Sweet Pea , they talk to him and he answers them and when he was in the cage we petted them several times in the doorway so that he could see. However the leader of our kitty group, our youngest boy (he is a 2 year old orangie) is very apprehensive about Sweet Pea and is acting very jealous (more jealous I should say). So we will have to take it veeeeeery slow with the intro...
The cube that she has, is it the toy one made of nylon fabric?
Marina
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #137
Check this out - there's even more to it! Here is a thread I made to illustrate the whole tail/tale
http://www.thecatsite.com/forums/sho...ustrated+story
The little cube thing is this:
It may not be the best thing for her since she may not feel safe in it, but it's comfy and snuggly. What's really bad about it is that she doesn't understand it's smushy. She's jumped onto it a few times and I've seen it flipped over. She has probably scared the crap out of herself doing that (jumping and having it not be firm!), so I have to place it not by something she will jump off onto it.. so she doesn't get hurt and scared. I'm keeping it in there but I may need to upgrade
I want to get her cat tower type hiding areas more like this (and bigger) especially when she does have free range of house, so she has hidey spots - but spots I at least can see her and know where she is.
That's good your kitties are already interacting with meows! That will make things easier when the time comes. Just love on your twin kitties more so they still understand they're #1
The little cube thing is this:
It may not be the best thing for her since she may not feel safe in it, but it's comfy and snuggly. What's really bad about it is that she doesn't understand it's smushy. She's jumped onto it a few times and I've seen it flipped over. She has probably scared the crap out of herself doing that (jumping and having it not be firm!), so I have to place it not by something she will jump off onto it.. so she doesn't get hurt and scared. I'm keeping it in there but I may need to upgrade
I want to get her cat tower type hiding areas more like this (and bigger) especially when she does have free range of house, so she has hidey spots - but spots I at least can see her and know where she is.
That's good your kitties are already interacting with meows! That will make things easier when the time comes. Just love on your twin kitties more so they still understand they're #1
I LOVE the photo story! The trio kitten photo is priceless and Batman sure sounds like a character, a very handsome one if I may add...
We have a similar material bed for Sweet Pea and I don't think he is using it either, maybe the lack of rigidity in the material is weird to them...
Marina
We have a similar material bed for Sweet Pea and I don't think he is using it either, maybe the lack of rigidity in the material is weird to them...
Marina
- Thread Starter Thread Starter
- #139
New question. Let me know if I should ask this in the Nutrition forums instead. (I don't want the whole thread to get moved though.)
Regarding Patches appetite... she is not the voracious eater she was outside. That said, I was slightly over feeding her because I was used to how much a kitten ate vs. adult... So at the vet they did say she was a little pudgy
but since she's a former feral, to not worry about putting her on a diet since she's transitioning and stressed.
But she basically put herself on a diet... She's not eating as much as she should be and it worries me sometimes. I try to tell myself it's ok because she's not crazy active... There are days where she does eat all of her food. And then there are days where aside from the treats I give her and a little bit of nibbling, she barely eats.
It's not the food - she transitioned to Wellness Blue bag slowly and it went well. She's just inconsistent with her appetite.
I am figuring it's not an emergency because a) she's not a kitty who is a normal inside cat that suddenly isn't eating b) she's eating something.. c) she was a few pounds over weight d) she's using potty regularly and stools are fine... But I do want to bring this up to the vet at her appointment coming up. Maybe Patches would be a candidate for some anxiety medicine? (She rejects wet food so I haven't been able to make her eat that either... I got some ideas a while back about freeze dried food that I need to buy and try.)
Should I buy Rescue Remedy or those herbal cat remedies you put in water that I've read about? I can't remember their names...
Another thing I need to figure out is how to make a scratching post made out of wood, that is more like her natural environment. I can't tell at all if she understands the posts in her room (1 is carpet, 1 is a sisal) so figured I should just make a wood one. I'd like her to feel more at home.
Regarding Patches appetite... she is not the voracious eater she was outside. That said, I was slightly over feeding her because I was used to how much a kitten ate vs. adult... So at the vet they did say she was a little pudgy
But she basically put herself on a diet... She's not eating as much as she should be and it worries me sometimes. I try to tell myself it's ok because she's not crazy active... There are days where she does eat all of her food. And then there are days where aside from the treats I give her and a little bit of nibbling, she barely eats.
I am figuring it's not an emergency because a) she's not a kitty who is a normal inside cat that suddenly isn't eating b) she's eating something.. c) she was a few pounds over weight d) she's using potty regularly and stools are fine... But I do want to bring this up to the vet at her appointment coming up. Maybe Patches would be a candidate for some anxiety medicine? (She rejects wet food so I haven't been able to make her eat that either... I got some ideas a while back about freeze dried food that I need to buy and try.)
Should I buy Rescue Remedy or those herbal cat remedies you put in water that I've read about? I can't remember their names...
Another thing I need to figure out is how to make a scratching post made out of wood, that is more like her natural environment. I can't tell at all if she understands the posts in her room (1 is carpet, 1 is a sisal) so figured I should just make a wood one. I'd like her to feel more at home.
If she's eating a little bit every day, or even almost every day, and if you can tell she doesn't look too thin, I wouldn't worry too much about the self-imposed diet. She's getting very little exercise and using very few calories - and wellness doesn't require much to be eaten to get a lot of nutrition.
As to the scratching... A sturdy log, stump or branch would work!
But here are some natural scratchers for sale that you could model something after:
Looks like just a 4x4 out of pine anchored well would work.... Dont' know where you'd find a 4x4 of cork, but... ????
http://www.naturalscratch.com/
Also, if you want to try flower essences to help, I'd go with Bach's Rescue Remedy - a few drops in her water dish. It's also recommended to dab it behind their ears, at the base of their tail, and under the chin... but maybe just put the rag you would use to dab it on her near her instead of trying to dab it onto her.
http://www.bachflower.com/Pets.htm
As to the scratching... A sturdy log, stump or branch would work!
But here are some natural scratchers for sale that you could model something after:
Looks like just a 4x4 out of pine anchored well would work.... Dont' know where you'd find a 4x4 of cork, but... ????
http://www.naturalscratch.com/
Also, if you want to try flower essences to help, I'd go with Bach's Rescue Remedy - a few drops in her water dish. It's also recommended to dab it behind their ears, at the base of their tail, and under the chin... but maybe just put the rag you would use to dab it on her near her instead of trying to dab it onto her.
http://www.bachflower.com/Pets.htm
