Harry Potter Discussion Thread-Spoiler Alert!!!

[okeefecl]

It's been agreed that we will start a separate discussion thread for "Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix". In this thread, participants should feel free to share their thoughts about the book, as well as plotlines. If you don't have the book, or haven't read it yet, and don't want to have the surprise spoiled, stop reading here!

I know it's a bit early, but I thought I'd start this...The book is available on the East Coast in less than 3 hours. I know I plan on finishing it some time tomorrow!

 

[okeefecl]

So, from interviews with J.K. Rowling, we know two things about the new book. First, a major character is going to die. Second, a "relationship" develops between Harry and Hermione.

What are your thoughts? (Trying to move the speculation over to this thread)

 

[a_loveless_gem]

I've started reading already and it is ABSOLUTELY FANTASTIC SO FAR!!!!!!!!!!! And from what I have read so far, I'm not so sure about the relationship between Harry and Hermione thing so far, it doesn't seem possible at the moment, although I guess you could read more into that first hug.

 

[hissy]

Talk to you later- I am in the reading room now!

 

[okeefecl]

All I can say is…WOW!!! The several year wait has been definitely worth it! I picked my book up at 11 am, and I just finished it, with a few food and bathroom breaks.

At first, the tone turned me off. And then I remembered, in this book Harry is 15 (this is the first book that didnâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]t mention Harryâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s birthday). My parents were ready to sell me off when I was 13, and they wanted to sell my brother off when he was 15. After that, I realized what Harry was feeling and thinking is exactly what a 15 year old boy would be thinking and feeling.

There is so much going on in the book, and itâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s definitely much darker than the earlier books, including “The Goblet of Fireâ€. Although, at the end, I think itâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s very hopeful. The students are pulling together, and are forming a new “Order of the Phoenixâ€. I absolutely loved that Neville Longbottom has gained courage and is now fighting Voldemort and his followers. In the earlier books, he came across as a bumbler, but here heâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s found his courage and is standing up for himself and his friends. For me, his choice is very brave when you consider the fate of his parents.

There were many parts of the book I absolutely loved. Firenze as the Divination teacher. Fred and George breaking free of Hogwarts. And I really liked the scenes with Harry and Cho. Some people might not like the “romantic†interludes, but I think that J.K. Rowling got them down pat.

And for the sad parts. I was in shock that Mr. Weasley got badly hurt, but was happy when he recovered. And, I cried when Sirius died. We all knew a major character was going to die, but his death was really hard.

I think the closing conversation between Dumbledore and Harry cleared up a lot of questions, but also introduced a lot of suspense for the last two books. I had assumed that Harry was safe with the Dursleys during the summer break because Arabella Figg was his secret keeper. However, it turns out he is safe because he lives with his motherâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s sister, and the protection his motherâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]s death gave him is carried on by the blood relationship he shares with his aunt. The shocker is that the prophecy states that only one can survive-either Harry or Voldemort. So, in the end (barring some kind of magical exception) Harry will be either a victim or a killer.

I really hope we donâ€[emoji]8482[/emoji]t have to wait several years for book 6!

 

[hissy]

Good Lord Christy! Did you enroll in Evelyn Woods Speed Reading Class?

A Potter book is to be savored and read slowly and enjoyed like a glass of fine wine...(I read that somewhere)

I am on Chapter 4 and enjoying the ride so far. I too did not like the tone of the first chapter. For Harry to be such a malcontent just didn't fit with my image of him.

 

[mom of 10 cats]

Well, the book arrived around 3 PM and I just finished it 5 minutes ago.

This is the best HP book to date!!!

I was shocked that it was Sirius who died, I thought for sure it would be Mr Weasley after the snake attack.

And I LOVED the Order for putting the Dursleys in their places!!!!

Now it's BF's turn to read it, so we can talk about it..

 

[mzjazz2u]

That's a BIG freaking book! You must be a super-dooper speed reader!!

 

[mom of 10 cats]

LOL I used to get in trouble in school because my teachers never believed that I could read as fast as I can. However, the fact that I got 100% on any test they gave me based on what I'd just read proved I was right.

I do read very fast, I was once timed (without knowing I was being timed) and found out I had read 90 pages in an hour. That's a page an a half a minute. And I swear, I don't skip over any of it!!!

 

[mom of 10 cats]

How much you wanna bet that Neville ends up as an Auror?

I was so proud of him! And I'm sure his grandmother's opinion of him will go up now.

 

[mzjazz2u]

Originally posted by Mom of 10 Cats
LOL I do read very fast, I was once timed (without knowing I was being timed) and found out I had read 90 pages in an hour. That's a page an a half a minute. And I swear, I don't skip over any of it!!!

That's amazing! I wish I could read half that fast! You're my new hero!!

 

[williewz]

Some random thoughts....

I read about that fast, and I finished it in about 8 hours total (including interuptions). I actually wasn't surprised that it was Sirius, especially after the to-do people kept making about what a thrill-seeker he was. All I could think was, "Uff, thank goodness it wasn't Hagrid". For me, it was more surprising that his father was a teenage bully! And while Dumbledore is incredibly amusing, I'm having trouble seeing him as wise. The scenes with Cho rang very true to me, they were a wonderful reminder that Harry's only a young teen. The scariest thing to me was the scene where they take the inquisitor to the forest and run into the centaurs. Bad, bad idea, Hermione! If they would nearly kick one of their own to death for accepting a teaching job with the humans... brrr!

 

[okeefecl]

Originally posted by hissy
Good Lord Christy! Did you enroll in Evelyn Woods Speed Reading Class?

A Potter book is to be savored and read slowly and enjoyed like a glass of fine wine...(I read that somewhere)

I am on Chapter 4 and enjoying the ride so far. I too did not like the tone of the first chapter. For Harry to be such a malcontent just didn't fit with my image of him.

Actually, we did take a speed reading course in middle school-don't know if it was Evelyn Woods, though...

Now, I'm re-reading it, and taking my time this time.

Sue, I think it would be great if Neville becomes an Auror, but with the way he was fondling his plant at the end of the book, he may become Professor of Herbology at Hogwarts.

 

[katl8e]

I just finished. Would have been done sooner, except Bill had some foolish notion about "eating" and insisted upon cooking breakfast and going grocery shopping.

I don't think that Sirius will stay dead. Voldemort came back, didn't he?

As for the scenes, with Harry and Cho -They were bang-on. WHAT 15-year-old boy understands girls? Most 50-year-old men don't understand us.

Dumbledore's Army has potential. Maybe they'll become an Anti-Dark Arts Squad. Sort of a wizarding "Mod Squad", taking on special cases, for the Ministry of Magic. BTW: I wonder who or what we can look forward to being the next Defense Against Dark Arts Professor? Wonder if Snape will EVER get that job?

Speaking of the Ministry, isn't it high time that Cornelius Fudge retired? HIS bumbling makes Neville look like a wizard Rhodes scholar.

Its good that Harry found out that his father and Sirius had feet of clay. Now he may not feel so compelled to live up to an unrealistic ideal and beat himself up, when he falls short.

Next task: HOW do we get J.K. Rowling to speed up and get the next book out? She had a lot of nerve, taking time out from writing, to get married and have a baby.

 

[okeefecl]

Originally posted by katl8e
I don't think that Sirius will stay dead. Voldemort came back, didn't he?

I think Sirius will stay dead. But, at the end, after Harry has tried the mirror and talked to Nearly-Headless Nick, Luna mentions hearing the voices of the dead behind the Veil-maybe Harry will be able to communicate with Sirius' spirit in one way or another.

Dumbledore's Army has potential. Maybe they'll become an Anti-Dark Arts Squad. Sort of a wizarding "Mod Squad", taking on special cases, for the Ministry of Magic.

I think we're seeing the formation of a new "Order of the Phoenix". Although many members of the original Order were older, there was Harry's parents, Sirius, Wormtail, Lupin and the Longbottoms. I think the kids are following in their footsteps.

Speaking of the Ministry, isn't it high time that Cornelius Fudge retired? HIS bumbling makes Neville look like a wizard Rhodes scholar.

Fudge is a boob, but I think he did the right thing at the end when he admitted that Voldemort was alive and gaining power. He's only human (although many wizards don't like to think they're just human), and made a lot of mistakes. I think that is one of the "lessons" of this book-life isn't black and white, good and evil. There is a lot of grey, and often people who stand on the side of good aren't necessarily good people themselves. Sometimes it takes a big kick in the pants for them to realize what's going on.

Its good that Harry found out that his father and Sirius had feet of clay. Now he may not feel so compelled to live up to an unrealistic ideal and beat himself up, when he falls short.

I actually found the scene where James was torturing Snape very difficult to believe. Of course, these were Snape's memories and were probably slightly predjudiced. We've heard that the Marauders (James, Sirius, Lupin and Wormtail) were wild and didn't listen to rules, but we've never heard that they were cruel. I think it's good that Harry learned that his idols weren't perfect, but as a reader I can't believe the story we were told.

Next task: HOW do we get J.K. Rowling to speed up and get the next book out? She had a lot of nerve, taking time out from writing, to get married and have a baby.

I agree. I'm ready for book 6 next week...

 

[williewz]

Originally posted by okeefecl
I actually found the scene where James was torturing Snape very difficult to believe. Of course, these were Snape's memories and were probably slightly predjudiced. We've heard that the Marauders (James, Sirius, Lupin and Wormtail) were wild and didn't listen to rules, but we've never heard that they were cruel. I think it's good that Harry learned that his idols weren't perfect, but as a reader I can't believe the story we were told.

Um, remember how they almost got Snape killed in HP3? I've known plenty of people who were great except for the one or two screaming faults...
The people who have been telling Harry about his father are his dad's friends, who aren't likely to come up and say "Your dead father? Oh, yeah, he could be a huge jerk sometimes..." I remember a boy in high school who offed himself in jail and everyone made him out to be a saint. I lived down the street from him, and believe me, I didn't exactly cry at the notion of not having obcenities screamed at me if I walked by his house. Back to the subject, James and his friends are teens (you know, with bad judgement, and hormones...) in that story, and I think we'd all be shocked at our parents' behavior when they were teens.

 

[okeefecl]

I guess the problem I had with the scene was it was too nasty-and everything we've heard about James and his crew (from their friends) was too good. I think a major point, or moral, of the book is that most of life isn't black and white, evil or good. Most of us muddle around in the grey between the extremes. We may lean towards good, but we don't mind hurting people if we think it's right (Professor Umbridge and her "lines" come to mind. As far as I'm concerned, the woman was a sadist although she was supposedly on the side of good). Do I think James and Company were pure-white do-gooders as their friends portray? No. Are they as evil and nasty as Snape remembers? No. I think the truth falls somewhere in the grey inbetween.

 

[a_loveless_gem]

The reason why I love JK Rowling is that she doesn't sugar coat her characters. Every one of them has a fault. It's great to see that sort of thing in children's books. It shows children that nothing is concrete and just because someone declares something, it isn't automatically true. For example, The Daily Prophet.

Even Albus Dumbledore admitted his fault, (FINALLY!!!), to Harry in that he should have told him sooner rather than to make excuses because he cared too much.

Sirus will remain dead. I do not see how he could come back to life. Something about the veil in the archway that Harry and Luna heard voices behind is a clue. And Nearly Headless Nick is certain that Sirius isn't going to want to be a ghost. He wasn't afraid of death from his various mentions of what it meant to be part of the Order. Nearly Headless Nick was and that was his explanation as to why he was a ghost. Though there were times when I thought the death was going to be Arthur Weasley, Professor McGonagall and then even Hermione!

The scene of James being a pompous bully was not surprising. Snape's remarks to Harry's father did have to have come from something. In HP 3, Snape was almost killed because of the Marauder's activities, and even in that there was a definite dislike between the two. Even in that, James did not seem to be totally innocent to me. There had to be a reason why. Normally people are grateful for being saved from death, not bitter.

The scenes of Harry and Cho were terrific! The perils of teenage romances. Though I loved the way Ginny's character profile has developed. She isn't just a sweet innocent little thing ready to be pounced on by Voldemort. She has guts and tricks up her sleeve and her own friends. And Neville!! Finally he's found his confidence and he can actually do spells. Though he will need a new wand. It wouldn't surprise me if he does become an Auror, though his love of plants and Herbology could step in the way of this.

And about Fudge still being Minister of Magic...*sigh*...well there has to be a character in power that is open to corruption for yet more plans in Books Six and Seven. That's how I see it anyway. Though it would be nice if he did get booted out of office unceremoniously.

And I have my suspicions about some of the centaurs, especially Bane. I do not think that they are as noble as they are portrayed. If they have influence over the Forest and its creatures something in Book One chills me to the bone. How did Voldemort get enough energy to travel out to the forest at night, catch a unicorn, kill it and drink its blood without drawing attention to himself, (including possible death)? Firenze knew and helped Harry but the explanation of centaurs not intefering with humans doesn't quite cut it anymore.

Oh...and bring on Book Six!!!!! I just hope it's not another two year wait....or even longer.

 

[katl8e]

When Dumbledore was making his explanations to Harry, I thought that he was going to reveal that he and Harry were related, somehow - perhaps a great-uncle or some such. Dumbledore does seem to have paternal or avuncular feelings for Harry.

 

[mom of 10 cats]

Well, Rowling does make the point that all the pureblooded Wizarding families are interrelated, so Dumbledore would be related to James Potter in some way.

It amuses me to think of Draco and Ron as being distant cousins. Both of them would gag at the idea!