Latest on the atheist bus advertisments

He just can't do that. The same with pharmacist and their religious beliefs on birth control, or the morning after pill. No one cares about your religion at work because they don't pay you for your opinion.

I think this part of the article says it all.

Actually that's not true. US health care providers currently have the choice to opt out of providing services that conflict with their moral codes. But the future administration looks to pass the FOCA legislation that would require them to perform such procedures, at which point I imagine the many Catholic hospitals around the Country will shut down before they start performing abortions. I would expect other private hospitals that are faith-based would follow suit, I can't see them agreeing to perform legal euthanization.

Citizens might then realize exactly how much these "darn religious people" do for this Country, when they can't find a doctor or hospital due to shortages.

I'm surprised at how vague the Hippocratic oath is interpreted, TBH.

As far as the bus drive, I'd agree with "good on him." It may cost him his job, but a man with the courage to stand up for his beliefs in spite of the risk is okay in my book.

I'm kind of on the fence about this issue. On one hand, it is his job and his employer is a non-faith based bus company, but on the other hand, couldn't they assign him to another bus?

As for the pharmacist thing...if the employer of that pharamcist is a non-faith based on (i.e., CVS or Walgreens), they will be fire for refusing to fill a prescription for faith reasons. If the employer IS faith based, then the pharmacist can refuse to fill it. I believe that should be left alone.

And don't get me started on the negative effects FOCA could have...

That was actually my point. Which was what I was trying to say. I feel that I compared them both.

No, I don't agree with either. Your job is your job and if you want money, you have to work.

With how much the health care industry pays, I highly doubth there will ever be a shortage.

From reading the article, it would appear that the driver has agreed to drive one of the buses if they are no others available, and the company has agreed to do everything possible to provide him with a bus with alternate advertising. That would actually make the entire thing a non-issue, and was most likely only reported as "news" because it appealed to someone's "persecution complex".

Neet, I agree with you!!!

Jesus warned his disciples (then and for the future) that we would be persecuted for standing up for Him. You see it more and more. You have to make the choice to stand up for Hm or cower and not speak up.

Apply it to anything you feel strongly about. I would not ride in a car that had a bumper sticker on it that said, "Cats, the other white meat". Seriously, I wouldn't. This man has his beliefs and I have to respect that he's willing to speak up for them. Personally, if I have to ride a bus I'd prefer it didn't have any advertising on it.

Just curious, but what would you all say if an atheist had refused to drive the bus with the Christian advertisements?

I feel the same way about several things. Like cable TV! With what they charge for it, you'd think it would be commercial free, yet you find more advertising on cable channels than off-air ones.

I'm not really sure where you see the persecution in this article? The driver went home the first day because walking out to the bus park and seeing that on his bus was a shock to his senses, which is understandable. But, he and the company agreed that he would drive one of the buses if there were no others available, and the company would do their best to ensure he got another bus if at all possible.

So, other than the back of the columnists mind, where is the persecution here?

I agree. It seem like moral courage fails a long time before pysical courage, and good on him for taking a stand for what he believes.

Or you could just do your JOB.

I can't believe this made news how stupid. Boy must be a slow news day when a guy refuses to do his job.

You know perhaps it's against my religious beliefs to not answer phones. It was in my job description, therefore I have to do it.

His job description was "Drive the bus". He refused and he should be repremanded for it. No one cares about his opinion the same way no one should care about a stupid advertisement on a bus. Yippie.

Is there nothing that your employer could advertise that would cause you to object for personal reasons? Of course, it couldn't be against the law, etc. A job is a job, but every one of us I would think has a point where we draw the line. I doubt this person ever thought he would see this on the side of his bus.

Depending on your politics... you come to work and see a big

IMPEACH OBAMA

sign in the front window. What would you do if that bothered you? Say, oh well, it's my job? I feel sorry for someone that has to drive a billboard around for beliefs they find offensive. Myself... I could drive this bus without a problem, but I understand where this person is coming from.

Exactly, Cinder. It's about personal responsibility for actions you take for your beliefs.

I personally don't think a sign regarding a social issue counts as "advertising." I understand it was to raise money for a worthy cause, but I don't understand the need to imflame. Why not just have a raffle or an auction or something? Why spend money on signage, donate all the monies raised to the cause. But then again, I don't agree with all the political ads we saw here in the US, or commercials for legal services (ambulance chasing.) Advertising is for products or services, which none of these can be classified as.

Yes I would. I have my own beliefs that I share outside of work. It's not my job to worry about my employers job. I go to work to do my job, they give me money to do it. Don't like it, then leave.

Thumbs up for the driver. He was hired to drive the bus, not to promote political or religious/non-religious philosophies. Bus companies should stick to displaying innocuous ads for household products, or tourist destinations, etc.

BTW, the atheists don't exactly have the strength of their convictions if they need to use the word "probably" in their ad. Seems to me they're hedging their bets...

http://www.atheistcampaign.org/

Just the facts.

I'm at work right now and have limited research abilities, but it seems to me that the "probably" was addressed in the original articles a few months ago. If I recall correctly, they had to go with the "probably" in order to get the signs approved by the bus line.

I'll look into that when I get home.

One did here, I only heard about it because the bus drivers were talking about it in the train station while keeping warm between routes. He switched buses while the adverts were on the bus and someone else drove that bus for the duration of the advertisement.

They are talking about having the advert here, but unlike the usual argument, ours stems from saying that people who believe in God don't relax, or worry too much and so don't enjoy life.

They are also not allowing the one about fairies found here: http://www.jonworth.eu/downloads/ath...s/tubecard.jpg

After going to the link Anakat provided it looks like the campaign is really doing its job and getting people talking!

I'm an atheist but I respect other beliefs and I wouldn't have a problem driving a bus with a christian message - but I think most athiests feel this way

That's a very good link. Before condemning the ads and tube cards, people should really listen to what the initiator, Ariane Sherine, has to say about why she started the action, especially in "Thought For the Afternoon".

The Washington, D.C. bus ads placed by the American Humanist Association are equally in good taste, IMO.

Thats what he was prepared to do.

I think some of us do things in our jobs that we find less than tasteful. I also think most of us have a line that we will not cross.

Just consider hypothetically (because we don't know this man's heart) that this man loves God and has a genuine relationship with Him. He wants to please God, but driving this bus would hurt Him instead. He made a choice. He's a bus driver. He probably doesn't have a lot of money. Perhaps he took this stance knowing the financial hardship that it could put him in. He did it anyway.

He stood up for his convictions.

I am not saying the bus company doesn't have a right to advertise what they choose.

Good point. I was thinking that.

That would be his choice.

As a non Christian i have (of my own accord) been in volunteer jobs through St Vincent de pauls and the Salvation Army. Of course, none of my fellow co-workers knew i was not christian because i chose not to tell them and just get on with my job. I've found non-christians don't work in those two groups, and as loving a message as they tend to send out, the churches and places i've been to did not like atheists and pagans. It's just so funny how as long as you go along with someone else beliefs and nod along and don't bring up your own ideals, that everything is fine. But once you speak up, you get attacked. Now that wasn't me complaining about anything, but trying to make a point. Now i won' start ranting about the whole certain 'religious people telling non religious people they can't possibly be good or moral without a belief system', because that's a whole new thread!

But once people start approaching me in the street or while i'm shopping, and attacking me with their beliefs, THATS when i get angry. A billboard or poster is not an attack. Having a mormon or born again come up to you (true story) and TELL you that you are lost, you NEED to find god or you will burn in hell (oh i find that one such a loving line) that's when it's an attack on other groups. And yes, my family is of mixed beliefs so i'm not pulling this out of my behind.

You know, if they guy has a major issue, it's fine that he spoke up about it, but an entire company shouldn't have to bend to the wishes of one employee, employees are generally replaceable.

And i don't see how a sign saying 'there probably is no god' is more offensive than a sign saying 'there is a god'. One side v another side imo.

A bus driver will come up against drunk, abusive people, loud children who swear and damage property, aggro old ladies who are extremely offensive and always think they're right. And these things are going to be easier for him to deal with than a banner that is supposedly attacking his faith, a banner he probably won't see for however long his shift lasts? Why be a bus driver if you aren't ready to deal with every day drama.

Yes i can see now this post is probably not going to get good replies or wil be seen as irrelevent, but i'm willing to take the chance.