Ally and Ollie meet Thursday, and I leave the following Wednesday

lawguy

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Would I have a pretty good idea if Ally and Ollie aren't going to fight after observing them for a week?

They're going to be put together in the morning this Thursday, the 2nd.... I have to go away on the 8th in the evening.

I have to go back up to Minneapolis to take care of some fine print as far as the apartment is concerned (and start working on getting it furnished). I'll be up there only for a few days, returning on the 11th.

They just got closer than they've been before, meeting face to face, inches away, but separated by glass (Ollie is now in a glass enclosed area b/c I don't want to keep him in a crate, but he figured out how to escape the room he was in before). Neither of them got defensive. Ollie put his paw up to the glass wanted to touch Ally, and Ally just kind of stood there looking, curious.

A family member will keep an eye on them and clean the litter box while I'm away.

My only concern is whether I'd know if they were gong to fight at all within 7 days of them being together.

Oh... and then unfortunately Ally is getting spayed 2 days after I get back, but fortunately I'll be here for that (I made sure of that). The whole trip was actually scheduled around giving me as much time as possible to monitor the two of them together, being away only as long as necessary, and coming back before Ally is spayed.

This time, I'm the only one going, so there will be 3 adults still here to check on them. The downside - I have to give them the key to my room (the lock was put in place because of irresponsible behavior on their part)
 

howtoholdacat

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It's hard to say for sure but I think that once you see them together you'll know. From what you describe it sounds like things can be expected to go well between them but sometimes you just don't know until you try. How old are they?
 
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lawguy

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both are very young. Ollie is 3 months old and Ally is 4 months old.
 

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When we rescued our first kitty, we didn't know a thing about cats. It was kind of like you and Ally! It is also why and how I found TCS.
One week later we decided he needed a pal, so we brought his brother inside. We didn't know to separate them, etc. etc. etc. We just figured - they were brothers, they'd only been separated a week.

When we brought Shelly inside, they were 11 or 12 weeks old. Gary handed him in to me through the door. He looked up at me and realized - HEY - I'M INSIDE! And shot out of my arms like a bullet. Lazlo saw a moving target and went for it. They zinged around for a few minutes before they became a rolling ball of fur. There was no screaming and not much fur flying, but it definitely freaked us out. They retreated to different places. We had a decision to make - we had to take Gary's mom to the airport. Should we both go? We decided they weren't going to kill each other. We were gone about 3 hours. We came back and couldn't find them anywhere. Finally, the last place we looked, the crate, they were both passed out all tangled up together.
We figured they were fighting and passed out.

But that was it. After that they were pretty much pals. There were definitely hisses and swats when one wanted to be in the exact spot the other kitty was sitting or lying. But they often curled up together. Or they just crammed themselves into the same bed because one wanted in there and the other refused to give it up.


Long story short, cat introductions go much more smoothly when done slowly. But it's much more important that they be "managed" when it comes to older cats than with kittens. Given there's no signs of aggression, just curiosity between them now, with supervised interaction, they may not need more than a day or two before they're OK being together. It totally depends upon their personalities. But given they're both young and they're opposite gender (we always had a problem with our females being jealous of other females), you may find that if they don't actually like each other in terms of being cuddle buddies, they find a peaceful co-existence pretty quickly. Trust your instincts more than "rules" of introduction, I guess is what I'm saying.


it all goes well!!!!!!!!!!!!

Laurie
 

darlili

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And, truly, don't be upset if/when you hear a hiss, or even observe a tussle. Even the most lovey-dovey cats will get annoyed now and again, and the little ones learn a lot with play fighting and wrestling. I've been told that if you don't see blood or large clumps of fur anywhere, you're doing pretty well! Ally may not quite know how to play nice at first, since she didn't have the advantage of siblings for a while, but I bet they learn pretty darn fast from each other.

If you notice them seriously stalking each other or really going at it, have a toy handy to distract one or both of them. And if you really feel you need to break anything up, have a towel handy to shield your hands and arms - even baby claws can be owey!

Have you had a chance to read up on cat language - especially how tails and ears can show intent, whether playful or 'I'm mad!'. But they're so young, I don't think you'll have any major issues, other than needing new cards for the camera to capture the interactions.
 
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lawguy

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I was given the ok today on putting Ally and Ollie together a day early (as far as the URI is concerned) so I initially put them in the same room with a gate separating them, but Ollie can jump over the gate.


So, I figured that the gate was a lost cause and just let the two of them get to know each other.

No fighting, but Ally is hissing a lot at Ollie, even when she seems to be playing with him.

Is there such a thing as play-hissing? Or is she just telling Ollie who is boss here?

Should I blow on her when she hisses at him?
 
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lawguy

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Ally may not quite know how to play nice at first, since she didn't have the advantage of siblings for a while, but I bet they learn pretty darn fast from each other.

If you notice them seriously stalking each other or really going at it, have a toy handy to distract one or both of them. And if you really feel you need to break anything up, have a towel handy to shield your hands and arms - even baby claws can be owey!

Have you had a chance to read up on cat language - especially how tails and ears can show intent, whether playful or 'I'm mad!'. But they're so young, I don't think you'll have any major issues, other than needing new cards for the camera to capture the interactions.
Yeah, Ally definitely doesn't seem to know how to play nice. Ollie seems pretty laid back about the whole thing, but Ally is giving him a hard time.

I haven't read up on cat language. I will do so now.
 

ut0pia

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Ollie is probably more used to other cats because he was with his sister at the shelter and also saw many cats there. Ally is most likely just scared of him since she hasn't had much cat communication...
 

darlili

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Exactly - one thing I read was, once the cats are meeting each other, is to give them treats or feed them near each other, so they start associating 'being nice' with 'getting nice stuff'. Also, honestly, I've truly read that it's good to keep telling the resident cat (Ally) that she's #1, that Ollie is 'her' kitten, and that you love her so very very much. She's the one who has to share now, and she'll need reassurance that you love her just as much as you ever did.

The tossing a toy in their direction worked well for me - I figured mine weren't intent on hating each other, since a toy always distracted them. I only had one 'halloween cat' scene (exactly what you think - fur puffed up and tail enormous and straight up!), and my resident girl was the one doing that.

BTW, girls are always more territorial - this is definitely her house you're disrupting!
Don't let her think she's being punished at any time - if she goes after Ollie for real, just try to distract them or toss a towel over one and separate them for a bit.
 
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lawguy

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Ally is being confrontational. She tries to cut Ollie off wherever he goes and growls/hisses at him.

Ollie is hiding under a cabinet right now and Ally keeps poking her head in underneath and growling/hissing.

I put there food next to each other and for about 45 seconds the two of them ate separated by inches and there was a moment of peace.

I hope Ally settles down after a day or two. Ollie seems to be getting a little depressed but I feel that if I separate him now, he'll feel like he did something wrong.

Ally also keeps slapping him in the face with her paw.
 

ldg

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Oh definitely make sure to give Ally attention before Ollie, put treats down for her first, rub him all over with a rag and leave it under the food dish, etc.

...and our cats get "puffy tails" when playing - but behavior to watch out for is a ridged back, ears back and flat - tail flat or down and very agitated - THOSE are not play but true aggression. But she'll bop him on the head to put him in his place, and they may roll and tussle... I agree with what others have posted.


BTW - we had a kitty that was abused, and FREAKED by taking anything out that could be thrown over her (had to make sure she didn't see us making the bed, for example). We break up fights by shaking an empty can with coins in it or just clapping really loudly. Those usually work just fine.

But it is important to reward "nice" interaction, and stop truly aggressive stuff, and as Darlili pointed out, just make sure Ally knows she's your #1.

Laurie
 
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lawguy

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Ally finally let Ollie relax and get some sleep. He's passed out on my recliner and she's passed out under the bed.

So far, no blood shed. The environment feels a little more relaxed right now with them asleep. lol
 

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If they're eating near each other, that's a great sign! It'll take a little bit - just try to stay calm and positive yourself, because they will pick up on any stress.

And my Dante was a little sad when Dharma wasn't in love with him right away - but now it's sweet how he'll come over to her to be groomed, and how he'll groom her in return. I was so nervous during our intro week, but it was well worth it. Just give yourself, and them, some time!

Oh, if you see Ally guarding the litter box, not a bad idea to get at least one other box in a different location so poor Ollie can go to the bathroom in peace.

BTW, the hissing my start all over whenever one goes someplace the other doesn't - like the vet. Cats like the smells to stay stable - and nothing like vet smell to make everyone a little nervous.
 

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I read somewhere on the internet, wish I could remember where, for cats that aren't getting along put tuna juice on their backs. Then they'll be preoccupied cleaning themselves and maybe even start grooming each other. I've never tried it before I just thought of it.
 
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lawguy

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Well, Ally accomplished her goal. Ollie is now scared of her. Whenever he needs to get by her he runs because he knows she's going to hiss at him.

Also, if she's near the bed and he comes around the corner, he dives under the bed for cover.

The look on his face when he sees her now is "OH SNAP! INCOMMMMMMING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! TAKE COVER!!!!!!!!!"

If Ally would just be nice, Ollie is so ready to be friends. Ally just isn't.

She is on high alert everywhere in the room now. Her ears are perked up and doing the little radar thing. She looks for him, just to get in his face to growl and hiss.

Poor Ollie..... and then when I try to comfort him, I feel like I'm feeding into the problem. I'm trying to give Ally lots of hugs and kisses to make sure she knows that I still love her just as much as I did before and that she's my little girl... but no results yet.
 

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Ally sounds like a mini-Dharma when I first brought Dante in. Just give yourself some time - I know it feels like forever, and frustrating to boot when you see Ollie just wants to play and have fun, but I think it'll work out. Heck, Dharma was so mad at me when I brought 'that boy' in, that she had her only litter box accident -and it was no accident. She made sure she pooped in the middle of the hallway when I was watching! Today when I left, they were both curled up on the couch next to each other, napping.

I think the intro thread on this site recommends putting a little vanilla on both kitties - so that they'll have that communal smell.

It's a shame Feliway isn't an instant answer. But, honestly, see how today goes. Granted, Ally is a strong little personality, but I bet she starts giving a little.
 
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lawguy

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I sprayed the whole room with Quiet Moments before I put them both together. I went through a whole bottle of it. It's supposedly like Feliway, but I don't know how good it is... and it seems to not be working.

I'm wondering if maybe the smells on Ollie from the shelter are part of the problem and if giving him a bath will help. The only problem with that was he was neutered on the 23rd and I don't know if 8-9 days is enough healing time before I can safely bathe him.
 

darlili

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Give them some time - she's not actually biting him hard and drawing blood or anything? Or either of them looking like Halloween cats all the time?

Other than maybe the tuna juice recommended, or looking up that vanilla trick, I wouldn't change his smells anymore. He's probably cleaned himself pretty well anyway, and that's the odor she's getting used to. Have you tried that trick with rubbing each down with a tee-shirt or towel, and then putting Ally's towel under Ollie's food bowl, and vice versa?

i know it's hard - I was so sure mine would love each other right away, and it did take about 4 days before Dante could sleep on the bed - and a few months before they'd both sleep on one side of me - before that, each had their own side, thank you very much!
 
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lawguy

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They both slept on the bed last night, although it was defcon 1 the whole time.

Nobody has drawn blood yet to my knowledge. Ally is just growling, hissing, chasing Ollie out of places, pouncing on him, and cutting him off wherever he goes just so she can growl and hiss in his face.

I had done the towel thing beforehand while they were separated. I will go ahead and place them next to each other's food bowls now. Also, their food is adjacent to each other's.

I will read up on the vanilla trick.

Ollie is only showing mild aggression from time to time now, I'm guessing in response to Ally's aggression (he didn't show any yesterday).... Ally is mad as hell and showing aggression 100% of the time.

I don't understand why. She seemed to have no problem with him before. I guess it's just the whole "sharing" thing that's upsetting her.
 
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