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When do you let mom back out into the house?

post #1 of 21
Thread Starter 
Obviously I won't let her wander freely when the unfixed males are around. But, I have 2 fixed cats that are "mad at her" so to speak, hissing, growling etc (probably due to scent change?) I want to let her wander (she is very upset about being locked into my bedroom, bathroom and closet) but I can't risk leaving my bedroom door open because of the other cats...
post #2 of 21
Could you explain the situation a little bit more. Are there unneutered males in the home? If so I would keep her contained 100% as she can and will get pregnant again. If not then I'd say when the kittens are about 2.5 weeks my momma cat wanted some freedom from them and at that point they were going a bit longer between feedings. I would make sure none of the cats can get to the babies however as you never know how they'll react to them, or how momma will react to the cats being around her babies. In general momma may be defensive of the other cats just thinking they are out to get her babies so be very careful when you let her socialize.

Leslie
post #3 of 21
Thread Starter 
There are 2 un-nuetered males, but they are easily contained for a while for her to have some freedom. The other 2 fixed cats don't try to hurt her (have brought them all in for an introduction) but they are upset and will hiss and growl. One of my fixed cats has been through the kitten thing before and he has NEVER tried to hurt any of them (3 of my adult cats are from the same litter and their mother was my cat, so he has been there/done that) but it is really the fixed female that worries me. I know my nuetered male will eventually find these kittens to be the best toys, but just not yet. Also, my 2 fixed cats are used to sleeping with us, so they are already bent about not being allowed in.

Sorry, rambled...I hope that explains it. The 2 boys are getting fixed soon...as soon as I can drive 45 miles to do the paperwork...
post #4 of 21
For up to 2 months after being neutered males can impregnate females. I'd be extremely cautious going through the door that leads to her room. Maybe shut the males away for a few hours each day & let her roam, but only under your supervision?

Keep in mind if she goes into heat she will do anything in her power to get out....and the intact males are likely to start spraying.
post #5 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by white cat lover View Post
For up to 2 months after being neutered males can impregnate females.
I am not saying you are wrong... but can you give me a link to this info? Perferable a vet college or something substansial like that.

I asked my vet about this one day... and he basically laughed in my face.

It was humiliating to say the least. He said "WHERE did you hear THAT?!"

Of couse when you say "someone on the internet.... " it gets shot down pretty fast... Anyways, this subject had bothered me since then. I have heard this (fresh neutered males can still have viable sperm) on here several times, but this is the only place I have heard it, it says nothing about it in my various cat health books. I am kinda on the fence on this one. I saw on TV, think it was "In The Womb:Cats" that said the reason intact male cat testicles 'stick out' is because the sperm has to be 2-3 degrees cooler than body temp to be viable.

Maybe my vet is just stupid. (possible, )
post #6 of 21
Thread Starter 
Now she moved them. Now I will have to be EXTRA careful where I walk at night because they are now hidden behind a box on the floor of my bedroom (don't ask about the box please! LOL!) I think it is because their eyes are starting to open and she wanted them in a darker place, but of course I am not a cat so I don't know this for certain. Also, she is not at all gentle in the moving. Instead of using the nape of the neck, she uses the WHOLE neck, throat area included. I wish I could show her how to do it, but don't want to upset her more and again, I am not a cat.
post #7 of 21
Thread Starter 
I looked at your banner and I thought you had drawn a mustache on Molly! That is SO cute!
post #8 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by KatKisses View Post
I am not saying you are wrong... but can you give me a link to this info? Perferable a vet college or something substansial like that.

I asked my vet about this one day... and he basically laughed in my face.

It was humiliating to say the least. He said "WHERE did you hear THAT?!"

Of couse when you say "someone on the internet.... " it gets shot down pretty fast... Anyways, this subject had bothered me since then. I have heard this (fresh neutered males can still have viable sperm) on here several times, but this is the only place I have heard it, it says nothing about it in my various cat health books. I am kinda on the fence on this one. I saw on TV, think it was "In The Womb:Cats" that said the reason intact male cat testicles 'stick out' is because the sperm has to be 2-3 degrees cooler than body temp to be viable.

Maybe my vet is just stupid. (possible, )
Well, it's common knowledge that when a human man has a vasectomy, he has to use backup birth control until he has had two "clear" sperm counts, so wouldn't that potentially be the same for any other animal? And I have heard of testes growing back!
post #9 of 21
Thread Starter 
Does anyone have thoughts about her moving the kittens or the method? I really am not comfortable with where she has them...
post #10 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by nursedoggett View Post
Well, it's common knowledge that when a human man has a vasectomy, he has to use backup birth control until he has had two "clear" sperm counts, so wouldn't that potentially be the same for any other animal? And I have heard of testes growing back!
I've been around cats and other animals all my life and never once seen, or heard from an eyewitness, of even one testicle growing back. If that had happened to my fixed male, I would have had about 87 litters of kittens I guess it could be done in a science lab with some stem cells or something, but if it's happened "in the wild" I'd like to see a source for that.

Also, a vasectomy is different from castration (or human males wouldn't be able to be talked into vasectomies for anything short of a sportscar and then they wouldn't admit it). Castration removes the production facilities of sperm; a vasectomy pinches off the delivery route. It could easily be possible to pinch off the delivery route only partway, which is why the job needs to be tested afterward. I think a vet would know if they left half a testicle (and I could be wrong but I think it wouldn't work that way).

If we're going to compare to humans, I'd like to point out that human females are considered fertile starting a few days before we actually ovulate, because it's normal for sperm to live that long so they could get to the egg. I could believe that cat sperm might live about that long (the exact number might be different--we're different species!) within the male cat's male parts, so that if he mated the day after he got fixed, the female could get pregnant from him. Which would allow the tomcat to brag to the other tomcats that he's so virile he doesn't even need his testicles to knock up a female
post #11 of 21
I was just trying to make the point that anything is possible and you can never be too careful, and for her to not get upset at her mean vet.
post #12 of 21
If I were you I would but the kittens in a safer spot. My mom had a terrible accident reccently, she had a bottle baby, he was almost old enough to eat on his own, and while he was running around getting his play time, she accidently stepped on him. He did not make it.

It is not worth the risk, I would move them to a safe spot, preferably a large box (about 2tf wide & at least 7inches tall) with warm blankets in it. I understand that these are new borns and they can't move around much yet, but sometimes momma cats can drag them a little if they are really latched on nursing, plus they will start crawling soon.

Good luck with the little ones!
post #13 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by KatKisses View Post
I am not saying you are wrong... but can you give me a link to this info? Perferable a vet college or something substansial like that.
I'm not sure where to find the info, but there have been documented cases of a recently gelded horse impregnating a mare, due to the sperm being retained in the vas deferens. I don't think there are any documented cases in cats (because if your female gets out, there's really no way to know who's the daddy), but every now and then you hear of a cases where the only male around was one who was recently neutered........
post #14 of 21
Dang my vet is stupid! I figured that anyways since he wouldn't even look at a food label for me & give me his opinion, instead he said "the only good food for crystals is Hills C/D." Good thing he is not the only vet at my clinic.

Excuse the hijack!
post #15 of 21
Your vet can call my vet lol. I am a pedigree cat breeder (siberians) and a boy I retired (which I held off for 6 months to try to have a special pairing to a female not gone into heat in several months) got my girl preggers 6 weeks after being neutered. I didn't know it at the time and the 2 cats were best of friends besides so after his neuter, I let them run together, 3 weeks later, surprise. Email me privately and I would be more than happy to give you my vets phone number (you can even call them privately and pose the question and then ask if they would tell your vet that).
Daisy
post #16 of 21
I believe it now! I never had someone tell me that first hand they had experienced this.

Next time I go to the vet office I will ask for that particular vet, and tell him that they CAN get preg. with a freshly neutered male. And if he doesn't believe me I will contact you & get your vets number. Wonder how many vets DO know about this? There arn't that many great vets around here, all say raw is bad bad bad, and Hills is premium food.

Believe it or not, the office I go to (4 vets including the dumb one) is one of the better ones around here, and they have the most business I have ever seen for local vets.

Thanks though!
post #17 of 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by KatKisses View Post
I believe it now! I never had someone tell me that first hand they had experienced this.

Next time I go to the vet office I will ask for that particular vet, and tell him that they CAN get preg. with a freshly neutered male. And if he doesn't believe me I will contact you & get your vets number. Wonder how many vets DO know about this? There arn't that many great vets around here, all say raw is bad bad bad, and Hills is premium food.

Believe it or not, the office I go to (4 vets including the dumb one) is one of the better ones around here, and they have the most business I have ever seen for local vets.

Thanks though!
Gosh, I hate when a vet/physician is so wrapped around a rep's fingers. I've been a nurse for over 10 years, and you see the drug reps go in and talk to the doc, taking him to lunch, etc. I know it has to be the same for some vets, too.
I love my vet, she doesn't push on your food choices. She asks what you're feeding the cats and leaves it at that, unless I ask. When I told her I was interested in a whole food diet for my dogs, she was VERY helpful, and she helped me incorporate it into my cats diet. But now my vet is out on maternity leave, and I am using the backup vet, who's just ok.
post #18 of 21
Thread Starter 
Why do my posts keep getting hi-jacked? Does anyone else have any insight about when it is safe to let mommy back out and about in the house? I guess we will still have to keep the bedroom door closed so the other cats don't mess with or hurt the babies....
post #19 of 21
So sorry to hijack!!! Please forgive me.
With my momma cat,when the babies were about 2 weeks old, she begged and begged to get out of the room so we started letting her. It made it easier to clean the room, nest, litter box, change the sheets, etc, (it was my bedroom). But she never did try to move them. When the babies were about 4 weeks, we would let a few of them out at a time into the living room with us. At 7 weeks, we put both litters together in our room to help the less socialized litter from the other room socialize. After a few days, you couldn't get out of the room without all 11 of them following you, so we started leaving the door open all day w/ a baby gate so they can crawl under, and keeping it closed at night. The one momma cat stopped nursing right at 8 weeks, and she was done with the room totally. The other momma was only still nursing a few. Now they are almost 11 weeks. 3 still try to nurse, but we keep momma out of the room as much as we can because she started peeing on a pillow. Neither has had any interest in going outside or trying to get outside, which strikes me as odd, considering the one momma has gone into heat (not that I'd let her out anyways). 4 babies have already gone to new homes, and we keep all 7 babies shut in the bedroom with us at night, without any mommas.
post #20 of 21
Thread Starter 
no need to apologize! You all have been hugely helpful...was just curious how I manage to start the continuing conversations! Kind of funny actually!
post #21 of 21
Loudmouth gets let out (of the bedroom and into the rest of the house) for about 10 minutes every few hours except when I'm at work or when I'm asleep and can't observe everyone. SHe'll get more time out as the kittens get older. This is her second litter with me (determined it will be her last!) so I know how Prissy reacts. Loudmouth has no issue with being kept inside the room as long as she gets a few minutes of rest time from the new borns. She's already asking to be let outside tho, and that's really not going to happen. I just pull up the blinds so she can sit in the window. Once the kittens get older and less vulnerable to drafts I'll maybe even crack it a little, but not enough for more than a paw to fit thru.

Her last litter is still hanging around but now that the new litter is born, Mom finally decided it was time to wean her last litter (18 weeks is just a little late in my opinion tho ).

Prissy on the other hand is having a fit trying to get into the spare room where the kittens are. Every time they start crying, she's at that door, on her side with her paws beneath it and trying to pull it open. I don't think she's figured out it's a "push" door. She's going to be a kitten thief again, I think. At least she does it to care for them tho, and not to hurt them. That can be a concern with males OR females, whether neutered or not. In fact, a fertile female cat killed 2 litters of kittens at my in-laws last year just because she wanted HER litter to have the best chance. SO if you let your mama out, make sure everyone is being watched and that those babies are locked up tight.

About where she's putting them: Loudmouth moves her kittens every few days. At least once a week they'll be in a new place. As long as they're not causing a problem and aren't in danger it's fine, but it sounds like she's gotting them in a stumble zone. Try puttin a basket or box or something behind the box where she has them. Just something to contain them. Maybe you can corral them without actually moving the location, and everyone will be happy. One thing that I found that worked fabulously when Loudmouth wanted her kittens beneath my computer desk was a simple laundry basket. Hey, it worked for the 4 days she had to have them there. Hope you solve this conundrum soon!
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