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This is SO depressing - Page 3

post #61 of 71
How do you know FOR SURE that snopes is the "real" story??

Also, I don't see why it matters if someone in the story does kill god. What if someone in the story killed the devil? There are people who worship the devil an no one would raise a stink about that I bet. Religion just makes me mad and makes no sense to me....
post #62 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jen View Post
How do you know FOR SURE that snopes is the "real" story??
Snopes is a pretty well respected source. The lady who started it has made it her work to debunk or confirm potential urban legends. It's a pretty interesting sight, actually. A good place to go if you wonder if something someone is telling you is true or not. She is skeptical more than anything.

Quote:
Also, I don't see why it matters if someone in the story does kill god. What if someone in the story killed the devil? There are people who worship the devil an no one would raise a stink about that I bet.
True. Majority religions tend to feel slighted when other groups dismiss them in the same way they are usually dismissing others.

Besides, it's just a book! Horrible things happen in books, and it does not necessarily mean that the author supports it. People should not take offense to conceptual works.

Quote:
Religion just makes me mad and makes no sense to me....
I am with you.
post #63 of 71
I've ended up being mixed on this thread. As far as children seeing this movie, it will be (as it should be) up to the parents. And parents really need to be proactive in at least reading reviews on "family entertainment". I will probably see the movie, because to me it will simply be a fantasy film. But, I can also see why there are parents and grandparents bothered by it.

This thread started with Cindy making a simple personal statement, and posting an "FYI" to anyone interested. I don't think that she had any intention of bashing or belittling anyone.
post #64 of 71
The children in His Dark Materials do, unintentionally, kill the first of the angels. That angel is referred to as God, simply because he was there first.

Pullman, like Twain, wrote himself into a corner. He can say that his books are about killing God, but his writing doesn't support that fact. The "God" that Lyra and Will inadvertently kill is the first angel... The first angel that was created by something greater. Therefore, not God.

It makes me angry when people write off books that they haven't bothered to crack. His Dark Materials, the HP series... come on, people. At least read them before boycotting them b/c of their supposed atheist tendencies.
post #65 of 71
I think that the movie looks interesting and if my kids were old enough I would let them watch it. I want them to not blindly believe in anyone one thing. I think it is important for them to see different aspects of faith or non faith. While I am trying to raise them Catholic, I can not force them down any one path. There is nothing wrong with different perspectives.
post #66 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jillian View Post
The children in His Dark Materials do, unintentionally, kill the first of the angels. That angel is referred to as God, simply because he was there first.

Pullman, like Twain, wrote himself into a corner. He can say that his books are about killing God, but his writing doesn't support that fact. The "God" that Lyra and Will inadvertently kill is the first angel... The first angel that was created by something greater. Therefore, not God.
Dang! I was trying to avoid saying this to anyone in case they were planning to read it - BIG spoiler!! I think that while they `technically' killed him, they were actually trying to save him. They didn't know who he was, or what his purpose was, or his significance. All they saw was a very frail old angel, and they tried to set him free from the middle of the battle. And I note that when they broke him out of the crystal, he floated away `with beautiful relief'...or words to that effect.

I think that the angel's regent, Metatron, was much more of a representation of Pullman's view of God, and I believe that that's who he meant when he talked about `killing God'. That's why I said the children didn't kill God. Firstly, because it was Mrs Coulter and Lord Asriel, and it was a definite, pure struggle, a battle of wills, intentional and wilful. And secondly, because it was Metatron that represented all the power and evil of the church, who overwhelmed God and made him weak and frail and powerless.

Lastly, I think that the criticism levelled at these books - and particular the children killing God - makes it out that they murdered him intentionally so that they could `do as they please'. This isn't true AT ALL, and is mostly why I said the children didn't kill him - because I don't think they did, in the sense that they are being accused of it. He died due to their actions in trying to set him free. There's a difference, IMO.
post #67 of 71
Sorry for the spolier. (=

I'll be sad if they take out the religious aspects of the books for the sake of the film. At any rate, the whole "God-killing"issue doesn't occur until book 3, so this movie should be safe for those who don't care to break the binding.
post #68 of 71
Exactly - and did you think it was kind of an incidental if-you-blinked-you-would-miss-it kind of occurrence? I certainly did - no big bang or clap of thunder or anything, just a few sentences at the end of a chapter where significantly bigger and scarier things happen! Metatron's demise was considerably more epic.
post #69 of 71
It's funny you say that. The first time I read it, I was in such a hurry to find out what happened that I almost missed it entirely. i remember barley catching it and having to go back and re-read.

The sentiment behind the act was really quite beautiful.
post #70 of 71
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jen View Post
How do you know FOR SURE that snopes is the "real" story??

Also, I don't see why it matters if someone in the story does kill god. What if someone in the story killed the devil? There are people who worship the devil an no one would raise a stink about that I bet. Religion just makes me mad and makes no sense to me....

It may not matter to you but there are many of us that it does matter to.

I pray someday that God will make sense to you.
post #71 of 71
Cindy,

With all due respect, I think that if it matters that much to you, you should take the time to actually read the books before forming an opinion. KitEKats4Eva and I have posted some thoughtful responses that indicate that what you've read *about* the movie/book isn't exactly how it happens *in* the book. The issue is not black and white. The action of the children is not malicious. Actually taking the time to read the stories will allow you to have an informed opinion on the subjet.
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