Originally Posted by Natalie_ca
Science and medicine have become their own worst enemy. I work a great deal with cardiac patients. I remember a fellow who was 93 years old who needed triple bypass surgery. At least 75% of people who have open heart surgery end up having a stroke to some degree. And the older the person the higher the risk. There was a good chance that even if his heart surgery was a success, that they wouldn't be able to extubate him and he would end up dying. As a nurse it is my job to advocate for the patient and I talked to the cardiac surgeon, as did the manager of the ward. However it was the doctor's opinion that if a heart can be fixed, it should be, regardless of the person's age.
We certainly agree on this. It's time for common sense to return to everyday life and medicine is included in that. Saving life just for the sake of saving it, without taking into consideration the quality of that life afterwards, is (in my opinion) a misuse of the medical technology that we have.
But I think it's terribly unfair and inaccurate to state that most doctors don't care for people. Perhaps most cardiologists don't. But I have also worked in medicine for several years and so has Max, and that is not our experience at all. I would say the exact opposite - that the few bad eggs ruin things for the many, many doctors who work tirelessly to help people, and in many ways sacrifice their own lives and happiness to do so.
Originally Posted by lookingglass
Yes, after the 4th or 5th 10k treatment. Some woman's bodies just can't carry a bio-child. So, give them every option out there. IVF didn't work for them.
I do agree with this. I think that if you've had a few goes and it isn't working then it isn't going to work. I work for an orthopaedic surgeon and he will tell people when there is nothing more to be done. He won't just keep on offering people procedures if they won't work. He's honest enough to say to people that once they've reached a certain point with their treatment they have to accept it and move on (although he says it more nicely than that!).
|This isn't even a valid parallel argument. Knee pain is treated under most health insurance. IVF, for good reason, isn't. Here's where my opinion is going to get really unpopular, so watch out. No one, in this day and age, has died from NOT having a child. Withholding AIDS treatment or treatment for knee pain is a whole different ball of wax.
I don't think that's a controversial opinion. It's completely fair. But to my knowledge, nobody so far has died from knee pain. Nobody has died from having tonsilitis. Nobody has died from having an unsightly shape to their nose. Yet these are all branches of medicine.
Medicine is not restricted to just things that will save lives. In fact I would suggest that probably half or even more of all medical treatment is just to make people's lives more comfortable. But I bet not many people think of things that way. Medical treatment is still valid even if it doesn't involve keeping someone from dying.
I don't actually see where health insurance comes into it. Health insurance isn't just for life-threatening conditions. Plenty of medical treatment is elective, and applied to enhance the quality of life. Just about all cosmetic surgery, for example, quite a lot of orthopaedic surgery and many other treatments I can name are elective and not life-saving. However they are still covered by health insurance. I would have thought you would support fertility treatment not being covered - that way the cost is confined to exactly those who require the treatment, and tax-payers are not relied upon to provide funding for this elective treatment.
And from the provider's point of view, they still get paid the same whether it is directly from the patient or from insurance. So whether it's covered or not is not going to be any kind of motivating factor for them.
And the population argument doesn't hold up, either, because we live in aging societies. The birth rate in our countries isn't enough to equalise the amount of people who are elderly and dying. One argument for
fertility treatments could be to boost child birth, as currently rates are deteriorating.