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The First Puppy has been chosen! - Page 3

post #61 of 173
4/12/09 at 2:52pm
I understand the logic of going from a breeder rather than a shelter. I am also VERY happy he didn't get a Doodle (they have enough hype).

I am, however, disappointed - why didn't he come right out & say "due to allergy issues we will likely go to a breeder". Yeah - would've caused flack - and yeah, if my kids were allergic I would want to be sure it was a purebred (thus less likely to cause an allergic reaction).

And we had a PWD in the little po-dunk shelter here. It does indeed happen.
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post #62 of 173
4/12/09 at 2:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kai Bengals View Post
My comment wasn't directed at you Cindy, but yes you are missing the point. Just because your dogs don't shed much ( no such thing as a non shedding animal with hair/fur, human or otherwise), doesn't mean they wouldn't cause someone an allergic reaction.

Just curious, are your shelter dogs pedigree'd known breeds or just guesses by the shelter on their background?

The dog the Obama's have has a history, was bred by a reputable breeder and is established as a breed that produces less allergens than other breeds and non-breeds.

Just in case you don't know, "hypoallergenic" means only less allergic reaction producing, not allergen free.

You know President Obama can't support every single thing of importance to a finite portion of the American public. The man has a huge responsibility on his shoulders. As much as I care for the welfare of all animals including those in rescues and shelters, I would rather he concentrate on fixing our economy and world conflicts, than visit shelter after shelter trying to find the perfect hypoallergenic dog match for his girls.

He and his family have a nice dog for his girls that hopefully will not cause them any health issues. There are more important issues to scrutinize him on, this is NOT one of them.
Kai, I don't mean to offend you, I know that you are one of the good breeders.

I just believe that bad breeders, BYB and mills so far outweigh the good guys that it makes my heart hurt.
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post #63 of 173
4/12/09 at 3:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Yep, Bush should have adopted a dog also. But the difference is, Bush never put it out there that he would adopt a dog, Barack did.

Barack knew when he talked about adopting a shelter dog that his daughter had allergies.
If I recall correctly, he never said he would definitely get a shelter dog. He said he would LIKE a shelter dog, a mutt like him - BUT, at the same time, he also said he needed to be careful and do some research as his daughters were allergic. He mentioned this allergy problem at the same interview.
From that, a WISH, NOT A PROMISE, people started getting hopeful, shelters upon shelters going on TV on morning shows to promote shelter dogs to Obama, and a huge expectation was built from there. He did not promise - he said he would like. As far as I am concerned, I would also like to adopt many more cats also, but I can't because of different issues. Obama might as well still like to adopt a shelter dog, but what good would it be, if his daughters were not able to enjoy it? He was doing this for his daughters, not for PR.
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post #64 of 173
4/12/09 at 3:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by white cat lover View Post
I understand the logic of going from a breeder rather than a shelter. I am also VERY happy he didn't get a Doodle (they have enough hype).

I am, however, disappointed - why didn't he come right out & say "due to allergy issues we will likely go to a breeder". Yeah - would've caused flack - and yeah, if my kids were allergic I would want to be sure it was a purebred (thus less likely to cause an allergic reaction).

And we had a PWD in the little po-dunk shelter here. It does indeed happen.
Please, someone tell me why everyone thinks if you have an allergic kid you MUST get a pure bred dog. Someone, please explain it to me because I think that is bullpucky. The dogs purebredness has nothing to do with allergies.

How are purebreds less likely to cause an allergic reaction than my Bichon-Poodle mixes.

And to answer someone's question, no one had to tell me what my dogs are, I can tell by looking at them what they are.

And to the poster that says there is no dog overpopulation, that is a heart piercer for sure. Please tell that to the millions of dogs killed annually in this country. That post made me a bit sick to my stomach. No offense but it did.
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post #65 of 173
4/12/09 at 3:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kscatlady View Post
A Portugese Water Dog wouldn't have ended up in a shelter.
Yeah? I can think of several we have had in our shelter (and we dont make a habit of labelling animals unless we know their breed) and white cat lover said she had one in hers too - it happens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by carolinalima View Post
So, you are saying donations don't save lives in the shelters? This statement is one that hardly makes sense to me. I want to see somebody refusing his donation at the shelter - that would also prove your point by leading by actions, right? Or is this a one way street?
Yes, donations don't save lives in shelters. It wouldn't matter how little money we had in our shelter, if we had space, an animal would be in it. Yes it makes it easier on us when we have more money but even if it meant asking the vets for an extension on our vet bills, adding fundraisers etc we would care for the animals in our care not not euthanise unless absolutely neccesary. What we do need is those cages or spaces empty to allow more animals to come in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by white cat lover View Post
I understand the logic of going from a breeder rather than a shelter. I am also VERY happy he didn't get a Doodle (they have enough hype).

I am, however, disappointed - why didn't he come right out & say "due to allergy issues we will likely go to a breeder". Yeah - would've caused flack - and yeah, if my kids were allergic I would want to be sure it was a purebred (thus less likely to cause an allergic reaction).

And we had a PWD in the little po-dunk shelter here. It does indeed happen.
I agree - he knew his daughters had allergies and he would be able to adopt from any shelter in the US, so would have found a dog in one of them that was a surrender with pedigree. If he had just not said from the beginning that he was looking at shelters, there wouldn't be the same issue.

And as for having the puppy trained elsewhere and then brought to the White House, yeah that teaches his kids responsibility
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post #66 of 173
4/12/09 at 3:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
And to the poster that says there is no dog overpopulation, that is a heart piercer for sure. Please tell that to the millions of dogs killed annually in this country. That post made me a bit sick to my stomach. No offense but it did.
I have some photos taken in my local animal control that dispells that one right away, and our city likes to say it doesn't have a dog overpopulation problem - makes me wonder what the animal control facilities of cities that do look like
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post #67 of 173
4/12/09 at 3:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Please, someone tell me why everyone thinks if you have an allergic kid you MUST get a pure bred dog.
Wiped out this paragraph - I don't think it made any sense. A dog of known heritage, IMO, is less likely to cause an allergic reaction because you know for sure the heritage. I've seen many "designer dogs" toted as such x such mix - and there is a little something else thrown in there too.

You got 2 hypoallergenic dogs from the shelter, but I do think that you'd probably give it more of a chance than the Obama's. I think the idea of finding a PWD pup in a shelter is slim to none - and adopting an adult I don't think is something they really looked into (possibly because of the thought process of "not wanting someone else's problem" - not stated that's what the Obama's thought, but it is a possibility).

I honestly would've wanted to kick his bum if he adopted a dog - the girls were allergic & he returned it to the shelter. Yeah - there's a chance this dog will cause an allergic reaction in the girls, but IMO, less likely than an unknown heritage dog from a shelter.
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post #68 of 173
4/12/09 at 3:17pm
You do not have to know the blood lines of an animal to know if it sheds or not.
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post #69 of 173
4/12/09 at 3:22pm
If you want to know the truth, I knew got the get go that Barack wouldn't adopt a shelter dog or adopt from a rescue, I just knew it. And to the people that said it is right to get a dog from a breeder, yes you are right.

I just really, really wish he had never EVER said he wanted to adopt a shelter dog. Now there is (look at this thread) this big uproar about Obama NOT adopting from a shelter and it makes shelter dogs look even worse than before. I wish he would have just gone and got a dog and not said one dang word about adopting. He has made it way worse IMO.

And to the person that mentioned Biden's breeder, don't believe everything you hear. That icky breeder was cited for deplorable conditions of her own making. She is trying to palm it off on Biden but this is not his fault, she is, from what I have heard, close to a mill breeder.

And at the end of the day, I just can't help thinking about how much good it would have done shelter dogs if Barack had adopted a non-shedding dog from a shelter. Wishful thinking on my part I know.
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post #70 of 173
4/12/09 at 3:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
I just really, really wish he had never EVER said he wanted to adopt a shelter dog.
And at the end of the day, I just can't help thinking about how much good it would have done shelter dogs if Barack had adopted a non-shedding dog from a shelter. Wishful thinking on my part I know.
I have to agree with you 100% here! He was stupid to even suggest that they might go to a shelter. He shot himself in the foot on that, IMO.
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post #71 of 173
4/12/09 at 3:34pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by icklemiss21 View Post
I agree - he knew his daughters had allergies and he would be able to adopt from any shelter in the US, so would have found a dog in one of them that was a surrender with pedigree.
That's the kicker right there. Reputable breeders make sure their dogs don't end up in shelters. If the adopter can no longer take care of the dog, the breeder takes the dog back. Purebreds from puppymills/petstores are a different story, there is no breeder willing to take them back. Even then, purebreds in shelters are often "harvested" by the PB rescues. The rarer the breed, the more likely the dog is to get harvested. This is one of the major sore spots between shelters and PB rescues by the way.
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post #72 of 173
4/12/09 at 3:40pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2dogmom View Post
That's the kicker right there. Reputable breeders make sure their dogs don't end up in shelters. If the adopter can no longer take care of the dog, the breeder takes the dog back. Purebreds from puppymills/petstores are a different story, there is no breeder willing to take them back. Even then, purebreds in shelters are often "harvested" by the PB rescues. The rarer the breed, the more likely the dog is to get harvested. This is one of the major sore spots between shelters and PB rescues by the way.
No they don't. We were given a purebred puppy last year because the owner 'didn't want a lecture' from the breeder. I took it upon myself to call the breeder who 1. wanted us to pay the shipping of the puppy back to him then when I said the shelter couldn't pay it said we could keep it if it was an approved home.

I have tried to get purebred rescues to pull animals before when I see them at animal control but guess what, they get full too

You may be surprised how many purebreds end up in shelters and you dont have to tell me what the sore spots are for shelters, i spend most of my life at the shelter, my problem is purebred rescue calling crying when they have been duped into taking a non purebred they want to dump on a new shelter because the one they took it from wont take it back
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post #73 of 173
4/12/09 at 3:59pm
Now the BIG question is. Will they have this dog neutered or stud him out?
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post #74 of 173
4/12/09 at 4:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Now the BIG question is. Will they have this dog neutered or stud him out?
Oh lets not go there!! Ugh....I'd rather not think about it.
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post #75 of 173
4/12/09 at 4:20pm
I get it now.

Obama is BAD because he considered the possibility of getting a shelter dog but didn't.

Former presidents are GOOD because they never even considered getting a shelter dog.

I guess George HW Bush must be a REAL GOOD guy since his purebred Springer Spaniel Millie had a litter of puppies while he was in the White House. Maybe little George needed to witness the miracle of life?
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post #76 of 173
4/12/09 at 4:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2dogmom View Post

I guess George HW Bush must be a REAL GOOD guy since his purebred Springer Spaniel Millie had a litter of puppies while he was in the White House. Maybe little George needed to witness the miracle of life?
Good one!
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post #77 of 173
4/12/09 at 5:00pm
I was just reading a thread about this subject at Petfinder and an Obama supporter, a big time Obama supporter said she had gotten an email from
Michelle Obama via Best Friends network that said they "would adopt, not buy a dog when they got to the White House". That makes it worse.

And yes, it is bad that Bush had an intact dog that puppies in the WH. I assume it was Millie. That totally sucks.

I would link to the PF thread but I don't know if that is against the rules.
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post #78 of 173
4/12/09 at 5:09pm
Well, I did a search on Best Friends website.

http://network.bestfriends.org/news/....aspx?np=29375

Quote:
We are thrilled to share this wonderful news: Michelle Obama announced on Entertainment Tonight that they would indeed, “adopt a rescue dog.â€
I think that is a tad more than saying they "may" adopt. But then that was dated October 3rd, a month before the election.
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post #79 of 173
4/12/09 at 5:17pm
I would just like to point out there is a PWD mix in a Washington, DC shelter.
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post #80 of 173
4/12/09 at 5:29pm
I'm willing to bet that there are more people knowingly let their domestic cats breed in the world than pedigree breeders full stop. Look at how many you see on here.

He got a dog from a breeder - get over it. Did Bush do everything he said? I think not!
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post #81 of 173
4/12/09 at 5:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbbysMom View Post
The girls' health trumps all.
I agree.
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post #82 of 173
4/12/09 at 6:31pm
All the breeders I know do take their pets back if the people have to give them up.
Someone posted a list of dogs that are ok with allergies.
I can say at least half the dogs on that list would make me sick.
I got bashed for getting a sphynx in another group even though my other cats are not purebreds. It was not even a cat group.
Not all breeders are bad like some of you seem to think.
We did adopt a German Short Hair from the pound and she lived 15 years.








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post #83 of 173
4/12/09 at 7:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mews2much View Post

Not all breeders are bad like some of you seem to think.
I dont think any of us are saying that all breeders are bad, simply that he did more damage than anything by saying he would get a shelter dog and then getting a purebred - not to mention how hard shelters work to tell people not to buy animals as gifts when the President is receiving one as a gift.

If he had said from the beginning that he was going to a breeder because his daughters have bad allergies - no big deal, but its like saying oh shelters aren't good enough or there is something wrong with the dogs in them that is what people are upset about
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post #84 of 173
4/12/09 at 7:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by WellingtonCats View Post
I'm willing to bet that there are more people knowingly let their domestic cats breed in the world than pedigree breeders full stop. Look at how many you see on here.

He got a dog from a breeder - get over it. Did Bush do everything he said? I think not!
Ain't that the truth. Much ado about nothing again. I swear people will find anything to disparage Obama.
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post #85 of 173
4/12/09 at 7:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
2. Nope, not illegal, but to me and many others, it is immoral to buy from a breeder.
I think it was this comment that turned into a "its bad to buy it from a breeder" topic.

Yes, there are a lot of homeless and neglected animals in the world, but to try and put that blame on anyone who gets a pedigree pet, doesnt make any sense.

He may have suggested that he would look into getting a shelter dog, but maybe after he weighed his options, and decided to go with something else, he didnt feel like holding a press conference to let everyone know. It was just a decision that was made and he went with it.
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post #86 of 173
4/12/09 at 7:45pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pami View Post
Yes, there are a lot of homeless and neglected animals in the world, but to try and put that blame on anyone who gets a pedigree pet, doesnt make any sense.
Thank you.

I applaud those who adopt shelter cats - I've done so in the past - but I refuse to apologize for owning purebred cats.
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post #87 of 173
4/12/09 at 7:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by WellingtonCats View Post
I'm willing to bet that there are more people knowingly let their domestic cats breed in the world than pedigree breeders full stop. Look at how many you see on here.

He got a dog from a breeder - get over it. Did Bush do everything he said? I think not!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosemite View Post
Ain't that the truth. Much ado about nothing again. I swear people will find anything to disparage Obama.
to both.
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post #88 of 173
4/12/09 at 7:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Well, I did a search on Best Friends website.

http://network.bestfriends.org/news/....aspx?np=29375



I think that is a tad more than saying they "may" adopt. But then that was dated October 3rd, a month before the election.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pami View Post
I think it was this comment that turned into a "its bad to buy it from a breeder" topic.

Yes, there are a lot of homeless and neglected animals in the world, but to try and put that blame on anyone who gets a pedigree pet, doesnt make any sense.

He may have suggested that he would look into getting a shelter dog, but maybe after he weighed his options, and decided to go with something else, he didnt feel like holding a press conference to let everyone know. It was just a decision that was made and he went with it.
May have suggested? I think not. Check out my link I posted, his wife said they were definitely adopting and she said it on National TV a month before the election.

I know many people just think it is one more lie to add to a growing list of lies that Barack has made but, IMO, this is the worst.

This going back on his word about adopting sends a message to people to buy from a breeder.

If one can't see where I am coming from I don't know how else to phrase it.

A wonderful opportunity for shelter dogs across America just went down the drain. Good job Barack.

Barack said the dog was for the girls and he even had his picture taken with a cute little white poodle (the girls wanted a small dog) but then Barack Obama cant have a "girlie" dog, can he?
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post #89 of 173
4/12/09 at 8:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by plainjane View Post
This was my first voting election, so it's not really a double standard in my opinion. Plus, Obama mentioned adopting from a shelter, considering it or whatever, so it was a setup of his own making.

All in all, I think people who argue that this isn't immoral are busy making excuses, avoiding facts, and minimizing the relivence of the issue.

All in all, Obama isn't at fault for getting a pure-bred. Not in the least. He is at fault for lacking to promote adopting from shelters and rescues. Most average Americans don't have Ted Kennedy as a bff and cannot afford the kinds of things he does. Therefore, backyard-breeders will now be selling their PWDs to average Americans who want to imitate the President's 'wise' choice. This will only continue to promote illegit breeders.

I've had my say, and I'm done.
We'll have to agree to disagree. I don't think any owner of a purebreed denies the troubling fact of animal over population. We just disagree on the cause. The best defense is a strong spay/neuter program to prevent the overpopulation to begin with. Someone posted links to evidence of this fact. It is why I donate to Alley Cats Allies and when the feral cat at my mom's work had kittens I had her call them to trap and nueter them before they kept reproducing. There are too many animal that need homes that even if everyone did adopt from a shelter there would still be overpopulation. To focus or blame breeders and people who get purebreeds and not the root cause is a mistake in my opinion. Frankly President Obama did more to bring attention to shelters than any other president has. And as for his donation to the Washington SPCA, they have a good spay/neuter program. http://www.washhumane.org/snclinic.asp
If they use the donation for thier spay/neuter clinic they prevent more pregnancies than the one dog that would have been adopted. So the donation will do much good. It was a personal choice. It is not to say that shelter dogs are not a good choice. There were two good choices available to him and he did what he thought best for his family.
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post #90 of 173
4/12/09 at 8:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
This going back on his word about adopting sends a message to people to buy from a breeder.

If one can't see where I am coming from I don't know how else to phrase it.
I get where you are coming from I just disagree that it is immoral to buy from a breeder. Nor do I have a problem with President Obama's reason for getting a purebreed. Just a difference of opinions.
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