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Man slaps child at Wal-Mart - Page 3

post #61 of 69
I don't understand why a lot of you seem to be making a big deal out of those of us who prefer to shop in peace?

If I threw myself on the floor and cried and screamed and kicked my feet, wouldn't you want me gone?

It's okay for a child to get away with it but not an adult? Is it because we are so afraid of punishing our children these days that we let them get away with everything except murder?

And yes, there is a huge difference between the screams of pain/terror and the screams of anger and tantrums. And it's not so much what the screaming is about, as other's have stated, but it is more of an issue of how long the parents let them carry on for.


This also has nothing to do with the handicapped. But if you want my opinion on that totally different subject, then yes...They should be removed from public for causing an outburst just as any other adult would be removed for having an outburst. There are many orginizations that fight for the handicapped to have the same rights as the non-handicapped...Which therefore means, they deserve the same treatment whether it be good or bad.
post #62 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nekomania View Post
I don't understand why a lot of you seem to be making a big deal out of those of us who prefer to shop in peace?

If I threw myself on the floor and cried and screamed and kicked my feet, wouldn't you want me gone?

It's okay for a child to get away with it but not an adult? Is it because we are so afraid of punishing our children these days that we let them get away with everything except murder?

And yes, there is a huge difference between the screams of pain/terror and the screams of anger and tantrums. And it's not so much what the screaming is about, as other's have stated, but it is more of an issue of how long the parents let them carry on for.


This also has nothing to do with the handicapped. But if you want my opinion on that totally different subject, then yes...They should be removed from public for causing an outburst just as any other adult would be removed for having an outburst. There are many orginizations that fight for the handicapped to have the same rights as the non-handicapped...Which therefore means, they deserve the same treatment whether it be good or bad.
What an excellent post. You are spot on in all your comments.
post #63 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nekomania View Post
I don't understand why a lot of you seem to be making a big deal out of those of us who prefer to shop in peace?.
Hi,

and I don't understand why it is so important for you to shop in peace and quiet. Children don't constantly cry in shops- this will only happen occasionally and should't therefore really present a big problem in my oppinion.

Quite frankly- yes, I'd put the rights of a child before mine, simply because they are less able to stand up for themselves.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nekomania View Post
If I threw myself on the floor and cried and screamed and kicked my feet, wouldn't you want me gone? .

No- first of all I'd be concernd about you as this isn't a normal thing to do as a grown up. If I had the feeling you were in danger of hurting yourself or others I'd see if I could get some help for you. If not I'd try to see if I could somehow help you myself. If you were so upset that you were in danger of hurting yourself or others then yes- in this case you should be placed in a psychiatric hospital where you can properly be cared for and will recieve psychological help.

A grown up doing this is in deep mental trouble and needs people who don't just look away because it's easier.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nekomania View Post
It's okay for a child to get away with it but not an adult? Is it because we are so afraid of punishing our children these days that we let them get away with everything except murder? .
No, it's because I don't think you should punish a two year old for feeling tired or grumpy or upset, which are the most common reasons for a two year old to start crying. These are basic feelings for a two year old and as such normal at this age.

I don't see children as little adults who should behave like an adult. So yes, I do judge children differently- but value them the same as any other person.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nekomania View Post
And yes, there is a huge difference between the screams of pain/terror and the screams of anger and tantrums. And it's not so much what the screaming is about, as other's have stated, but it is more of an issue of how long the parents let them carry on for. .
As has been mentioned before- little children simply don't have an off switch you can flipp. Of course the parent should tend to the child and try to comfort it- but in my eyes mainly because a child that's crying is unhappy and badly needs that comforting.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nekomania View Post
This also has nothing to do with the handicapped. But if you want my opinion on that totally different subject, then yes...They should be removed from public for causing an outburst just as any other adult would be removed for having an outburst. There are many orginizations that fight for the handicapped to have the same rights as the non-handicapped...Which therefore means, they deserve the same treatment whether it be good or bad.

This makes me particularly sad- so mentally disabled people should be locked away so that your peace isn't disturbed? I must admit that your opinion on this leaves me a bit speachless

regards,

Christine
post #64 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjh27 View Post
and I don't understand why it is so important for you to shop in peace and quiet.
...

Shopping is annoying enough as it is. Crowds to work my way through, the feeling that I'm forgetting something and trying to figure out what, obnoxious distracting flickering lights (at least at one store nearby), random people trying to use me as their human contact for the day, checkout registers beeping over and over and usually just barely off-pitch from each other, and that's a normal shopping trip. Why should I have to also put up with eardrum-shattering brat behavior of kids whose parents don't teach them to behave in public?

I mean, if they fall and hurt themselves, I'll put a bag of frozen peas or something on their knee myself...I'm not talking about that...but...it's parents' job to manage their spawn.
post #65 of 69
I am sometimes stupified by how statements can be twisted and manipulated to try to make them into something else entirely. It boggles my mind, yet is entertaining.
post #66 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjh27 View Post



This makes me particularly sad- so mentally disabled people should be locked away so that your peace isn't disturbed? I must admit that your opinion on this leaves me a bit speachless

regards,

Christine
I don't wish to argue in circles as it seems we'll never change each other's minds about this particular subject

But I would appreciate it if you wouldn't take what I said and turn it around to fit your own argument anymore. Nowhere in any of my text did I say that mentally disabled people or any child should be "locked up" and kept out of society.

The only thing I said was that if they expect to be treated like a normal member of society, then people should expect that anyone, whether they be mentally, physically, or otherwise challenged will be removed from a public place if they decide to have an outburst.

It's very rude to put words into my mouth to make it out to seem like I hate children and the disabled. Because I don't.
post #67 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nekomania View Post
But I would appreciate it if you wouldn't take what I said and turn it around to fit your own argument anymore. Nowhere in any of my text did I say that mentally disabled people or any child should be "locked up" and kept out of society.

The only thing I said was that if they expect to be treated like a normal member of society, then people should expect that anyone, whether they be mentally, physically, or otherwise challenged will be removed from a public place if they decide to have an outburst.

It's very rude to put words into my mouth to make it out to seem like I hate children and the disabled. Because I don't.
Hi,

I'm not turning your words around.

As far as I have understood it you are of the oppijnion that small children and disabled people should be treated like adults.

You also stated that they should be removed out of public view if they "have an outburst", just like an adults.

I don't agree with this- I don't think it's fair to treat small children and disabled like adults because they are not adults. They have different needs. I treat adults like adults and children like children.

If I somehow got your oppinion wrong there please point out where I've got you wrong.

Otherwise I agree with you- I don't expect either of us will convince the other of their viewpoint.

regards,

christine
post #68 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjh27 View Post
Hi,

and I don't understand why it is so important for you to shop in peace and quiet. Children don't constantly cry in shops- this will only happen occasionally and should't therefore really present a big problem in my oppinion.

I do not agree with parents that believe their children should be allowed to run amuck. That is fine, let your children have tantrums in YOUR house, not in public. You have the right to do that. I have the RIGHT to shop in peace and not be subjected to your (general your) rude and obnoxious children. That is why there are LAWS regarding disturbing the peace. Those laws also apply to temper tantrum children. Since they are kids, it will be the parents that will be ordered to cease and desist.

I believe that it is a parent's job to teach their children acceptable behavior. If parents want to allow their children to act out at home fine, but if it happens in public and people complain, it is YOUR fault NOT the people complaining.


Quite frankly- yes, I'd put the rights of a child before mine, simply because they are less able to stand up for themselves.

IMO, that is exactly the reason why kid's throw temper tantrums, because parents don't care enough to teach them correct behavior. IMO, attitudes like this is the reason kids are the way they are. I control my child, my child does NOT control me. Any parent knows kids will push, push and push until you set their limits. Kids WANT to know their limits. By not giving them any limits you (general you) are not being a responsible parent and are doing your poor child a huge disservice.




No- first of all I'd be concernd about you as this isn't a normal thing to do as a grown up. If I had the feeling you were in danger of hurting yourself or others I'd see if I could get some help for you. If not I'd try to see if I could somehow help you myself. If you were so upset that you were in danger of hurting yourself or others then yes- in this case you should be placed in a psychiatric hospital where you can properly be cared for and will recieve psychological help.

A grown up doing this is in deep mental trouble and needs people who don't just look away because it's easier.



No, it's because I don't think you should punish a two year old for feeling tired or grumpy or upset, which are the most common reasons for a two year old to start crying. These are basic feelings for a two year old and as such normal at this age.

I don't see children as little adults who should behave like an adult. So yes, I do judge children differently- but value them the same as any other person.

I don't expect children to act like adults either, but when they start screaming because they want a toy I expect mommy to act like a parent and an adult and rectify the situation. If a person can't be a parent then they shouldn't have children.



As has been mentioned before- little children simply don't have an off switch you can flipp. Of course the parent should tend to the child and try to comfort it- but in my eyes mainly because a child that's crying is unhappy and badly needs that comforting.

Come back and talk to us when you have children of your own. No offense but you really don't know because you have no children.





This makes me particularly sad- so mentally disabled people should be locked away so that your peace isn't disturbed? I must admit that your opinion on this leaves me a bit speachless

regards,

Christine
This thread is not about the disabled whether physically or mentally but I, personally, have never seen a disable person have a tantrum in public. And she never said they should be locked away and I don't believe it is fair to twist her words into something she did not say.
post #69 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv
I don't expect children to act like adults either, but when they start screaming because they want a toy I expect mommy to act like a parent and an adult and rectify the situation. If a person can't be a parent then they shouldn't have children.
This right here is the crux of it, and why this thread is going round and round in circles.

No one is saying that the child should have been slapped. Everyone agrees that the man was definitely and criminally wrong. Frankly, no one is saying that children should be seen and not heard either. No one is saying that children have no place in public.

But I have to say...if you really think that there's no problem shopping with screaming and out of control children in the store, I invite you to come to my local Wal Mart - particularly after 9:00 p.m. Do I blame the kids for being tired and cranky? No. But I definitely blame the parents for not being responsible enough to get their kids home in time for them to go to bed at a reasonable time for their age. When the kids are literally running amuck, chasing each other around the store and between the clothes racks, knocking items off shelves, running into shoppers (never saying "excuse me" or "sorry") while Mom casually browses the shelves (or racks) paying ZERO attention to what her hellcats are doing, I do get angry. Sure, the kids are being kids, but they are acting inappropriately for the situation and their parent(s) aren't doing anything to discipline them. And yes, I have seen this situation entirely too often, and not just at the "low-rent stores" like Wal Mart. It is because of PARENTS who refuse to be parents that make it entirely unpleasant to be shopping around their children.

This is not about a two year old crying because they are tired and cranky, or a 3-4 year old who gets hurt. This is about the child who is out of control and the parents are doing nothing about it.
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