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Tedi was diagnosed with early renal failure/disease...need help prolonging his life.

post #1 of 16
Thread Starter 
I've been through this before with Duchess and she made it a few months, but suffered horribly in the end. I don't want that to happen to Tedi.

I am going to read through the sticky's for chronic renal failure, but there is a catch. Tedi has a heart murmur. I can't do too much of one thing because it will either affect his heart or kidneys. How do you find a balance? Is there anyone out there that has gone through this specific situation or is now?

I really need some advice since he is going to to be harder to take care of with that heart murmur. He is on Hill's k/d right now to help take out excess protein.

Any one have any ideas?
post #2 of 16
I'm not familiar with heart murmurs, so can offer little advice. The CRF thread will hopefully be of some help.
post #3 of 16
it never rains, but it pours, huh? like you haven't had enough emotional trials lately... i'm sending & that you are able to find the right therapy for Tedi...
post #4 of 16
Stripe had a Heart Mumur when she had Crf but it wasnt that bad. She was on Procrit,Winstrol, Sub Q's and something else but i can not remember. my Husband threw all her paperwork out.
post #5 of 16
Cleo also has a heart murmur. I took her down to Michigan State University School of Veterinary Medicine for an echocardiogram. Her heart murmur is an innocent murmur, with no cardiac changes. Quite honestly, if you can afford to have it done (4 years ago, it was $150-ish) I'd highly recommend it. MSU vets recomended no special treatment, and said that she would be able to tolerate sub-Q fluids.

Cleo's blood work and treatments are as follows:

Creatinine 2.5 (0.8 - 2.4 mg/dL)
Bun 18 (16 - 36 mg/dL)
Phosphorus 4.3 (3.1 - 7.5 mg/dL)
HCT 36 (30 - 45%)
HGB 11.4 ( 9.0 - 15.1 g/dL)

Her treatments are:
Purina NF canned food
Hills Science Diet Adult food with 1/4 teaspoon Dried Aluminum powder phos binder added
Hills k/d dry food (1 heaping tablespoon) as her treat during fluids
24 ng Calcitriol every other day
B Complex Vitamin (Jarrow B-Right 1/8 capsule) every other day
100 ml's of Lactated Ringers, Sub-Q, two to three times a week

I've said this before, but I think it warrants repeating:

Meticulous control of serum phosphorus is key to slowing down the progression of CRF. High quality protein is important to prevent muscle wasting that often goes along with CRF. My personal opinion is that the best way to control/slow down the progression of CRF is by feeding a good, high quality protein, and liberal use of Aluminum Hydroxide powder phosphorus binders. I'm a very big proponant of Calcitriol use in CRF also! Feel free to PM me, and I will send you lots of links about Calcitriol use in CRF cats!

Good luck to you and Tedi....you are both in my prayers!
post #6 of 16
My Sheba had congestive heart failure and CRF during her last six week. Now that was a tightrope balancing act, giving fluids and a diuretic (and an appetite stimulant and propranolol), trying to keep her hydrated without retaining fluids.

Is Tedi on any meds for his heart? I admit, I don't know much about heart murmurs and the problems they cause, but I do know that there's a lot of new heart meds (or maybe just becoming more common), even just in the year and a half since Sheba's passing. It's bittersweet for me, wondering if one of these new drugs could have saved her, but at the same time, being happy it's saving other people's pets.

Good luck with Tedi. :hug:
post #7 of 16
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by laureen227 View Post
it never rains, but it pours, huh? like you haven't had enough emotional trials lately... i'm sending & that you are able to find the right therapy for Tedi...
He started to have problems with his kidneys while my mom was in the hospital so I knew it was coming. He will be 16 in August if all goes well. I hope that NOTHING happens while I am gone, but the friend that will come by daily will have a credit card and our vet info should anything happen to him or anyone else. Luckily, it is still very early and I don't have to give fluids as of yet. I did with duchess so I am familiar with the process.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mews2much View Post
Stripe had a Heart Mumur when she had Crf but it wasnt that bad. She was on Procrit,Winstrol, Sub Q's and something else but i can not remember. my Husband threw all her paperwork out.
He was diagnosed with the heart murmur last year. I read up online that male persians once they are at a certain age tend to develop these. I wish your husband would have kept the paperwork.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pookie-poo View Post
Cleo also has a heart murmur. I took her down to Michigan State University School of Veterinary Medicine for an echocardiogram. Her heart murmur is an innocent murmur, with no cardiac changes. Quite honestly, if you can afford to have it done (4 years ago, it was $150-ish) I'd highly recommend it. MSU vets recomended no special treatment, and said that she would be able to tolerate sub-Q fluids.

Cleo's blood work and treatments are as follows:

Creatinine 2.5 (0.8 - 2.4 mg/dL)
Bun 18 (16 - 36 mg/dL)
Phosphorus 4.3 (3.1 - 7.5 mg/dL)
HCT 36 (30 - 45%)
HGB 11.4 ( 9.0 - 15.1 g/dL)

Her treatments are:
Purina NF canned food
Hills Science Diet Adult food with 1/4 teaspoon Dried Aluminum powder phos binder added
Hills k/d dry food (1 heaping tablespoon) as her treat during fluids
24 ng Calcitriol every other day
B Complex Vitamin (Jarrow B-Right 1/8 capsule) every other day
100 ml's of Lactated Ringers, Sub-Q, two to three times a week

I've said this before, but I think it warrants repeating:

Meticulous control of serum phosphorus is key to slowing down the progression of CRF. High quality protein is important to prevent muscle wasting that often goes along with CRF. My personal opinion is that the best way to control/slow down the progression of CRF is by feeding a good, high quality protein, and liberal use of Aluminum Hydroxide powder phosphorus binders. I'm a very big proponant of Calcitriol use in CRF also! Feel free to PM me, and I will send you lots of links about Calcitriol use in CRF cats!

Good luck to you and Tedi....you are both in my prayers!
Thanks for the info. I was reading up on calcitriol and wondered if it was safe for him to use with the murmur. Our vet said that we could do fluids, but it would have to be more often and a lower volume.

Tedi HATES all wet food. That was why I was glad they at least had the k/d in dry. He won't touch any of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorina View Post
My Sheba had congestive heart failure and CRF during her last six week. Now that was a tightrope balancing act, giving fluids and a diuretic (and an appetite stimulant and propranolol), trying to keep her hydrated without retaining fluids.

Is Tedi on any meds for his heart? I admit, I don't know much about heart murmurs and the problems they cause, but I do know that there's a lot of new heart meds (or maybe just becoming more common), even just in the year and a half since Sheba's passing. It's bittersweet for me, wondering if one of these new drugs could have saved her, but at the same time, being happy it's saving other people's pets.

Good luck with Tedi. :hug:
He is on atenolol for his heart. That is all he is getting at this point. His grade went down from a 3 to a 2 so it is moderate. He is very active, loving, laid back, and playful. Right now I know he is ok, but I want to be proactive and find ways to prolong his life while I still can.
post #8 of 16
If he doesnt like K/D look into royal canin and purina kidney formulas ...
post #9 of 16
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by sharky View Post
If he doesnt like K/D look into royal canin and purina kidney formulas ...
He likes the k/d dry. He just doesn't like any wet food at all. I've tried so many, but have not tried royal canin wet. It's worth a shot.
post #10 of 16
Do you know how long Vets keep records after a Cat dies? Stripe was pts in 2002. I wonder if my old vet would still have the records. I wish my Husband had not tossed them. I was going to add up the bills for all her problems. It was over 10 thous for sure.
post #11 of 16
My baby was diagnosed with Kidney Disease four years ago. She is doing soooo good. On the special food fromt he Vet.

But what I really, really, strongly recommend is putting your cat on, Feline Transfer Factor. That stuff is awesome.

http://www.immune-system-iq.com/feline_complete.htm


My cat will NOT take meds of any kind. She starts gagging, wretching, drooling and gets so stressed out that I just won't do that to her.

The scoop of Transfer Factor is mixed in with a quarter can of wet cat food and she loves it. Over that mixture I pour 6 teaspoons of her, Papaya-Cranberry dietary supplement. That is her breakfast and she wakes me up every morning meowing until I get up and give it to her.
Her appetite got better and she put the weight she had lost back on and kept it on. She is probably 14 pounds. She will be 15 in two month.

Good luck
post #12 of 16
You've had some excellent advice. All I can add is that I have used Calcitriol with every one of my kitties who had CRF, and it has been a wonderful treatment for my guys. Patrick lived for almost 4 years with his crf, Frankie's kidney values had gone back to normal after 2 years, Tyler had very, very stable to normal values while on Calcitriol (his crf was ex. early, biggest issue for him was high bp and loss of vision due to a retinal bleed before we found the high bp).

I know that when I was on the particular crf support list I was on, there were kitties being managed with various heart conditions, so it can be done.

I second feeding the best quality protein that you can, really watching the phos levels, also keep an eye on their potassium levels - sometimes with the volume of urinary output, they end up with low potassium - which can be addressed with additives (Tyler was on Tumil-K).

Tyler never needed fluids, neither did Frankie. Patrick got fluids 2 to 3 times per week.

I wish you all the best, the sticky thread with the links (can't say it enough...www.felinecrf.org - best place, imo - on the web for information on CRF and related conditions) is full of a lot of good info.
post #13 of 16
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
My baby was diagnosed with Kidney Disease four years ago. She is doing soooo good. On the special food fromt he Vet.

But what I really, really, strongly recommend is putting your cat on, Feline Transfer Factor. That stuff is awesome.

http://www.immune-system-iq.com/feline_complete.htm


My cat will NOT take meds of any kind. She starts gagging, wretching, drooling and gets so stressed out that I just won't do that to her.

The scoop of Transfer Factor is mixed in with a quarter can of wet cat food and she loves it. Over that mixture I pour 6 teaspoons of her, Papaya-Cranberry dietary supplement. That is her breakfast and she wakes me up every morning meowing until I get up and give it to her.
Her appetite got better and she put the weight she had lost back on and kept it on. She is probably 14 pounds. She will be 15 in two month.

Good luck
Can it be mix in with any other kind of food? He just doesn't like wet food at all so it is even harder to help him. Where can I get that transfer factor?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat & Alix View Post
You've had some excellent advice. All I can add is that I have used Calcitriol with every one of my kitties who had CRF, and it has been a wonderful treatment for my guys. Patrick lived for almost 4 years with his crf, Frankie's kidney values had gone back to normal after 2 years, Tyler had very, very stable to normal values while on Calcitriol (his crf was ex. early, biggest issue for him was high bp and loss of vision due to a retinal bleed before we found the high bp).

I know that when I was on the particular crf support list I was on, there were kitties being managed with various heart conditions, so it can be done.

I second feeding the best quality protein that you can, really watching the phos levels, also keep an eye on their potassium levels - sometimes with the volume of urinary output, they end up with low potassium - which can be addressed with additives (Tyler was on Tumil-K).

Tyler never needed fluids, neither did Frankie. Patrick got fluids 2 to 3 times per week.

I wish you all the best, the sticky thread with the links (can't say it enough...www.felinecrf.org - best place, imo - on the web for information on CRF and related conditions) is full of a lot of good info.
What is Calcitriol? Is it a paste, pill, or liquid? How often do you give it? Should he be on any other kind of diet besides the k/d? Keep in mind he doesn't like wet so I don't know what to do other than that.

I'll check that link out. Thanks!
post #14 of 16
Calcitriol is a prescription medication. You can get it in liquid or capsule form. When Cleo first started Calcitriol, I got the liquid form. She absolutely hated getting the tiny amount (it's a very tiny dosage) squirted into her mouth, and ran away every time she saw me coming! I got capsules instead (I don't think I even finished the liquid prescription) and she is SO easy to pill.

Here is the link to the Calcitriol Reference page: http://members.verizon.net/~vze2r6qt...iol/index.html

There's lots of information there that you can print up and take to your vet.

Dr. Nagode will also do telephone consults with your vet to discuss Calcitriol. He talked to my vet when I was considering it for Cleo. She was so impressed, that she not only put Cleo on Calcitriol, she also put her own CRF kitty on it!!!
post #15 of 16
I've always given the liquid Calcitriol - I get it from a compounding pharmacy in fish flavor. The dose depends on the kitty - Tippy (my PKD leading to CRF kitty gets .8 of a cc once a day).

Dr. Nagode is a saint imho...I didn't need him to consult with my vet, but it helped knowing I could

ps Calcitriol is actually just active vitamin D
post #16 of 16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat & Alix View Post
I've always given the liquid Calcitriol - I get it from a compounding pharmacy in fish flavor. The dose depends on the kitty - Tippy (my PKD leading to CRF kitty gets .8 of a cc once a day).

Dr. Nagode is a saint imho...I didn't need him to consult with my vet, but it helped knowing I could

ps Calcitriol is actually just active vitamin D
From everything I've read, the liquid form is much easier to adjust dosages with, than the capsules. I just stayed with the capsules because Cleo is so easy to pill. I suppose I could get the liquid again, and put it into empty gel caps to pill her.....nah, too much work, lol. I used to get my Calcitriol from Island Pharmacy, who worked closely with Drs. Chew and Nagode. Unfortunately, Island's pharmacists retired last autumn. I'm now getting my Calcitriol from FRANCK'S VETERINARY COMPOUNDING PHARMACY by mail order. They follow the Nagode/Chew protocol, so I know that I'm getting the correct dosage of the correct drug. If Tedi is a candidate for Calcitriol, your vet can fax in the prescription. I received it within a couple of days. They are very prompt and courteous...so far, I've been very happy with them (and I was a little worried about switching from Island to Francks at first, even though Island Pharmacy and Dr. Nagode both recommended them.)
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