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McCain & Obama @ Ground Zero - Page 2

post #31 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosemite View Post
We are having our own election for the leader of our country here in less than a month and the coverage is based on the issues of the country and where the candidate stands on the issues,
A quick Google of "Canada elections mudslinging" tells me a different story. Sounds like right now the issues are taking a back seat to apologies over Puffin poop and comparisons to Hitler.
post #32 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecanopener View Post
A quick Google of "Canada elections mudslinging" tells me a different story. Sounds like right now the issues are taking a back seat to apologies over Puffin poop and comparisons to Hitler.
Yes, there have been a couple goofs by our politicians but they were quickly recalled and apologized for. These "couple" of instances you provide are a mere drop in the bucket compared to what I've been seeing posted and linked to just on this site alone. It truly boggles my mind.
post #33 of 51
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CC12 View Post
We may be on different sides of the aisle for this election but you make reasonable comments. Ground zero is not a place to rejoice. It is a very somber reminder of a very sad time. I think it is so desperate to critique his demeanor and make suppositions about what someone was feeling based on your bias against a candidate.

But of course it is okay to say vicious things about Michelle Obama. The report was that she spent the evenings at home with her children and had a speaking engagement on the 10th in Cincinnati which is a 3 1/2 hour drive from Chicago which doesn't mean she didn't fly. It was her children's first week at school: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080908/...ma_daughters_2 Bush was at the pentagon with the disgrace that is Rumsfeld and Laura, Cheney and his wife were at the White House.

The throwing flowers part is so petty and it is proper etiquette to toss a flower. People do it at funerals all of the time. I did it when my grandmother was lowered in the ground. People do it at large memorials and
funerals.

see the right wing blogosphere are again making silly and not mention wrong statements. They seem to never have an issue with his stances on the economy or universal health care but try to find something wrong in imaginary little things.

Yes, as I mentioned earlier in this thread, flowers are tossed, by the family, as a family members casket is lowered into the ground. It is an honor reserved for family.

Personally I have never seen people throw flowers at funerals, but I don't think I have ever waited at the graveside for the casket to be lowered.

But this was a Memorial service, which is a service without a body or bodies. As such, wreaths and flowers get placed not tossed IMO.

Quote:
They seem to never have an issue with his stances on the economy or universal health care but try to find something wrong in imaginary little things.
Really? Never? Thatl is a pretty broad, general brush you have there, but that's okay.

As for Michelle Obama, with all the bad press she received regarding her statement, "This is the first time of my adult life that I have been proud of my country", I really thought she would make an appearance somewhere, anywhere to honor the day of September 11th. If she didn't feel the need that's fine.
post #34 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Yes, as I mentioned earlier in this thread, flowers are tossed, by the family, as a family members casket is lowered into the ground. It is an honor reserved for family.

Personally I have never seen people throw flowers at funerals, but I don't think I have ever waited at the graveside for the casket to be lowered.

But this was a Memorial service, which is a service without a body or bodies. As such, wreaths and flowers get placed not tossed IMO.



Really? Never? Thatl is a pretty broad, general brush you have there, but that's okay.

As for Michelle Obama, with all the bad press she received regarding her statement, "This is the first time of my adult life that I have been proud of my country", I really thought she would make an appearance somewhere, anywhere to honor the day of September 11th. If she didn't feel the need that's fine.
Better do some more research into "floral etiquette".

As far as Michelle Obama's statement is concerned:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGjR8...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CqsDydV-I6E&NR=1
post #35 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Yes, as I mentioned earlier in this thread, flowers are tossed, by the family, as a family members casket is lowered into the ground. It is an honor reserved for family.

Personally I have never seen people throw flowers at funerals, but I don't think I have ever waited at the graveside for the casket to be lowered.

But this was a Memorial service, which is a service without a body or bodies. As such, wreaths and flowers get placed not tossed IMO.



Really? Never? Thatl is a pretty broad, general brush you have there, but that's okay.

As for Michelle Obama, with all the bad press she received regarding her statement, "This is the first time of my adult life that I have been proud of my country", I really thought she would make an appearance somewhere, anywhere to honor the day of September 11th. If she didn't feel the need that's fine.
But you are parsing words. The flower thing is a non issue. It is acceptable etiquette to toss single flowers at a memorial.

Michelle Obama is allowed to make a statement that was not well thought out. Even Laura Bush defended her.

It may seem like a broad brush but that is truly all I am hearing and seeing. I am voting on issues. McCain and the right seem to want to talk about anything BUT the issues.
post #36 of 51
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosemite View Post
Yes, there have been a couple goofs by our politicians but they were quickly recalled and apologized for. These "couple" of instances you provide are a mere drop in the bucket compared to what I've been seeing posted and linked to just on this site alone. It truly boggles my mind.
Why won't they let the female leader of the Green Party in the debates?
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/indepth/fed...vote_debates_1


From what I get from this short article, Canada's elections span a much shorter span of time.
http://m.rockymountainnews.com/news/...-of-elections/

It is hard to compare the two countries I think though, because of the huge difference in population for one thing. I wish our population was more the size of Canada's for sure, instead of ten times it. 300 million people is just way to many.
post #37 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Why won't they let the female leader of the Green Party in the debates?
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/indepth/fed...vote_debates_1


From what I get from this short article, Canada's elections span a much shorter span of time.
http://m.rockymountainnews.com/news/...-of-elections/

It is hard to compare the two countries I think though, because of the huge difference in population for one thing. I wish our population was more the size of Canada's for sure, instead of ten times it. 300 million people is just way to many.
I will agree with the overpopulation statement. I love the West because of that fact. It is not as populated here.
post #38 of 51
Thread Starter 
Ditto that CC12.


Tricia, did you post some "floral etiquette" links that I have overlooked?
post #39 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Ditto that CC12.


Tricia, did you post some "floral etiquette" links that I have overlooked?
No, I didn't, because my notebook wasn't working, and I was accessing TCS using my "Pocket PC", i.e., PDA. Don't get me started on IE updates!
post #40 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Why won't they let the female leader of the Green Party in the debates?
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/indepth/fed...vote_debates_1


From what I get from this short article, Canada's elections span a much shorter span of time.
http://m.rockymountainnews.com/news/...-of-elections/

It is hard to compare the two countries I think though, because of the huge difference in population for one thing. I wish our population was more the size of Canada's for sure, instead of ten times it. 300 million people is just way to many.
Actually she will be in the debate. I believe our current PM (whom I shall never vote for) is one of the people that didn't want her in the debate but she fought it and won so yes, she will be part of the debate.

Amount of pre-election time shouldn't have any bearing on debating issues rather than what someone was wearing, what functions they attend, what jewellery they were wearing, ad nauseum. As for the population, I fail to see how that has any relevance to the mind-set or meanness of the voting public. You can have a large mean group or a small mean group or a large respectful group or a small respectful group. So population doesn't have any bearing on my statement about folks not discussing the issues rather than the inane, unimportant issues.
post #41 of 51
Thread Starter 
Oh, I could have sworn I read in that article I linked to that 3 out of your 4 parties were objecting to her being in the debate.

And maybe the,
Quote:
Amount of pre-election time shouldn't have any bearing on debating issues
I agree, but it does. If we only had 36-74 days for the entire campaign, it would be much different. But that is just my opinion of course.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosemite View Post
Actually she will be in the debate. I believe our current PM (whom I shall never vote for) is one of the people that didn't want her in the debate but she fought it and won so yes, she will be part of the debate.

Amount of pre-election time shouldn't have any bearing on debating issues rather than what someone was wearing, what functions they attend, what jewellery they were wearing, ad nauseum. As for the population, I fail to see how that has any relevance to the mind-set or meanness of the voting public. You can have a large mean group or a small mean group or a large respectful group or a small respectful group. So population doesn't have any bearing on my statement about folks not discussing the issues rather than the inane, unimportant issues.
post #42 of 51
I heard on the CBC radio last week that she is in the debate so your link may be "old news".

I agree, but it does. If we only had 36-74 days for the entire campaign, it would be much different. But that is just my opinion of course.

You mean if there was less time before the actual election folks may actually discuss the political issues instead of everything but the issues?
post #43 of 51
I can't even believe that this thread is arguing about placing or tossing flowers.

How's the economy doing these days? How many new bankruptcies this last month? What about the decline in housing starts and the lackluster housing market? What about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac? What's the latest unemployment rate? Food prices up? Gas prices up? Wages declining?

My husband likes to put it this way. Your house is on fire and when the fire department arrives to put it out, you point at the cat in the tree across the street, ask them to get it down and let your house burn.

Flowers? Economy?
post #44 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by Momofmany View Post
I can't even believe that this thread is arguing about placing or tossing flowers.

How's the economy doing these days? How many new bankruptcies this last month? What about the decline in housing starts and the lackluster housing market? What about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac? What's the latest unemployment rate? Food prices up? Gas prices up? Wages declining?

My husband likes to put it this way. Your house is on fire and when the fire department arrives to put it out, you point at the cat in the tree across the street, ask them to get it down and let your house burn.

Flowers? Economy?
Exactly my point! I am totally surprised that on none of these political threads in IMO actual real important issues are discussed. I don't care if someone doesn't have the same political beliefs but it would be nice to see them discussed so that those of us in other countries could get a feel for what Americans think of the things that will affect them with their new President instead of all this nonsense about clothes, jewellery, flower tossing versus placing, etc. Why not discuss some of the issues you raised?
post #45 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Oh, I could have sworn I read in that article I linked to that 3 out of your 4 parties were objecting to her being in the debate.

And maybe the, I agree, but it does. If we only had 36-74 days for the entire campaign, it would be much different. But that is just my opinion of course.

I just wanted to add that this lends credence to my original post. Instead of focusing on the real issues facing the US with the election of whichever one of these candidates gets elected into office, you have chosen to try to dig up some dirt on the Canadian election. How is that productive?
post #46 of 51
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosemite View Post

We are having our own election for the leader of our country here in less than a month and the coverage is based on the issues of the country and where the candidate stands on the issues, not on what the candidate wears, what their wives wear, what jewellery they had on, how they "place or throw" a flower on a memorial, whether their wife was with the children instead of on the campaign trail, and the list goes on.

I've seen little information on what actual issues the US folks will be voting on - all I've seen is mud-slinging and links to more mud-slinging.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosemite View Post
I just wanted to add that this lends credence to my original post. Instead of focusing on the real issues facing the US with the election of whichever one of these candidates gets elected into office, you have chosen to try to dig up some dirt on the Canadian election. How is that productive?
Not trying to dig up dirt, you mentioned how your election process is "based on the issues, etc" so I wanted to see if I could find out why Canada is so much better than the United States. I found out why, IMO, it is because it is only 60 days long. There is no time to talk about anything else but the issues. The US definitely needs to take a lesson from Canada and shorten their campaign season, for sure. It feels like it has been going on forever.
post #47 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
The US definitely needs to take a lesson from Canada and shorten their campaign season, for sure. It feels like it has been going on forever.
I am getting burned out myself. Everyday something else comes up. I guess you can say it is too much time to get up to no good.
post #48 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Not trying to dig up dirt, you mentioned how your election process is "based on the issues, etc" so I wanted to see if I could find out why Canada is so much better than the United States. I found out why, IMO, it is because it is only 60 days long. There is no time to talk about anything else but the issues. The US definitely needs to take a lesson from Canada and shorten their campaign season, for sure. It feels like it has been going on forever.

I'm not quite sure I believe this response is genuine. I don't recall at any time saying that "Canada is so much better than the United States" so I can only guess you were reading something I wasn't. Also, the very first thing you did after reading my post was go searching for anything you could find on the Canadian election trail that would be negative so I don't quite believe that you were not trying to dig up dirt but that's as will be I guess.

At any rate, as a few others have said also, it's unfortunate that some of the real and serious issues are not discussed instead of all the garbage.
post #49 of 51
Thread Starter 
Oh, my apologies, I meant, the Canadian election system.
I gave my explanation, I'm sorry you don't believe it.

I did post in the Palin thread about issues, I have posted about issues many, many times here. See, it has gone on much to long, over a year now.
post #50 of 51
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Obama casually, irreverently, like a nickel toss, tosses his rose on the Memorial.
I've watched that video, and i would say the rose was gently thrown which is a big difference to being tossed.

We also throw roses into the grave in the UK because the coffins already 6' down.
post #51 of 51
I'm not a fan of Obama, but I don't think he acted disrespectful. Yes, he looked uncomfortable, but he was at Ground Zero. Would anyone really feel comfortable there? It's an emotional place and an emotional day and everyone deals with it differently. Laying or tossing a rose...what's the difference? They both paid their respects.

One thing I would have liked to see is Cindy McCain take Obama's arm too when they were walking back. (yeah, corny I know and it's not going to happen) But I didn't see a Republican and a Democrat. I saw 2 Americans (can't believe I just said that) and a show of unity would have been nice.

But, I can understand listening to the commentary that it would have brought too much focus on the "campaigns" and taken away from the true focus which was 9/11.
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