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what should be done about this?

post #1 of 26
Thread Starter 
My sister just told me about this. She thought it would have made the national news by now. Here we are with the Poor Illegal Alien, just needed a job and a better life.

She slammed a school bus killing four children, 5 others still in hospitals. What do do? Deport. Try with criminal charges and pay for her possible 40+ years of incarceration then deport? What should be done to her employer, who was supposed to have proof of residency, Ie like a stamped birth certificate.

What would you want done if it was your children that died?

This is one example of why we need to get the ILLEGAL immigrant problem addressed. She broke the laws to get into the country and had no qualms about breaking the laws while here. Now four kids are dead.

http://wcco.com/local/school.bus.crash.2.660427.html
post #2 of 26
IMO have her serve time then as soon as she gets out deport her.
post #3 of 26
She failed to stop at a stop sign-- you're making it out like she came here to murder children "had no qualms about breaking the laws while here" sounds like she did it on purpose. Plenty of citizens cause horrible traffic accidents, and to this woman's credit, she wasn't drunk and she didn't try to run (though it says she's in a wheelchair, so I don't know if she was injured).

It's awful, and inexcusable, and I'm very sorry for the children and their families.

But being an illegal immigrant doesn't make you subhuman, and it doesn't have a darn thing to do with this accident except that she was driving without a license because she couldn't get a license because she's an illegal immigrant.

This sort of thing is exactly why a lot of places don't make you prove your citizenship to take a driving test and get your license. Maybe if all the anti-immigrant hysteria wasn't going on, this never would have happened, because the woman would have learned how to drive.
post #4 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
She failed to stop at a stop sign-- you're making it out like she came here to murder children "had no qualms about breaking the laws while here" sounds like she did it on purpose. Plenty of citizens cause horrible traffic accidents, and to this woman's credit, she wasn't drunk and she didn't try to run (though it says she's in a wheelchair, so I don't know if she was injured).

It's awful, and inexcusable, and I'm very sorry for the children and their families.

But being an illegal immigrant doesn't make you subhuman, and it doesn't have a darn thing to do with this accident except that she was driving without a license because she couldn't get a license because she's an illegal immigrant.

This sort of thing is exactly why a lot of places don't make you prove your citizenship to take a driving test and get your license. Maybe if all the anti-immigrant hysteria wasn't going on, this never would have happened, because the woman would have learned how to drive.
Thanks! This was VERY sad thing, but I know someone close to me that died from an American drunk driver, a teen, in America. Everyone was "legal" in citizenship, but being "legal" doesn't equal being "moral" or not doing anything illegal.
post #5 of 26
IMO anyone that is here illegally and breaks a law does it on purpose. I have very strong feelings about illegal immigration, and think that this woman should be prosecuted as though she set out to commit this crime. That is harsh, yes, but that is the way I feel about it.
I know many people that came here legally, did all the right things, and became good, productive, working citizens. One girl that I work with told me the proudest day of her life was the day she was finally able to become a citizen. Her sister is still in El Salvador, and though my coworker helps her financially, she will not help her get here until she will at least attempt to learn to speak English. A good friend came from Ireland and served honorably in the Marine Corps, then helped his family come here legally with the hazard pay he earned from being EOD. (explosive ordinance division) He risked blowing himself up to get himself and his parents and sister here.
Why should that woman that killed those kids have to do any less just because she wants a better life? One family lost 2 kids in that wreck. What is she going to say to the mother? "I am a selfish criminal who thinks I am above the law?" That should help that poor woman sleep at night.
post #6 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
She failed to stop at a stop sign-- you're making it out like she came here to murder children "had no qualms about breaking the laws while here" sounds like she did it on purpose. Plenty of citizens cause horrible traffic accidents, and to this woman's credit, she wasn't drunk and she didn't try to run (though it says she's in a wheelchair, so I don't know if she was injured).

It's awful, and inexcusable, and I'm very sorry for the children and their families.

But being an illegal immigrant doesn't make you subhuman, and it doesn't have a darn thing to do with this accident except that she was driving without a license because she couldn't get a license because she's an illegal immigrant.

This sort of thing is exactly why a lot of places don't make you prove your citizenship to take a driving test and get your license. Maybe if all the anti-immigrant hysteria wasn't going on, this never would have happened, because the woman would have learned how to drive.
I agree, Julie. Being involved in a traffic accident has nothing to do with your country of origin. I find it sad that a situation that any one of us could be involved in is being exploited to stir up resentment against illegal aliens.
post #7 of 26
Whether or not the woman was illegal has nothing to do with being a bad driver who caused a crash. She should serve time and then be deported.
Stop focusing on her immigration status and look at the crime - failure to obey a basic safety law. How many people run that same stop sign???? I hope that the community puts out flowers AND the message - "Look what happens when a simple law is broken!!"
Godspeed over RB, little angels and have fun playing with our TCS kitties on the other side - you'll be getting lots of headbutts and purrs....
And, KrazyKat2, please know that I do commiserate with those families who have lost their precious little treasures....in fact, sometimes, I wish that I could have the woman who drove drunk & killed my brother, and the middle-aged dopehead who murdered my 18yo nephew deported to Mexico...
post #8 of 26
Allowing illegal aliens to obtain a driver's license isn't going to keep the bad drivers off the road at all. They will simply drive without a license and without insurance - it happens all of the time to both legal and illegal. But it does seem to be a disproportionate number of unlicensed and uninsured drivers causing wrecks.

And I think the point was supposed to be that if she wasn't here in the first place, which also happens to be here illegally, then the accident wouldn't have happened.


So sad for the families.
post #9 of 26
I understand that anyone could havecaused that accident. And thats why I said yes she should serve time here for that. She killed what 4 people and 5 are in the hospital from that accident. But the fact is its now known she is here illegal. We can not have her serve a sentence and the hand her citizenship papers IMO. Thats why I feel once she serves her time she needs to be deported the day she gets out of jail/prision. Don't know if that will happen but thats how I feel it should play out.
post #10 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post


This sort of thing is exactly why a lot of places don't make you prove your citizenship to take a driving test and get your license. Maybe if all the anti-immigrant hysteria wasn't going on, this never would have happened, because the woman would have learned how to drive.

People *should* have to prove citizenship to get a driver's license in the US. What's wrong with that?

There is no anti-immigration hysteria. There are, however, millions of Americans justifiably concerned and angry about the unstemmed tide of *illegal* aliens coming into the US. The school bus tragedy would not have happened if our laws had actually been enforced.

The woman who hit the bus is an illegal alien who has no business being in the US in the first place. She's broken the law several times: first, by being in the US illegally, second, driving without a license, and third, running a stop sign resulting in the deaths of several children. She should serve time for those crimes, and then be deported.
post #11 of 26
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
She failed to stop at a stop sign-- you're making it out like she came here to murder children "had no qualms about breaking the laws while here" sounds like she did it on purpose. Plenty of citizens cause horrible traffic accidents, and to this woman's credit, she wasn't drunk and she didn't try to run (though it says she's in a wheelchair, so I don't know if she was injured).

It's awful, and inexcusable, and I'm very sorry for the children and their families.

But being an illegal immigrant doesn't make you subhuman, and it doesn't have a darn thing to do with this accident except that she was driving without a license because she couldn't get a license because she's an illegal immigrant.

This sort of thing is exactly why a lot of places don't make you prove your citizenship to take a driving test and get your license. Maybe if all the anti-immigrant hysteria wasn't going on, this never would have happened, because the woman would have learned how to drive.
I am not making this out like she came here to murder children. I said exactly what I meant “had no qualms about breaking the law while she was hereâ€.

Her being illegal is exactly why this accident occurred. She actually did much more than fail to stop. She was speeding to a degree that her van went airborne when crossing the railroad tracks. She also had stolen someone's identity, knowingly operated a motor vehicle illegally, lied to officers about the accident, is refusing to cooperate with authorities, paid to get forged documents, and her fake Minnesota ID card allows her to vote within the State of MN even though she isn't a citizen.

All of her behavior shows complete disregard for the laws of this country, ie. She broke the law to get here and had no qualms about breaking the laws once she was here. I never said illegals are subhuman, so please don't imply that I did.

This never would have happened if the woman had taken the time and means to enter the country legally. Immigration laws are meant to be followed so the new residents of this country have the tools and support they need to be law abiding, contributing future citizens. If people followed the immigration laws “accidents†like this wouldn't happen. She wouldn't have been illegal, she would have had drivers education, she would have spoken English, and she wouldn't have been breaking the law not to get caught. In other words this was not an accident. These children died, because of the choices she purposely made for her own benefit.

Just as those killed by a drunk driver have lost their lives not to an accident, but to a conscious crime committed by the person who knowingly drove drunk and didn't care that they were endangering others.

Additionally, there are no restrictions to signing up for driver's education. So being illegal did not prevent her from learning the laws of this country and how to safely operate a motor vehicle, whether she had a legal drivers license or not. She personally chose not to do so. There are also no restrictions on hiring a private tutor or taking group English classes offered through community colleges. She also chose not to do this as well.

She was cited two years prior (2006) for almost smashing her car into a woman's house in Montevideo, MN. She didn't know how to operate a motor vehicle nor did she speak English then. The officers followed the laws for legal citizens, gave her a fine for operating a motor vehicle without a license (which she had the money to pay, $185) In the two years since she committed that crime, she failed to learn the language, she failed to learn how to safely operate a motor vehicle and now she killed four children ages 9-13 and put 5 others ( 4 kids, 1 adult) in the hospital.

This woman chose to become a criminal by entering this country illegally. In order to do this she most likely paid a coyote to bring her over the border which costs between $500-1000 dollars. Then she had to purchase fake documents another $200-500 dollars. All this before getting here and getting a job. She is not some poor, homeless, amnesty seeking individual. She has been able to purchase a car, clothes, groceries, gas for her car, a place to live. She is not a charity case as the illegals are so often made out to be in order to gain sympathy.

Her past behavior indicates she has the propensity to be a criminal for her own personal gain. Past actions are commonly used to show character. As has been pointed out in this very thread, we have enough American born criminals to pay for and deal with, we do not need to support those from other countries as well.

We are paying for her medical treatment, her prosecution, her defense, her room and board at the penal facility. I don't know if the families she hurt have insurance, who is paying their medical bills? What about the funerals for the dead children. These families have no legal recourse against this woman because she is not a citizen of the country. Through an interpretor she told the police she was from Mexico, but ICE cannot confirm she is even a Mexican citizen because she refuses to give her real name.


Then there is the employer, who is just as guilty. Was she speeding to get to work on time? Fear of losing her job because her employer knew she was an illegal? Did the employer do the necessary proof of citizenship checks? Did the employer pay her cash under the table? .

We have an illegal immigration problem in this country and this case is a good example of it. This is not a simple case of, "oops failed to stop and caused the death of four children and hospitalized five others".
post #12 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by KTLynn View Post
People *should* have to prove citizenship to get a driver's license in the US. What's wrong with that?
Holy snikies, I really had to prove that I was a resident when I moved to NJ. I had to produce my birth certificate, my old driver's license, at least two bills in my name being sent to the new address and anything else but a blood sample it seemed. It could just be East Coast though.

Anyhoo, I think the statement of "Which came first the chicken or the egg?" plays well here. Would the children have died if she had not come here illegally or would she have gotten into the accident if the children were not in the vehicle?
post #13 of 26
i am sick of the whole thing,
i say hang her,she killed 4 kids. Rope is cheaper then keeping her in jail.
then put her head on a spike at the border as a warning for others.

and the statments of "Being involved in a traffic accident has nothing to do with your country of origin"

your wrong. the person was not supposed to be here in the first place, let alone driving.Thinking like that is what got the kids killed. This is what happens when you dont control immigration.
The only people i can see who are in favor of illegals, are looking for slave labor, and or hate there country.
post #14 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittymonsters View Post
I am not making this out like she came here to murder children. I said exactly what I meant “had no qualms about breaking the law while she was hereâ€.

Her being illegal is exactly why this accident occurred. She actually did much more than fail to stop. She was speeding to a degree that her van went airborne when crossing the railroad tracks. She also had stolen someone's identity, knowingly operated a motor vehicle illegally, lied to officers about the accident, is refusing to cooperate with authorities, paid to get forged documents, and her fake Minnesota ID card allows her to vote within the State of MN even though she isn't a citizen.

All of her behavior shows complete disregard for the laws of this country, ie. She broke the law to get here and had no qualms about breaking the laws once she was here. I never said illegals are subhuman, so please don't imply that I did.

This never would have happened if the woman had taken the time and means to enter the country legally. Immigration laws are meant to be followed so the new residents of this country have the tools and support they need to be law abiding, contributing future citizens. If people followed the immigration laws “accidents†like this wouldn't happen. She wouldn't have been illegal, she would have had drivers education, she would have spoken English, and she wouldn't have been breaking the law not to get caught. In other words this was not an accident. These children died, because of the choices she purposely made for her own benefit.

Just as those killed by a drunk driver have lost their lives not to an accident, but to a conscious crime committed by the person who knowingly drove drunk and didn't care that they were endangering others.

Additionally, there are no restrictions to signing up for driver's education. So being illegal did not prevent her from learning the laws of this country and how to safely operate a motor vehicle, whether she had a legal drivers license or not. She personally chose not to do so. There are also no restrictions on hiring a private tutor or taking group English classes offered through community colleges. She also chose not to do this as well.

She was cited two years prior (2006) for almost smashing her car into a woman's house in Montevideo, MN. She didn't know how to operate a motor vehicle nor did she speak English then. The officers followed the laws for legal citizens, gave her a fine for operating a motor vehicle without a license (which she had the money to pay, $185) In the two years since she committed that crime, she failed to learn the language, she failed to learn how to safely operate a motor vehicle and now she killed four children ages 9-13 and put 5 others ( 4 kids, 1 adult) in the hospital.

This woman chose to become a criminal by entering this country illegally. In order to do this she most likely paid a coyote to bring her over the border which costs between $500-1000 dollars. Then she had to purchase fake documents another $200-500 dollars. All this before getting here and getting a job. She is not some poor, homeless, amnesty seeking individual. She has been able to purchase a car, clothes, groceries, gas for her car, a place to live. She is not a charity case as the illegals are so often made out to be in order to gain sympathy.

Her past behavior indicates she has the propensity to be a criminal for her own personal gain. Past actions are commonly used to show character. As has been pointed out in this very thread, we have enough American born criminals to pay for and deal with, we do not need to support those from other countries as well.

We are paying for her medical treatment, her prosecution, her defense, her room and board at the penal facility. I don't know if the families she hurt have insurance, who is paying their medical bills? What about the funerals for the dead children. These families have no legal recourse against this woman because she is not a citizen of the country. Through an interpretor she told the police she was from Mexico, but ICE cannot confirm she is even a Mexican citizen because she refuses to give her real name.


Then there is the employer, who is just as guilty. Was she speeding to get to work on time? Fear of losing her job because her employer knew she was an illegal? Did the employer do the necessary proof of citizenship checks? Did the employer pay her cash under the table? .

We have an illegal immigration problem in this country and this case is a good example of it. This is not a simple case of, "oops failed to stop and caused the death of four children and hospitalized five others".
You're now arguing on the basis of information not provided in the link you originally posted, so it would only be fair to provide links to the additional info you're referring to at this point if you expect a reasonable debate.
post #15 of 26
Thread Starter 
In the link I provided look under the second photograph of the suspect. there is a section of "Related Stories" that has six articles and under that there is the "Related Links" which has a PDF of the entire 38 page complaint. I am guessing you didn't see those

ETA: None of the above actually has anything to do with my original question. What to do now?
We have enough of a problem dealing with our own home grown criminals. Do we deport and this woman gets off clean? Do we prosecute thereby paying for her prosecution, and her defense and her incarceration, not to mention her medical bills? ( she is in a wheelchair because she broke her leg in the accident according to TV accounts. Don't know if the articles point this out.) The victims have no recourse. We can't make her home country pay.

What is the "right" thing to do?

I replied to Zissou's Mom's post which had nothing to do with my original questions. The fact this woman is an illegal Alien is not in question, nor is the fact she killed 4 children and hospitalized 5 others.

Unfortunately, not all illegals here are Mirgrant Farm Workers, who are the stereotypical hardworking poor families escaping a non-sustainable life in Mexico. Actually now a days there are more who are here and behaving like this young woman as opposed to the widely publicized farm workers. This is exactly the reason for what Zissou's Mom calls "illegal hysteria". There is a problem...not unlike the fact there is a problem with drunk drivers, although I don't hear anyone referring to "DWI hysteria".
post #16 of 26
What should be done about this? Prosecute her to the fullest extent of the law, sentence her, and deport her. Hopefully by the time she completes her sentence we'll actually have the border secured.

The thing is, IMO we should have a ZERO TOLERANCE policy on illegal immigrants and crime. And no, I don't care if it's Driving without a License/Insurance, or 1st Degree Murder. Sentence, then deport (along with securing the border). End of discussion. If that had been done the first, second, third, etc. time she was convicted this incident wouldn't have happened.

We have a zero tolerance policy for any kind of weapons in school, even going as far as a child bringing a butter knife with their lunch (no, I don't have a link, just remember the incident), or a little kid bringing a toy gun. I don't see why we should put up with people coming here illegally to begin with and committing crimes of any kind.
post #17 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by valanhb View Post
What should be done about this? Prosecute her to the fullest extent of the law, sentence her, and deport her. Hopefully by the time she completes her sentence we'll actually have the border secured.

The thing is, IMO we should have a ZERO TOLERANCE policy on illegal immigrants and crime. And no, I don't care if it's Driving without a License/Insurance, or 1st Degree Murder. Sentence, then deport (along with securing the border). End of discussion. If that had been done the first, second, third, etc. time she was convicted this incident wouldn't have happened.

We have a zero tolerance policy for any kind of weapons in school, even going as far as a child bringing a butter knife with their lunch (no, I don't have a link, just remember the incident), or a little kid bringing a toy gun. I don't see why we should put up with people coming here illegally to begin with and committing crimes of any kind.

Not on my tax dollars, just remove her.
post #18 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittymonsters View Post
I replied to Zissou's Mom's post which had nothing to do with my original questions. The fact this woman is an illegal Alien is not in question, nor is the fact she killed 4 children and hospitalized 5 others.
The fact that her legal status has a darn thing to do with this case is in question though. We're not talking about a woman who goes on crime sprees, gets deported, comes back again, etc. We're talking about a woman who ran a stop sign with very tragic consequences.

When it's an American citizen, we all realize that some crimes are worse than others, yet somehow if an illegal person does something that most of us would be at least a little sympathetic for under other circumstances, she becomes what's wrong with America blahblahblahadnauseum.

And you are acting like she murdered children, instead of being at fault in a traffic accident. Why else would you put accident in quotes? Do have reason to believe it was malicious and purposeful? Why does it matter if she spoke English?



As for whether or not there's hysteria: Mike Huckabee even thinks there is. He called a 2005 plan to deny health care for illegals Un-American and said it "inflames those who are racists and bigots and makes them think there's a real problem". Somehow this rabidity about illegal immigrants has turned into what some people think is the decisive issue of the election, like gay-bashing was last time- when everyone realizes that it may very well lose the election wholesale for the Republicans.
post #19 of 26
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
The fact that her legal status has a darn thing to do with this case is in question though. We're not talking about a woman who goes on crime sprees, gets deported, comes back again, etc. We're talking about a woman who ran a stop sign with very tragic consequences.
NO we are not talking about woman who ran a stop sign with very tragic consequences. We are talking about an Admitted illegal immigrant killing four children and putting five others in the hospital because she purposefully drove without the proper training and licensing of this country.

Did you read the links? Did you read my entire reply to your first post? What part of her actions are not crimes? What does getting deported and coming back again have to do with anything? How is it known that she hasn't committed other crimes, been deported and came back again? As it last stood no one is exactly sure just who she really is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
When it's an American citizen, we all realize that some crimes are worse than others, yet somehow if an illegal person does something that most of us would be at least a little sympathetic for under other circumstances, she becomes what's wrong with America blahblahblahadnauseum.
I wouldn't have any sympathy for an American citizen who behaved in this manner. A citizen who was previously convicted of driving without a license, who was speeding, who ran a stop sign, and killed four children. I do hear the illegal supporters saying they should be forgiven for breaking the laws because they are illegal... blah,blah, blah, blah ad nauseum.. That argument makes no sense whatsoever to me. I don't have sympathy for criminals, period.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
And you are acting like she murdered children, instead of being at fault in a traffic accident. Why else would you put accident in quotes? Do have reason to believe it was malicious and purposeful? Why does it matter if she spoke English?
Originally you accused me of implying this woman purposely came across the border to specifically murder children. I denied that implication and gave you the reasoning for my statement.

Now you are saying I am acting like she murdered the children because I put accident in quotes. The word accident was originally being discussed as a random non-preventable car accident, like hitting black ice and sliding into another car. An accident that could have happened to “any one of usâ€.

I disagree with this definition of accident as it applies to this case, thus my use of quotes. Additionally this woman purposely operated a motor vehicle without a license. It was this purposeful action on her part that caused the death of these children. She is charged with vehicular homicide at this point, which doesn't preclude her from being charged with manslaughter and murder as well.

Her ability to read and write English matters because there were informational caution signs warning that a stop sign and railroad crossing were ahead. These signs give the forewarning to slow down and be prepared to stop. If she could read English she would have been able to heed this warning and actually stop her vehicle.

In order to legally obtain a license people must pass a written test that includes being able to identify these types of signs just by their color and shape. This information is included in the driving manuals of all states. If she could read and write English, in the two years from her previous criminal citation for driving without a license, she could have picked up a copy of the Minnesota Drivers Education Manual free from any DMV and learned this all by herself. What a novel idea, attempting to be a responsible person!

Going WAY off topic here,but I will reply so you don't think I was ignoring points you thought important.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
As for whether or not there's hysteria: Mike Huckabee even thinks there is. He called a 2005 plan to deny health care for illegals Un-American and said it "inflames those who are racists and bigots and makes them think there's a real problem".
Sorry but I don't put credence in much of what Mr. Huckabee says. He also believes that evolution doesn't exist and that the Constitution should be amended to reflect the evangelical's version of God's law. Yeah, I know, I am going to hell for this. Not relevant.

Also, in this country we don't deny health care to illegals. County hospitals cannot deny care to anyone that cannot pay no matter what their citizenship is. We, ie the taxpayers of this country, pay for this. Two thirds of the county property taxes I pay goes to the indigent health care fund for our “county hospital†that is actually run by a private for profit company. How this is actually legal is beyond me.

Personally, if I am going to be paying for other people's healthcare ( I have a hard enough time paying for my own medical costs), I would prefer to pay for citizens of this country.

Also, when I hurt myself in the ocean when I was on vacation in Mexico, they didn't pay for my medical care. I was expected to pay cash upfront before I was treated. How come that is ok? Does any other country expect to pay for non-citizen's health care? Do Canadians pay for us even when in their country legally? Am I missing something here?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
Somehow this rabidity about illegal immigrants has turned into what some people think is the decisive issue of the election, like gay-bashing was last time- when everyone realizes that it may very well lose the election wholesale for the Republicans.
Just because you choose not to see the problems illegals cause doesn't mean they are non-existent. It also doesn't make those that do see the problems and want them addressed, rabid, hysterical, bigoted, racists as you are implying.

What does republicans or democrats have to do with this? Also, do you really think that the issue of homosexual legal unions has the same impact on this country as 20 million illegals? There is a VAST difference in the national impact of these two issues. IMO homosexual couples certainly deserve the same perks under our laws as heterosexual married couples, and I am not saying their issue is unimportant. However, it has a negligible impact on the overall safety and economic impact on this nation as a whole.

Back on topic

This thread was/is about what should be done with this illegal immigrant who has broken the law and as a result killed 4 kids. Illegal is important because our laws and rights apply to citizens of our country. The “freebies†of our system take into account that legal citizens supposedly pay into this system at some point. Not perfect, but it is what we have at the moment.

Do we just deport hoping she doesn't re-enter the country again, thus she escapes having any consequences for her actions?

Do we pay, or more accurately the citizens of Lyons county including the victim's relatives, pay for this womans prosecution, defense, and incarceration for up to 40 years? Also while she is incarcerated should these same people pay for her to get a U.S. College education and “rehabilitate†her? Then deport her and hope she doesn't re-enter the country illegally again?

Despite what Mr. Huckabee might say, this one illegal immigrant has already cost the legal residents of Lyon's County a great deal, both in lives and in future monetary costs.
post #20 of 26
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by theimp98 View Post
i am sick of the whole thing,
i say hang her,she killed 4 kids. Rope is cheaper then keeping her in jail.
then put her head on a spike at the border as a warning for others.

and the statments of "Being involved in a traffic accident has nothing to do with your country of origin"

your wrong. the person was not supposed to be here in the first place, let alone driving.Thinking like that is what got the kids killed. This is what happens when you dont control immigration.
The only people i can see who are in favor of illegals, are looking for slave labor, and or hate there country.
Quote:
Originally Posted by valanhb View Post
What should be done about this? Prosecute her to the fullest extent of the law, sentence her, and deport her. Hopefully by the time she completes her sentence we'll actually have the border secured.

The thing is, IMO we should have a ZERO TOLERANCE policy on illegal immigrants and crime. And no, I don't care if it's Driving without a License/Insurance, or 1st Degree Murder. Sentence, then deport (along with securing the border). End of discussion. If that had been done the first, second, third, etc. time she was convicted this incident wouldn't have happened.

We have a zero tolerance policy for any kind of weapons in school, even going as far as a child bringing a butter knife with their lunch (no, I don't have a link, just remember the incident), or a little kid bringing a toy gun. I don't see why we should put up with people coming here illegally to begin with and committing crimes of any kind.
Quote:
Originally Posted by theimp98 View Post
Not on my tax dollars, just remove her.
These are exactly the issues I was asking to be addressed. What is right? Fair? Legal?

I honestly don't know. I don't think we should have to pay all the costs that are going to be associated with her trial and incarceration. At the same time she should not get off with no consequences and simple deportation.

This situation reminds me of the kid that broke some law while he was legally in Singapore. His sentence under their laws was a pretty hefty caning. Not a big cost to the Singapore people and then be deported. Not likely the dumb kid would return to Singapore legally or illegally. He certainly would not commit the same crime if he did return. The consequences are a real deterrent.

What was absurd about the case was that many Americans were in an uproar that the kid was going to be caned at all. I'm sorry but he was in their country therefor governed by their laws. If he was ignorant of those laws that is no excuse.

We need laws that are real deterrents to crime and we need to uphold those laws. Criminal is Criminal, period.
post #21 of 26
lol you have to remember that many of the people that have posted,
think the US does not have the right to defened its borders.
post #22 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittymonsters
What was absurd about the case was that many Americans were in an uproar that the kid was going to be caned at all. I'm sorry but he was in their country therefor governed by their laws. If he was ignorant of those laws that is no excuse.
I remember that. I had no sympathy for the little twit.

The woman was already a criminal before the accident. Her failure to stop at a stop sign and the results of her carelessness only makes matters worse. I have no idea how you punish her.
post #23 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
The fact that her legal status has a darn thing to do with this case is in question though. We're not talking about a woman who goes on crime sprees, gets deported, comes back again, etc. We're talking about a woman who ran a stop sign with very tragic consequences..
We keep trying to take the dumb out of people, remove any chance that someone will get hit by acts of there won stupidly... but we just open the borders to let more in? what sense does that make
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
When it's an American citizen, we all realize that some crimes are worse than others, yet somehow if an illegal person does something that most of us would be at least a little sympathetic for under other circumstances, she becomes what's wrong with America blahblahblahadnauseum...

And you are acting like she murdered children, instead of being at fault in a traffic accident. Why else would you put accident in quotes? Do have reason to believe it was malicious and purposeful? Why does it matter if she spoke English?
your aright what is wrong with america for just letting people.,
i know we are about to start teh american after fire sale, but its not started yet. yes its is worse, cause like with the rules above , it never should have happend.

SHE did murder them. vehicular homicide


Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
As for whether or not there's hysteria: Mike Huckabee even thinks there is. He called a 2005 plan to deny health care for illegals Un-American and said it "inflames those who are racists and bigots and makes them think there's a real problem". Somehow this rabidity about illegal immigrants has turned into what some people think is the decisive issue of the election, like gay-bashing was last time- when everyone realizes that it may very well lose the election wholesale for the Republicans.
Sorry i am not willing to pay for illegals. If they want health care, Let them go back to there country.
post #24 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by theimp98 View Post
i am sick of the whole thing,
i say hang her,she killed 4 kids. Rope is cheaper then keeping her in jail.
then put her head on a spike at the border as a warning for others.
Only if we do the same thing to dog owners whose dogs go "at large" and attack other people!! Maybe owning a gentle Golden Retreiver would become back in style
post #25 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
She failed to stop at a stop sign-- you're making it out like she came here to murder children "had no qualms about breaking the laws while here" sounds like she did it on purpose. Plenty of citizens cause horrible traffic accidents, and to this woman's credit, she wasn't drunk and she didn't try to run (though it says she's in a wheelchair, so I don't know if she was injured).

It's awful, and inexcusable, and I'm very sorry for the children and their families.

But being an illegal immigrant doesn't make you subhuman, and it doesn't have a darn thing to do with this accident except that she was driving without a license because she couldn't get a license because she's an illegal immigrant.

This sort of thing is exactly why a lot of places don't make you prove your citizenship to take a driving test and get your license. Maybe if all the anti-immigrant hysteria wasn't going on, this never would have happened, because the woman would have learned how to drive.
I know what you are saying. But we need to crack down on the illegal aliens. Notice the ILLEGAL part. If she came over here legally she would have a valid address and insurance. She made a simple mistake that ended in the deaths of four innocent children. If she just took a quick minute to stop at the stop sign then this would of never happened.
post #26 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by zao_cat View Post
She made a simple mistake that ended in the deaths of four innocent children. If she just took a quick minute to stop at the stop sign then this would of never happened.
How would having valid insurance and a driver's license have prevented anything? She did make a mistake, and of course if she hadn't then four children would still be alive, but that hasn't anything to do with her residency status.

How many of us have been in accidents? I was in one much like this, when I was a kid on a school bus, where someone ran a stop sign and hit us. Thankfully nobody was injured, but that accident happened quite independently of the driver's citizenship. The other accident I was in where someone ran a stop sign onto the highway, in which people were injured but thankfully not killed, also happened despite the woman's insurance and citizenship. And it was the third time she had caused an accident by running the same stop sign.

Clearly, bad drivers aren't limited to legal citizens. The only argument that can be made that links the two at all is that if she weren't here, this wouldn't have happened, but that's an argument can be made anytime there's a crime or an accident.

Expecting illegal immigrants to be perfect people doesn't make any sense. If one of them does something wrong, suddenly it's a perfect example of why all illegal immigrants should get kicked out immediately (even though such a task would cost a far sight more than all the health care costs and whatever else incurred by letting them stay). They're people, some of them good, some of them bad, some of them stupid, some of them bad parents or bad drivers, just like any other group of people. This type of thinking is completely unacceptable when applied to any other group (for instance, if someone started a thread about this same incident but they were using it as an example of why women shouldn't be allowed to drive...) and I don't get why people think I should find the argument obvious.
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