No matter what you think - Letterman was appalling! - Page 3  

Well I think it's terrible to joke around about a 14 year old girl getting knocked up. No that should be off limits it's not funny, and frankly if Letterman really intended this joke he must be trying to appeal to an audience of peadophiles...Yuck.
Since he said he meant Bristol not Willow...well then that's a different story. but he still owes an apology IMO because even if it's unintentional it can still be hurtful and wrong...

Ok, so Bristol is 18 years old and has a baby. And apparently she's the only one. She was in as committed relationship as a 17 year old can be in, she accepted the consequences of her actions, and she is using her public status as a way to possibly educate other teens on the seriousness of those actions. Some people may not understand what she meant when she said "If girls realized the consequences of sex, nobody would be having sex" (even when it's explained ) and that she's being an advocate for teen-pregnancy prevention. That doesn't mean that she's an idiot, or that she would get "knocked up" by any guy who paid attention to her.

Would it be OK for the joke to have been about a black woman on welfare with 6 kids by 6 different men? Oh no! The NAACP and ACLU would have been all over that one. But a prominent Republican's daughter gets pregnant while still in high school, finishes school, still plans to go to college, works 2 part-time jobs to at least help her family with the expenses, and gives interviews to prominent magazines and television shows to advocate teen-pregnancy prevention (which is not abstenence only education) is 100% open to ridicule.

Sarah Palin may have made the argument political. Honestly I didn't see that part of her statements against Letterman, but it doesn't surprise me. That, IMO, does not negate the fact that it is seen as acceptable to assume that if a woman has sex with one man outside of marriage, she would automatically be a slut. Why is that OK? How is that defensible?

I am sure that if a governor who happens to be a black woman with 6 kids from 6 different men would be open to ridicule (or a daughter of such governor)...
And, seriously- G. W. Bush was ridiculed as a country hick because of his accent and Texas background even though he went to Yale and Harvard. That's why it's called comedy, it isn't based on reality...I hold absolutely nothing against Bristol Palin for getting pregnant at 17. But I would gladly laugh at the way some comedians have and do make jokes about it. And as I said the fact that she got pregnant isnt' what's funny, it's when it is combined with her mother's stance on abstinence only education. If this specific joke had been about Bristol I would have thought it is funny..even though I'm very happy at the way Bristol is dealing with her life and the teen pregnancy speeches that she gives.
I don't see the joke as her being a slut. The joke to me is that Sarah Palin is not able to teach her own daughter to be abstinent until marriage, of course it's grossly exaggerated by stating that she's not able to stop her from getting knocked up by some random baseball player or w/e. That doesn't mean she's a slut it just means Sarah Palin is a bad parent. Or, I shouldn't say it like that: what I mean is that I don't think the joke targets Bristol as being promiscuous although it does imply that. But, again it's just a joke and jokes exaggerate things to make them funny.

IMO, women who think those kind of comments are no big deal, think sexism is fine. That, IMO, implies that those women feel they really are second class citizens and not deserving of respect.

The free speech argument is ludicrous IMO. Sure he is "free" to make whatever perverted remarks he wants, it doesn't mean it isn't out of line.
We aren't talking legalities here, we are talking about sex talk by a late night old man about a teen ager. Some may think it is fine, I just like to think I have more compassion for the person in question being talked about. Some don't care about other's feelings, some do.

A little bit of a broad stroke against all woment who don't agree with you. I can assure you I have no self esteem problems and don't think sexism is fine, I just dont happen to agree that this is sexism.

When an old 62 year old man talks about a teenager getting knocked up in the dugout by A-Rod, if that isn't sexist what would you call it?
I think Letterman must just be an old pervert.

I have to wonder how he would take it if someone knocked him for his illegtimate b****** son. Would that be considered okay because it is free speech and all? Not in my book. Think how his son would feel to hear himself being called the "B" word.

I call it a joke, however much in poor taste, made about an individual, not an entire gender.
What does Letterman's age have to do with anything? If he was 21 would this not make you mad?

Of course it would. But it just seems like, kind of, a dirty old man kind of thing. Yuck.

And of course it reflects bad on women as whole, it is sexist and sexism, IMO, the same as calling a black person the "n" word, no difference at all, with the exception being it is not politically correct to call a black person the "n" word and it seems to be politcally correct to say demeaning things about women. Even some women don't think it is a big deal.

Okay let me see if I'm getting this straight, it's okay to joke about men and their sexuality, but not women? Because we are women we should be immune to sexual jokes? To me that sounds like it's demeaning men as second class citizens, not women. Correct me if I'm misunderstanding this.
Actually, i'm failing to see how making a sexual joke about a woman is sexist and it looks like many people in this thread have implied that??? I've said many times that John Edwards was hot and I used to say that John Kerry, Bush's old opponent was not attractive ...does that make me a sexist for looking at male political figures as sexual objects?

If you can't see the difference between saying some dude is "hot" and talking trashy, vulgar sex talk about a teenager, then I just don't know what to tell you.

Frankly, I think it was sexist and kind of perverted to talk about a teenager getting raped in a dug out.

I know the excuse was the old man thought it was Bristol and not Willow. That doesn't cut it for me. Someone, obviously, went to the trouble of researching Sarah Palin's itinerary while in New York to find out she went to the Yankees game. It is apparent to me that, since Bristol wasn't even in town that he knew full well who was at that game.

To tell you the truth, I would like to see Letterman come face to face with Todd Palin, I would love to see him say what he did to Todd Palin's face.

And I do not think it was a joke, I think it was mean spirited, vulgar and beneath contempt to talk about a teenager like that. It shows the character and what kind of person he is and it shows the lack of character of anyone who finds that kind of stuff funny.

I do think it was definitely perverted since it was about Willow... and I do agree that it's terrible and he needs to apologize because even if he didn't mean it about Willow, he said it that's the point his intention doesn't matter. I do not see how it is sexist though ...And if it had really been about Bristol I probably wouldn't have felt as disgusted by it, I'd probably think it's pretty normal...I think sexual jokes are fair game for comedians for both men and women as long as they are adults..
And yea I didn't realize you were talking about the joke as it is, about Willow but I still fail to see it as sexist, I see it as just perverted and wrong.

So my question is, her 14 year old daughter, Willow is pregnant?

No, Willow is not pregnant, no Bristol is not pregnant either. For the record, Piper, the youngest daughter is not pregnant either.

After thinking about this situation, I realize none of us should be a bit surprised that Letterman would joke about something like this. He has always been a low class person. Why do you suppose he never took over the Tonight Show? The network wanted a class act and Letterman certainly doesn't fill that bill.

The sad thing in this thread is that other women think it's OK for someone like Letterman to say such terrible things about a teenager and that it's "funny". It's no wonder women are treated as second class citizens when we don't even stand up for ourselves or each other. Very sad really.

My parents were excellent parents. They did teach me right and wrong, sex wasn't a taboo subject although it wasn't frequently talked about, my mother was my best friend (although that did come about later in life). I knew my sister was on the pill, I knew that they wanted us to wait to have sex, and you know what? I STILL got "knocked up" when I was younger than Bristol. It wasn't a reflection on my parents or their parenting.

To say that she (whether Bristol or Willow) got knocked up at the game implies either consent with a man she's never met before which is the epitome of being a slut, or non-consent which is rape. Either way, whether she's 14 or 18 with one child and by all accounts the child is with the only person she's ever had sex with, I just don't think that is a funny joke. I don't see that reflecting on the parent, either, even though that was no doubt his purpose since he was already on a roll saying her style was that of a "slutty flight attendant". Which also begs the question - was he implying "like mother, like daughter"?

Yes of course it doesn't make Palin a bad parent, but he's making a joke about it. To make a joke about it doesn't have to be true at all...
And yea it means she's being promiscuous, but that doesn't have to be true to poke at it either. He's exaggerating the fact that she's had sex with one guy and it's been publicized and blowing it up to make his joke funny.


If the joke had been about ...i dunno Trip ( I think that's her son's name) getting a cheerleader knocked up, would it make you feel like he's treating men as second class citizens? Okay I just don't get it how it's making women second class citizens. Can someone at least explain your logic behind that?

Just wanted to add something...

For those who are kvetching about "more important things to worry about", that is SUCH a red herring argument. If you're so single minded that only one topic in the whole world can be concerning, then you may as well hole yourself up for the rest of your life. Personally, I am quite capable of being concerned about multiple topics at once. Just because I am paying attention to this topic does not mean that nothing else matters.

Thank you, valanhb, for voicing my very thoughts. Yes, she (and her boyfriend) made a mistake. I actually heard her say on a morning show, that she was very happy to have this baby, she would just have preferred to have "this baby" later in life.

She's handling it. Millions have before her.

Letterman had an out-of-wedlock son for what, four years, before he finally married his mother? What does that make him?

One question no one has asked: what is ARod's response to all this? Wasn't exactly nice for him, either.

Say what you may about sexism, rape or whatever: Letterman is on the "Put down Palin" bandwagon, as are many, that's where the "joke" came from, and it was tasteless.

Imus probably thought he was funny, too.

the thing for me though is that I think people should be smart enough to realize that Bristol is not a slut and neither is Palin and the fact that comedians are calling them that in their act doesn't make them into sluts... The comedians play around with people but don't preach some sort of universal truths..I think everyone knows that. Some things such as sex with children is kind of taboo for me because it's just wrong and I understand how that's not okay in this case. But from the general comments people said I'm surprised at the sort of things that are considered offensive by so many people.

This post sums up my feeling about this situation. Thanks, Linda.

The thing for me is, that I think people should be smart enought to know that Letterman's remarks over the line, disgusting, rude, hurtful to the Palin family and, NOT comedy.

Update

For those of us that think Letterman is a total low life please go to:

http://www.firedavidletterman.com/


Please sign their petition and call or email some of the sponsers, there is a list of sponsers with names, phone numbers and email addresses. The only way to get this drivel to stop is to hit them in the pocketbook.

Here is a, somewhat, similar situation but this guy got suspended, as well he should have.

http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/...ment_77059.asp

That certainly shows the bias of NBC, but did we ever doubt that?

No one says you can't be concerned about more than one topic. For some of us there are things that have a bigger impact. Just our opinion. And we are not "kvetching" we are stating our opinion. Just because it does not match yours does not mean we are complaining.

Oh, but I forget, if we are not with you we lack self respect.

As I always do, I try to imagine this shoe on the other foot to see how it fits.

"Michelle Obama went to the P-Diddy concert last night, and during the intermission, Malia got drive-byed."

Or...

"Biden took his family on a driving vacation, but he wouldn't let his wife drive; he was afraid she'd pull out in front of a truck."

I don't think either one is funny...but I can imagine a comedian making a case for either one.

Letterman (or, more likely, his writers) messed up. It's not the first time, won't be the last time. Those who are agree with his politics are not likely to see a big problem, and those who don't just have one more reason not to like him. As usual, those who are on the left will give him a pass, just as Limbaugh got a pass from those on the right over his drug deal (and his mulitple wives, but let's not go there!).

You know, if we didn't get such mess of bizarre imagery last year during the campaign - Palin and her religious fanaticism (which would seemingly run counter with teen pregnancy); the backpedaling that had to be done when it broke that Bristol was pregnant, like sprucing up the boyfriend and parading him around as "family", his staged handshake with McCain, all of the dumb photo-op stuff, even the "what the hell?" image of the 7-year old carrying the infant around on stage like a sack of potatoes, not to mention Palin's numerous airheaded interview gaffes - then we would probably get more of a collective respect for Palin and her family.

Whether or not you think "Freak show" when you think of the Palin family probably depends on your party affiliation, but that's usually how it goes. As it is, I feel sorry for ALL of those kids and how they seem destined to get dragged through the muck (it will likely get worse...2012?), since their mother has done them few favors in the PR sphere. Unless you're in her political corner, in which case all of the weird, seemingly disingenuous stuff is legitimized. And maybe it is legitimate. Who am I to say.

That being said; after thinking about it for a few days, the joke seems worse, even if meant for Bristol. Sadly, she's as much a pawn as anyone in her mom's quest to be the Queen of...anything.

I guess it struck me when I imagined Bristol sitting at home, maybe even watching Letterman that night, and her hearing that joke. That made me feel uncomfortable.

I may be in the minority, as I am a republican, somewhat conservative person - but I would NEVER give that fanatic a pass on anything! I was never a listener of his show, but when I heard/saw his comments (on the news) re: Michael J. Fox and the Parkinsons, I realized he must be a really poor excuse for a human being. I am dearly sorry his name keeps coming up in reference to the GOP. Embarrassing!

Here's what I think.

1. Letterman was out of line, even though he intended the older sister as the butt of his “joke.†I think he should sincerely apologize.

2. Some people on this forum should be more considerate of other’s sensitivities --- especially once they point them out.

3. I agree that Johnny Carson was a MUCH better host.

4. It’s annoying that every time something happens to a member or the family of a member of a political party, someone has to jump in and moan that things would be different if it was the other way around. As someone who is mostly liberal, I find it just as offensive as I would if the comment was made about a democrat’s child.

5. As far as jokes about women being in poor taste, so are jokes about men and I hear them all the time.

"Religious fanaticism?" What religious fanaticism? Because she is a Christian and pro-life, that means she is a "fanatic"? IMO, that is absurd.

And what is wrong with Piper Palin carrying little Trig on stage? Why would you try to denigrate that? "Like a sack of potatoes?" Maybe you can give us all instructions how to properly carry a baby.

So, Palin had some "gaffes", she has a ways to go to catch up with our current Vice President for goodness sakes. FTR, I think Biden is a hoot and have no animosity toward him at all.