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Iraqis lead final purge - Page 4

post #91 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
http://www.abortionviolence.com/QB.HTM

It goes both ways Skippy.

And isn't abortion just a tad off topic in this thread?
I've never said that it didn't. I know that there are extremists bearing the banner of very nearly every cause known. But how does this excuse anyone else?

Abortion isn't the topic. Extremist violence and all it's "justifications" are.
post #92 of 109
Thread Starter 
No one is excusing abortion clinic bombers Skippy, geesh.


So, we aren't allowed to abhor muslim extremist terrorism because some,
self-proclaimed pseudo Christian bombed an abortion clinic int the 90's
post #93 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
No one is excusing abortion clinic bombers Skippy, geesh.


So, we aren't allowed to abhor muslim extremist terrorism because some,
self-proclaimed pseudo Christian bombed an abortion clinic int the 90's
There have been far more than one, even a recent attempt with a suicide car bomb, but the man was found out before he finished his plan. One "pseudo Christian" that engaged in some lesser anti-abortion violence was a Catholic Priest.

But to answer your question, of course you are allowed to abhor extremist terrorism. What got us to this point was posters presenting Islam as a murderous religion again. I was pointing out that hatred comes in all faiths.
post #94 of 109
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosemite View Post
I can understand you thinking I meant a reporter, but I usually try to be more specific and would have said a reporter leaked it if that is what I meant.

I also didn't mention any "draft" so not sure where you got that either. On the news currently (and all this week in fact) they are reporting on a young man that served in Iraq and instead of being court-martialed for "quitting" the armed forces, he has chosen to seek asylum in Canada just as many did during the Vietnam years. I sincerely hope they allow him to stay and find peace. Apparently the folks in the service are saying he has been discharged but there seems to be some confusion about whether that is really true or just a ruse to get him back to the US.

I don't think the people of Iraq think the US owe them anything - I think they would like all of our troops the hey out of there.

As for "losing the war", it's a no win - lose/lose situation no matter what at this point.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl...ardeserter0714

I guess the Canadian government doesn't agree with you and realizes deserters should not be given asylum in Canada.
post #95 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl...ardeserter0714

I guess the Canadian government doesn't agree with you and realizes deserters should not be given asylum in Canada.
How sad for Mr. Long that he got an imbecile calling herself Madame Justice as a judge. I hope he appeals and wins because, believe me, her beliefs are in the minority. Especially considering we (Canada) has given asylum to so many during Vietnam years. I don't see this as being any different. Nobody should be "forced" to fight. Volunteering to fight is another matter.
post #96 of 109
Thread Starter 
Yosemite, there is a huge difference between the Viet Nam war and the Iraq war. There was a draft back then. There is no draft now.

The man enlisted for goodness sakes. He doesn't get to change his mind and that is the way it is.
post #97 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Yosemite, there is a huge difference between the Viet Nam war and the Iraq war. There was a draft back then. There is no draft now.

The man enlisted for goodness sakes. He doesn't get to change his mind and that is the way it is.
The draft isn't even an issue so makes no difference one way or the other. My statement remains - nobody should be FORCED to fight/serve. If he does not want to fight/serve, then he should be allowed to resign without being court-martialed and possibly imprisoned.
post #98 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
The man enlisted for goodness sakes. He doesn't get to change his mind and that is the way it is.
I'd like to think that if I take a job and find I don't like it, I would have the option of resigning/leaving without being put on trial and possibly thrown in jail. Even though the armed forces are different "types" of jobs, one should not be forced to remain in that job if one is not happy and doesn't like the ethics/rules of the "company".
post #99 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosemite View Post
The draft isn't even an issue so makes no difference one way or the other. My statement remains - nobody should be FORCED to fight/serve. If he does not want to fight/serve, then he should be allowed to resign without being court-martialed and possibly imprisoned.
No, he shouldn't be able to. He volunteered to serve, like everyone else in our military. Despite his change of beliefs he signed the contract, he does the time. The military operates on different set of rules than the civilian world and rightfully so. I know first hand, soldiers gripe more than anyone. We don't always like doing what we are doing but to condone people running away from their duty would cause a major breakdown in discipline and that can't be allowed. I have no sympathy for Long and I applaud the ruling of the Canadian judge.

Long may or may not serve any jail time. The vast majority of deserters received less-than-honorable discharges from the Army which can be punishment enough.
post #100 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Essayons89 View Post
No, he shouldn't be able to. He volunteered to serve, like everyone else in our military. Despite his change of beliefs he signed the contract, he does the time. The military operates on different set of rules than the civilian world and rightfully so. I know first hand, soldiers gripe more than anyone. We don't always like doing what we are doing but to condone people running away from their duty would cause a major breakdown in discipline and that can't be allowed. I have no sympathy for Long and I applaud the ruling of the Canadian judge.

Long may or may not serve any jail time. The vast majority of deserters received less-than-honorable discharges from the Army which can be punishment enough.
Since I'm very anti-violence and would abhor being forced to fight for something I didn't believe in, we'll just have to agree to disagree on this issue.
post #101 of 109
Thread Starter 
Some people believe that signing a contract means nothing and you should be able to go back on your word and break the contract on a whim.
The military doesn't work that way, thank goodness.

The guy needs to quit being such a big, whiney, cry baby and fullfill his obligation that he signed on for. No one forced him to enlist. And therein is the huge difference between this war and the Viet Nam War.
post #102 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
Some people believe that signing a contract means nothing and you should be able to go back on your word and break the contract on a whim.
The military doesn't work that way, thank goodness.

The guy needs to quit being such a big, whiney, cry baby and fullfill his obligation that he signed on for. No one forced him to enlist. And therein is the huge difference between this war and the Viet Nam War.
War is war. People die in war. Soldiers died in Vietnam and they are dying in Iraq.

Maybe you should enlist and go to war and if you can handle it more power to you. It's easy to sit back and judge someone when you have never walked in their shoes.
post #103 of 109
Thread Starter 
I guess you sure told me abbeycats.

If I were of the age that I could, I would. My only child was in Iraq, does that count for anything?

While there are extenuating circumstances that the military will allow you to get out of your enlistment for, changing your mind is not one of them.
post #104 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
I guess you sure told me abbeycats.

If I were of the age that I could, I would. My only child was in Iraq, does that count for anything?

While there are extenuating circumstances that the military will allow you to get out of your enlistment for, changing your mind is not one of them.
I assume your child came home safely from Iraq? I hope that the war did not harm your child physically or mentally.

There are many families who don't get to have their child come home safe from war. Many children will grow up not knowing their father who was killed in war. The wounded will come home and will be soon forgotten by our government that they risked their life for. Then another war will come along and the same thing will happen again. Thats if we don't decide to destroy our planet with nuclear war. It's all very sad
post #105 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by abbycats View Post
I assume your child came home safely from Iraq? I hope that the war did not harm your child physically or mentally.

There are many families who don't get to have their child come home safe from war. Many children will grow up not knowing their father who was killed in war. The wounded will come home and will be soon forgotten by our government that they risked their life for. Then another war will come along and the same thing will happen again. Thats if we don't decide to destroy our planet with nuclear war. It's all bad
Which is something that has been happening since humans first appeared on the planet. War brings out the worst in human nature, which it why it should be a last resort when all diplomacy has failed to bring a peaceful resolution. Unfortunately, it rarely happens that way.
post #106 of 109
i really starting to think, the statement we will never win another war was the right statement.

We have become to weak to lazy to spolied.
post #107 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by theimp98 View Post
i really starting to think, the statement we will never win another war was the right statement.

We have become to weak to lazy to spolied.
Now Bruce, you know it's not politically correct to win wars anymore.
post #108 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Essayons89 View Post
Now Bruce, you know it's not politically correct to win wars anymore.

oh right how silly of me. sorry i wont let that happen again
post #109 of 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by Essayons89 View Post
Which is something that has been happening since humans first appeared on the planet. War brings out the worst in human nature, which it why it should be a last resort when all diplomacy has failed to bring a peaceful resolution. Unfortunately, it rarely happens that way.
I agree with you here. War is a big commitment and like my father says you have to be prepared to do what it takes. Which may be painful. Not only did I not agree with this war the execution of it was horrible. If they had put enough boots on the ground to begin with then this would now be a history lesson and not a day to day reality anymore.
Think of the billions and billions of dollars that we would have back now.
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