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My bengal girls

post #1 of 16
Thread Starter 
HI, seeing as I am new here, i thought I would post some photo's of my two bengal girls, and ask for your opninions on them.
They are my fist two bengals, although I have a friend who has had bengals for five years and has got me hooked on them.
I am finding them lovely to have around, they are fun, friendly and very very loving.

I would like your expert views on their breed/ show potential. They were sold to me on the active, so I was hoping for some quality views from you all here. I have taken a good look around this site and others, and you seemed the nicest and friendliest forum I found!

I have not bred cats before, but have witnessed many many cat births in my time at a cat rescue. So I do not think I am a complete novice, but I do think I have many many things to learn and hope you can all help me. I have many friends in cat circles who breed or are involved in cat clubs, shows etc.

My brown girl has a nice white spotted belly,that I just love and will strive to bring out in my future kittens. My snow girl is not so much show potential perhaps.

Of course the main thing about my girls is I love them to bits. I looked for a long time before buying any kittens, I researched a lot and spoke to many many breeders at shows and cat club meetings before finally getting a bengal. I was attracted to them for their very regal nature, their stunning markings, and their wonderfully cheeky and fun personalities. I shall never look back again, the best thing I have ever done is welcome bengals to my humble home, I enjoy and love them so much!

anyway, enough boring stuff, I shall shut my mouth now lol

post #2 of 16
Hi, welcome to TCS. I don't know if your kittens are show quality or not, even though I have 2 Bengals myself, but I do think they're adorable.

My guess is that rib bars take away points, and it seems like your little brown spotted Bengal has quite a few rib bars. However, your Snow Bengal looks pretty good to me. I don't show my cats, so I really don't know how the judges are about things, but I would guess your brown spotted baby is pet quality. However, that doesn't mean a thing, because they are BOTH beautiful.
post #3 of 16
Thread Starter 
thanks for the honest reply, appreciate it.
I think theyre both lovely of course! I have a few friends in cat circles, as I say, and I'll be getting them to have a look at both girls.
Was hoping to show them both, and will be slightly upset with the breeder if I cant. She sells her cats either as pet or as show AND breeding. So if my brown girl isnt breed or show quality I will not be happy with the breeder. Still love my cats though of course, but was hoping to break into the show circles more than just going along with no cat.

I would much rather people were honest and say no i dont think theyre good enough, I appreciate honesty, so thanks for your opinions, I know it can be difficult to tell from photo's.
post #4 of 16
Thread Starter 
I notice you are in the USA. I think generally speaking your standards of breed ( and quality) are higher than here in the uk. Seen some gorgeous bengals over there! Maybe one day in the far off future I might import one, as they are certainly a better standard of the breed than the majority of uk ones
post #5 of 16
Also, please note, that I might not be correct in my guestimation either. I don't consider my Simba to be a show quality cat, but to me, he's one of the most beautiful Bengals I've ever seen.

I know my Angel is breeder quality, but probably not show quality, and I think she's adorable.

Check out the attachments for pics of Angel and Simba
post #6 of 16
I'm very surprised that a breeder would sell you kittens on the active register without you having experience of showing a neuter, and without offering you lots of guidance. Most reputable breeders will not sell a kitten for breeding to anyone who is new to the breed and to the world of showing and breeding, regardless of the quality of the kitten. I would go by the advice of the breeder as to whether they are of breeding quality, or if the breeder isn't very helpful find another breeder who is prepared to mentor you. Although it wouldn't be a bad idea to neuter them both and show them as neuters so that you can learn a lot more about the breed before you start breeding. Either way, I'd get them entered into an appropriate show then you can get the judges' feedback and the comments of other breeders as to their potential.

It isn't always easy to tell whether a cat has show potential when they're very small. A good breeder will have a good idea, but it's not possible to guarantee that a kitten will do well.

They are very cute ktties though
post #7 of 16
You are right in that the UK bengals have up until nowish not had as vivid markings as the US bred cats. However that's all changing now and all the bigger UK breeders have been importing american bred cats.

Your girls are still in their fuzzies so it's hard to see it exactly but if I wanted to breed I would have gotten one of the "new generation" kittens. You probably did a mistake there. Basically breeding should be all about improving the breed and you'll be a generation behind with your kittens now.

Of course there is more to bengals than just the spots and contrast you also need to get the right type of body and face. Thick tail carried low, small ears, wild face, big puffy whisker pads etc. It's just my opinion here but I much prefer cats that really have good type than some cats I've seen that have great spots but not so good bengal "look". I.e you should be able to tell they're bengals even if they were solid black. Some of that doesn't really show until they're more mature though. Especially ears and tails.

The breeder I got my cat from has just added two cats to her program for example (she didn't import, they're from an imported stud.)

What they look like:

She's sort of a bit behind because she has to wait for them to grow up rather than producing cats like them right away. She doesn't show her cats very much and is more focusing on making fantastic pet kittens than winning lots of ribbons and has only a few litters a year.

Your kittens also look very young. The GCCF really recommends that breeders don't let their kittens go until they're 12-13 weeks and have finished getting all their shots. I would be suspicious of any UK breeder that doesn't follow that guideline.

Your cats are adorable though and I'm sure they're fantastic cats to live with but for breeding I think you may have made a mistake. They're still kittens and in their fuzzies so you can't know for certain now though. You can show them though definately. If I were you I would probably spay them and show them to get a better feel for what the judges are looking for and what it's like to live with a bengal and then go and really research lots of breeders and get a stunning breeding queen.

I can pm you the names of UK breeders that are really doing good work now here if you want.

Anyway here's my girl:

UK bred and sold as a pet on the non active register although I have asked and I'm allowed to show her if I want.

Here she was as a kitten the day after I finally got her at 14 weeks. You can see they can change a lot.
post #8 of 16
Thread Starter 
wow those cats are stunning.
My girls were born 19th may, and the breeder seems very nice, but you can never tell I guess.
There mother was an f4, according to the pedigree I have for them.

I havent owned a bengal before, but have had a lot of interaction with my friends ones, I'm always round her place asking her questions, going to shows with her. I also go to two cat clubs meetings, have been for about three months now, so I am keen to learn and to get involved in the world of cats.

The breeder I went to was lovely, and offered no end of advice BEFORE I got the cats, but has since seemed to rather quieten a lot, and isnt there as much.
As I say though I have spoken to many breeders at shows, I know this doesnt make up for lack of experience in owning a bengal, but I am 100% certain theyre the right cat for me.

PLease do not think I am "answering " back or disagreeing with you what you have all said, as I am not, just trying to explain I gave this a years worth of thought and research before getting a bengal. I really appreciate your advice, being so new to this breed myself. I also appreciate that me being around my friends bengals, going to lots of shows and talking to breeders online/phone etc does not make up for advice from experienced owners, and as I said earlier I appreciate honesty. My aim is to keep with good breeding ethics and try and improve the breed, not simply to produce lots of medium quality kittens.

Siggav, all three of those bengals are stunning. I LOVE the orange glow to your girl. What a stunner she is!

Like I say i'll feel extremly let down by the breeder if these girls are not show quality, I dont mind so much about the breeding side from these two, but I am ever so eager to get into the show world.
We have missed all our local shows, there is one near us in september but we didnt get the transfer of ownerships sent off in time so cant enter them into that, but I do plan to enter them in at least one show to see where I am going with these two.

I would never part with them now though, I am so totally in love with them both, theyre my little princesses

thanks for the wisely words of advice, really appreciated.
post #9 of 16
Question is DID you buy them as show quality or were they pet/breeder quality. IMO only the best should be shown and bred - if they are not up to standard to be shown, then they really should not be bred.

Nial's one of the expert Bengal breeders here to evaluate yours. I will agree that the little snow looks very pet quality (not even good enough for breeding) IMO. I'm not a Bengal expert, but learning how to spot show quality in most breeds.

I am a retired Cornish rex breeder and know a lot of the standards for most cats - the Bengals are not one of them.

I'd wait for Nial's opinion on your brown one. Might be showable - I'd show her and have her evaluated before you do anything. But I really would have the Snow Bengal spayed as soon as possible.
post #10 of 16
First of all congratulations on having become a bengal owner.

.....and welcome to TCS. Hope you stay on.

I looked at your two girls and I have to say, they are much too young to tell if either is breeder/show quality. They both still have their guard hairs which really camoflages the pattern.
The problem is, I don't know the parents or the history of litters by the parents, therefore I can't make a judgement call on these two at this age.

Often breeders will know what kind of kittens 2 parents are producing and will be able to make educated guesses on a kittens potential even at a very young age. Bengal kittens coats can be extremely clear for the first week of life, then get dull and fuzzy for the next 2 months. During that first week, with the clear coat, an experienced breeder will be able to determine potential in kittens.........but only for pelt and pattern. There is no way to determine conformity to standard on structure. Even at 3 months, sometimes conformation can be tricky to judge. But armed with the knowledge of what the parents have produced in the past, an educated guess can be made.

Now, to be perfectly honest, if I had two kittens such as yours, from a first breeding between an unproven pair, I would pet both kittens out. Because I can't take the time to wait for "unknowns".
But, don't get discouraged yet. I have certainly sold kittens as pets, who didn't seem at the time to be anything special, and then turned out to be amazing and I kicked myself for letting them go.

For the two that you have, I think time will tell and you should be taking photos every week and going back to those photos and comparing as time goes by. The snow's in particular can take a long time to develope, especially the lynx point.

Maybe you won't mind sharing photos with us, so we can see them grow.
post #11 of 16
I have nothing of worth to add for you except...

Maybe you won't mind sharing photos with us, so we can see them grow.
I second this motion!!!
post #12 of 16
Thread Starter 
Of course I dont mind sharing photo's! I'll be sure to keep them coming.

My focus here isnt necessarily on the breeding, as I say it's more on wanting to get into the show circles with my own cats, and not just going along with my friends cats.

The breeder i got them from only has two prices, pet or Breed AND show. Which I now know isnt the same.
The pedigree we were given has gogees and sarez lines, and the fourth one back has a quad grand champion in, so hopefully I have not-too-bad quality kittens.

Either way I think theyre adorable and cute and have no regrets getting bengals, I am really enjoying them being here, they certainly have brightened up my life no end and are a pleasure and privealage to own IMHO
post #13 of 16
Thread Starter 
oh and just thought to add, the mommy bengal has had a previous litter, so not sure if that makes a difference.

I'll dig out some earlier photo's of them
post #14 of 16
Thread Starter 
I found these two the breeder took of when they were a lot younger...

so thought I would share them.
post #15 of 16
Awwwwww the little pumpkins are adorable!!!!!!
post #16 of 16
Thread Starter 
thanks sarahp.

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