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Such a dilemma (kinda long) - Page 2

post #31 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiery View Post
The difference it makes is minimal at best. Doesn't mean we can't or shouldn't tryor darndest, but we really need to be realistic. Reality is: Most people do not care. It's sick, it's terrible, and it's shameful, but most people just don't give a crap. We, the cat lovers who spend thousands on our pets and lavish them with affection, are the exception rather than the rule. Some people will pay attention and be appalled, but more often than not, the most we'll get is a shrug of a shoulder and our words promptly forgotten.
I couldn't have said it better.
I do understand most of the people here are the exception, not the norm at least from what I have seen. But it does make me so happy to see how well the cats here are loved and taken care of. There are so many out there that need good homes, it is heartbreaking.
Another thing, so many people "just aren't cat people" either or are "allergic" and just dismiss cats all together. An individual in my old rural neighborhood used to shoot cats, he didn't "like" them walking on his clean cars and using his veggie garden as a litterbox. My cat is inside only, all my cats will be since I learned about that event.

I know I am so called preaching to the choir I suppose on a cat forum, but maybe not. Maybe there is someone out there reading this not knowing much about cats wondering this exact same question.

And the justonelitter people are BYB's. And they have the potential to make hundreds of babies off just that one litter- if they don't spay/n the oops/or my cat is so smart/pretty she needs to have a litter - kittens they produce and also the parents.

But it just hurts my heart so much to not at least try and make a difference and educate. If it wasn't for forums like this one many people would not even know the term BYB. Just the fact this poster is doing their homework makes me happy!
post #32 of 44
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiery View Post
Common sense says there are way more cats than people who want them. Pay attention please: I was talking about the people on these forums.


The difference it makes is minimal at best. Doesn't mean we can't or shouldn't tryor darndest, but we really need to be realistic. Reality is: Most people do not care. It's sick, it's terrible, and it's shameful, but most people just don't give a crap. We, the cat lovers who spend thousands on our pets and lavish them with affection, are the exception rather than the rule. Some people will pay attention and be appalled, but more often than not, the most we'll get is a shrug of a shoulder and our words promptly forgotten.
And even some self-professed cat lovers do not care. I have a friend who got THREE girl kittens from pet stores and one male cat as a stray. She didn't spay any of her girls b/c she couldn't afford it after paying for the cats. The male was not neutered either. So one of her cats had kittens. She didn't get any of those 4 fixed either before she adopted them out (or got them shots). Then I finally convinced her to get her cats fixed and she did the females but didn't want the males to "lose their manhood." So...she brought in another stray female..and the male got her pregnant....and it goes on despite my efforts of trying to convince her why it's good not to have kittens
post #33 of 44
Quote:
So, i just thought of something. If you (the hypothetical "you") were a back yard breeder who didn't care about the kittens, why would you give them away for free? wouldn't you try to make a profit on them?
Most BYB(the ones that are really super bad imho) are the ones who do it for profit, who refuse to spend the money on proper medical care, and basically just use their cats as breeding machines. These are generally not the ones you'll find on Craig's list. Craig's list kittens come from a variety of sources--from the above example: the "just one litter" people, the irresponsible out-door non-spaying people, "oopsies", fosters, and lots more.

Just gotta be smart when dealing with getting a kitten, no matter WHERE you get it from.
post #34 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by miao_kitty View Post
So, i just thought of something. If you (the hypothetical "you") were a back yard breeder who didn't care about the kittens, why would you give them away for free? wouldn't you try to make a profit on them?
Not for sure, it probably varies per individual and per litter if we are talking about a BYB

Maybe because they cut costs, no vet bills (shots, spay/n, worming, vet check,), no to low food costs (sell them young). Their total cost is low, unlike good breeders that show, health test, frequent worming/vet costs, kitten toys, care packages, etc. so they aren’t losing much if they give them away. And it might make them feel better to give them away, rather than charging.

The older the free kitties get, the more they eat, and if inside the more litter they use, and the more likely they will have more kittens and repeat the cycle, so they would rather give them away. It was probably an oops litter or a litter that they wanted just that one time since the mom cat was so cute/smart/had unique markings, had pretty eyes, the kids liked her and wanted to have kittens (insert any other reason here)

But the sad thing is unless they fix the kittens from that oops or just one litter, those kittens are going to be making a whole lot more

They must understand somewhere that there are so many kittens in the US maybe, they most likely will not make a profit and if they sold them for a rehoming fee they wouldn't get sold.
They aren’t bad people, they just are uneducated, don't care, and don’t know any better I would think. I don't really know
post #35 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by miao_kitty View Post
And even some self-professed cat lovers do not care. I have a friend who got THREE girl kittens from pet stores and one male cat as a stray. She didn't spay any of her girls b/c she couldn't afford it after paying for the cats. The male was not neutered either. So one of her cats had kittens. She didn't get any of those 4 fixed either before she adopted them out (or shots). Then I finally convinced her to get her cats fixed and she did the females but didn't want the males to "lose their manhood." So...she brought in another stray female..and the male got her pregnant....and it goes on despite my efforts of trying to convince her why it's good not to have kittens
Oh wow. What a sad cycle to have to watch from a friend.
post #36 of 44
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiery View Post
Most BYB(the ones that are really super bad imho) are the ones who do it for profit, who refuse to spend the money on proper medical care, and basically just use their cats as breeding machines. These are generally not the ones you'll find on Craig's list. Craig's list kittens come from a variety of sources--from the above example: the "just one litter" people, the irresponsible out-door non-spaying people, "oopsies", fosters, and lots more.

Just gotta be smart when dealing with getting a kitten, no matter WHERE you get it from.
thanks and sorry for asking questions that ppl already answer. I can't quite keep up with this forum. =P
post #37 of 44
=( Yeah, it really makes me sad that some people who claim to be cat lovers just don't get it. I have a friend who, at one point, had four cats she was keeping in one filthy, tiny room. ALL of them were attention starved, because, despite this friend's claim that she absolutely adored kitties, once she had them, she barely touched them other than to throw them off her bed. Sigh. It makes me kind of sick.
post #38 of 44
Thread Starter 
Proof that Craig's list is not all bad: http://denver.craigslist.org/pet/365050347.html (not that there have been any claims that it is all bad )

oh - and one reason I have a feeling that all the kittens at the Boulder shelter will be adopted: there were 3 kittens on their webpage this morning that all had adoption holds and now none of those on are their website.
post #39 of 44
Wow, those kitties look very similar to lynxcats! They're just missing the polydactyly.. but yep, you'll find many like that as well. =) Sweet!
post #40 of 44
I just have a question for those that say to go to a shelter etc.

some have said they found a preg. stray or a litter of feral kittens etc. do you bring these to the shelters to find homes for them???? because if you don't then you are basically telling her not to get a kitten from someone like yourself etc.

One of my cats was from a cat in my neighborhood that the owners got and was told she was spayed. obviously she wasn't...... so we weren't supporting a BYB or petstores or anything like that but instead someone that had an OOPS and yes mom was fixed after that. Another one was from my vets office that someone found some feral kittens and brought them in....... another one I found outside as a feral and took her in but couldn't catch any of the others or mom (they weren't at my home or near it), one my hubby got from me and he is a purebred that the mom had to have a c-section and the others babies didn't make it. and one was from someone that I used to work with that had an oops........ I haven't gotten a single cat from a shelter and have had NO health issues with any besides the feral that I took in as a kitten when she was older and my brother (we shared an apartment) left cleaner in a bucket in the bathtub and she got into that and had major kidney failure etc and we had to put her down. My other 4 cats I still have and have all been VERY VERY healthy and one is 12 yrs old and doing great and going strong. I feel I helped all of my cats and the people out adn none went on to have litter after litter (the moms) that i know of besides the ferals moms of course) it was just an oops which CAN happen.


When I lived with my parents we got a puppy from a shelter and she was 6-8 weeks old. well we had her about 4-5 mo. and she started to get NASTY. we tried training etc and nothing worked she just really freaked out and had to give her back to the shelter who found her another home and she came back and last I heard they found another one they "thought" might work for her but we didn't hear anymore after that so not sure what happened so there are NO guarentees with shelters either........


But my thing is there are SOOOOOOOOOO many in this forum that take in preg. cats and raise the kittens and find homes for them with out taking them to the shelters and to tell someone to ONLY go to a shelter to get a kitten takes away from what these people do. she wasn't saying she was looking for a BYB or a petstore just another kitten in need which I think is what many have on here. so there are many others besides shelters that do alot of goodfor the pets........ not sure HOW the ones on here find homes for their kittens but they obviously do find homes and have to get the word around somehow........
post #41 of 44
Thread Starter 
And as for my post earlier showing kittens advertised on Craigs list, I just talked to the woman who rescued them and she caught both moms, spayed them (and all the kittens BTW) and let the wilder mom go back out. The friendly mom she's gonna keep! I'm so glad people like this exist. Thank you all for your dedication to animals.
post #42 of 44
The point is to investigate the person advertising the kittens. Why do they have kittens in the first place? What kind of care are they getting? Have they been to the vet? How well do they investigate potential adoptees? Do they make people sign contracts to have their animals spayed/neutered?
These are the things to look for. Shelters do the best they can under horrible circumstances. They are often over crowded and underfunded. Because of this, I advocate supporting them. But yes, helping a smaller rescue group, foster parents, etc is also contributing to the cure, rather than the problem.
Avoid anyone who has policies that contribute to the problem. Tell them that's why you are adopting elsewhere. Encourage them to change the policies you disagree with.
My problem is with those giving out free kittens and BYB. I have a problem with Oops litters too, but accidents do happen and as long as the people are learning from the mistake/accident, they can be a place to adopt from too.
People aren't necessarily BAD just because they are irresponsible or not educated about the ramifications of their actions. People can change.
There have been numerous posts about people on CL adopting out kittens that are way too young, are BYBs, not screening potential adoptees well, not getting the kittens vetted, not taking proper care of the kittens.
Obviously, those are the people to avoid but, if you don't want to, then don't. We all have free will. If you don't like the advise people are giving you, don't follow it.

Good luck!

Devlyn
post #43 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by junior67 View Post
I just have a question for those that say to go to a shelter etc.

some have said they found a preg. stray or a litter of feral kittens etc. do you bring these to the shelters to find homes for them????
Yes. When I have been in that situation and when I am again I do what I can personally with them and then work with a local shelter to help re-home them, spay/n, and give them their shots if needed and health checks. I did write in another post though I understand this is not always the case with people that take in other kittens/cats
post #44 of 44
miao_kitty, that sounds like a terrific solution. Do you know if you'll be adopting one of the kittens from those two litters?
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