What color is Olive?

Well the father of Sophie's kittens is a mystery. I'm just guessing that this longhaired blue guy was the father. I actually caught Olive in "the act" so I know for sure that this longhaired blue tom is the father. My mom accidently let her out and she wouldn't let me catch her for 2 days. Not sure what Olive's mother was as they had alot of cats, the person I got these kittens from had 4 litters of kittens outside, I was unsure of who was the mother of which litter, i'm not 100% that Sophie and Olive came from the same mother. I'm guessing they did but i'm not completely sure. Sophie was bigger than Olive but she has stayed bigger even into adulthood. When I got my two girls they were very scared and almost feral at first.

well.... maybe I answered my own question...

A "brown tabby" has black stripes on a brownish or grayish ground color. The black stripes may be coal black, or a little bit brownish.
A "blue tabby" has gray stripes on a grayish or buff ground color. The gray stripes may be a dark slate gray, or a lighter blue-gray.
A "red tabby" has orange stripes on a cream ground color. The orange stripes may be dark reddish orange, or light "marmalade" orange.
A "cream tabby" has cream stripes on a pale cream ground color. These stripes look sand-colored or peach-colored rather than orange.
A "silver tabby" has black stripes on a white ground color. The roots of the hairs are white. You can also have a blue silver, cream silver, or red silver tabby (red silver is also known as "cameo tabby") depending on the color of the stripes. In all cases, silver tabbies have a pale ground color and white roots. To make sure, part the hairs and look at the roots.

Yeah Olive does have white hair roots so I guess she is a silver tabby.

Blue would be pale looking color. Silver is white background with black markings.

Its uncommon tho for silvers to have gold eye color. Silver is a dominate color - you only need one parent to be silver to get silver.

So she will probably have silver and blue babies? Could she possibly have black babies?

When you think of cat furr colors/patterns, you have to think of them in layers.

Olive is a silver tabby, but hiding under the agouti gene (tabby pattern) and the silver (inhibitor gene) is a black cat.

Since you didnt mention, I am assuming the dad was a solid cat (no tabby markings).

And the "with white" is also another set of genes.

If the dad is a solid cat he is homozygous (carries two of the same gene) for the recessive non-agouti (solid) gene. As with the long-hair gene, in order for the kittens to be solid in color, Olive would need to be heterozygous (carry one dominant agouti gene and one recessive non-agouti gene). This way she can pass on one of her solid genes to the kittens.

If she doesnt carry the solid gene, then she can still possibly have a "black" kitty, only it would show up as a brown tabby.

To complicate matters further... the blue dad carries two recessive dilution genes, which is what turns a black cat blue (gray). So Olive also has to carry one recessive dilution gene to produce a gray kitten.

It goes on and on... there are more genes for the type of tabby pattern but I wont get into that.

Unless you know the genetics of the parents, it really is hard to tell what you will get. Unless you are working with two cats that you know are carrying homozygous recessive genes... (two long hairs will only produce longhaired offspring, two solids will only produce solids, two grays will only produce diluted kittens, etc, etc.)

Again... cant wait to see what she has! In the meantime, it will be fun guessing

A friend of mine had a cat we rescued (stray rescue) who was longhaired and pregnant, and a lot of her kittens were also longhaired.... I guess that means the father was either longhaired or carried the gene?

Originally Posted by Nekochan

A friend of mine had a cat we rescued (stray rescue) who was longhaired and pregnant, and a lot of her kittens were also longhaired.... I guess that means the father was either longhaired or carried the gene?

Click to expand...

Right, he has to carry at least one gene. The dad could've been longhaired if ALL the kittens were longhaired. There could be 100 kittens, if one of them was shorthair, then the dad was short hair.

There are statistics, you could guess that a breeding of a short hair and a long hair would throw 50/50 kittens, but it is a crap shoot, you could get all longhair, or none.

That said, even if all the kittens were long-hair, that still doesnt mean the dad was longhair, only that he carried the long-hair gene. However it would strongly suggest it. BUT, one measly short hair would prove that the dad was NOT long-hair.

Does that make sense?

Two long hairs can ONLY produce longhairs, but two short hairs can produce both.

Since Sophie is Olive's sister and she produced solids would it be safe to assume that Olive carries the gene as well? Oh and I don't mind the "with white" all of Sophie's babies have white on them. I am really anxious to see what her babies look like too. I felt them kick for the first time today. One more question. This one refers to Sophie's litter though. I have read that babies with white over their eyes have a chance of having 1 or 2 blue eyes. How big of a chance is this? Roxie and Punky have white on their whole faces and the other two have it on their face as well but not as much.

Originally Posted by Lindsey88

Since Sophie is Olive's sister and she produced solids would it be safe to assume that Olive carries the gene as well? Oh and I don't mind the "with white" all of Sophie's babies have white on them. I am really anxious to see what her babies look like too. I felt them kick for the first time today.

One more question. This one refers to Sophie's litter though. I have read that babies with white over their eyes have a chance of having 1 or 2 blue eyes. How big of a chance is this? Roxie and Punky have white on their whole faces and the other two have it on their face as well but not as much.

Click to expand...

Sophie carries the solid gene (actually what she has is a non-tabby gene), so you know that one of her parents carried it, so it is possible that they passed it on to Olive as well, but not a certainty.

The with white spotting gene is called the piebald pattern, and this gene is different than the rest, in that a cat that is homozygous (double dominant for piebald (SS)) tends to have more white than a heterozygous (Ss) cat.

It is probably safe to say that Sophie (who is consider a van) is homozygous for the spotting gene, that is why she has so much white. And I would bet if I had never seen pictures of her kittens, that every single one of them would have white on them.

The white spotting gene is not the same gene responsible for an all white cat. The solid white gene is a masking gene and it is dominant, so you only need one parent to be white to pass this visable trait on to it's offspring.

That said, it is possible for two vans to mate and produce an all white cat... but it isnt a true white genetically.

I've never heard of the white around the eyes producing blue eyes. However, solid white cats can have blue eyes or odd eyes (one blue one green eye) The white cats with blue/odd eyes also have a tendancy to be deaf.

Now having said that, the white on a cat is the absence of color. Whether it be the spotting gene or the solid white gene. I said before that white is a masking gene, meaning the cat is actually red or black (or a diluted version) underneath, genetically. The white gene stops the color process. So sometimes it stops the coloring in the eyes as well, which is what causes them to be blue or odd eyed (if it stops it in only one eye). And it also can stops the process in their ears, which is what can cause the deafness. An odd eyed cat tends to be deaf in only one ear on the same side as it's blue eye. So the theory you mention about white around a cats eyes causing blue eyes holds some credence with that explanation, but I couldnt tell you by experience.

Hope I didnt get too wordy. I tend to go on sometimes. I love genetics, but hardly find people who's eyes dont glaze over at the mere mention of it.

Oops, Sophie's not a van, it's Rags that I thought was a van, but I went and looked at her picture on the preggo belly thread and she's not a van either... but she sure does have a lot of white on her!!!!

I think Rags is a high white calico, not quite a tortie because I think her colors are too distinct. One of her daughters, Belle, I've been calling a calico, but she's close to a tortie because the colors blend a bit.

Torties do not have any white on them. Think of it this way:

Calico - white cat with patches of black/red

Tortie - black/red cat with colors blended

Tortie and White - tortie with white patches (usually face, legs, belly)

Then there is the torbie with white which is what rags and my sophie are. Which is tabby with patches of red. They aren't quite calico's because they are tabby.
http://www.seregiontica.org/Colors/w.../withwhite.htm

I'll try to get a good pic of Belle from all angles and see if you guys think she is calico or tortie and white. i don't want to mess with them now though because I distrubed them enough this morning when I was in there weighing them again.

Tortie= red and black patches no white
Calico= red and black patches with white
torbie= Tabby patches of red
Torbie with white = tabby patches of red and white

Rags has gray (or blue?) striped patches and red tabby patches on white. Here are some more pics so you can get a good look. I always thought that since she is tricolor, she is a type of calico. I thought only types of calicos are tricolor.













Here's one of my other cats, Josie. I've always thought of her as a true calico. What do you think?

The second cat looks like a dilute calico if her patches are blue. If they are black she is just a normal calico. but Rags is definatly a torbie with white or brown patched tabby with white (other name for it). I could tell one of her kittens was as well.

So a tricolor isn't always a calico?

Sorry to hijack the thread!

Well ones with tabby patches are technically torbies. It's ok this has really just turned into a thread about genetics. When I got Sophie I called her a calico all the time but now I have learned she is a torbie. lol And calico is just a nickname given for a tortie with white. You can call it either name but people like to call them calicos. Did you see the link I posted?
http://www.seregiontica.org/Colors/t...rtietorbie.htm
http://www.seregiontica.org/Colors/w.../withwhite.htm