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Invisable fence? Neighbor problem!!! - Page 2

post #31 of 47
Originally Posted by mschauer View Post
Is there a rule against enclosing your back patio? That might be another option and would have the bonus that you could be be out there with them.
I think that is a great solution. Kind of like an enclosed porch.

I think the reason they market invisible fences for cats is because they will do anything for $$$.

Regarding your neighbor, she sounds like a busy body or a control freak. It is one thing to let you know about her displeasure about your cat roaming her property. But totally another for her to tell you what type of trees to plant in your yard or if your grass is a few days past her ideal height. Something tells me there's no pleasing her.
post #32 of 47
Originally Posted by Grinder_7 View Post
I'm a little upset this morning.
As you know we were at wits end with his constant howling wanting to go outside. We even put him on Prozac which had diminishing result as a last resort.

Keeping Milo indoors is basically telling us we should put Milo down because he was on his last life with his howling, LITERALLY! And now he is a wonderful VERY smart cat (screen door was just one of his brilliant ideas). If you have read my blog you know of our problems.
I added the bold.

Originally Posted by Camille Eonich View Post
Why are so many people so willing to drug their animals in order to make them conform to the way that people think that they should be? I just don't understand this mindset. If your pet is anxious then maybe you aren't paying it enough attention or giving it enough exercise or stimulating it enough mentally.

Grinder says that her cat is purrfectly happy if it gets to go outside a couple of hours a day and she gets told to lock it up and give the drugs more time to work.
You are entitled to your opinion and I respect that.

I think that "drugs" are a perfectly reasonable option when euthanasia is being considered.

Personally, I encouraged the Prozac because sadly, some vets prescribe it without fully explaining that it can take a few months to start working. It is a mild antidepressant, not a tranquilizer! The fact that it takes forever to have any effect should help back that info up. It's tough to know how it is until you've been there.
post #33 of 47
Did you forget I've suggested SEVERAL times that you should build or buy and enclosure to keep your cat in???????

I don't care WHERE you live - if your animals are not confined to your property - leash law or not, YOU have the responsiblity to keep them under control.

I have dogs and cats - always have and they are confined to my property - they are NOT allowed to be roaming on other neighbors property. YOU are at fault here. All it takes is one neighbor to put some poison out and your cat get sick and maybe die. Then who's to blame?

Every town has a leash law - maybe remind your neighbor that she is not abiding by the leash law with her dog.

Her dog has no business in your yard and your cat has no business in her yard or any other yard!
post #34 of 47
It sounds like what you want to hear is screw your neighbor, let the cat go where it wishes. Well, go ahead, she sounds like a pain, let the cat out whenever you please. Does that help? I agree with you, she is totally out of line, does that help? No. Because she has threatened your cat. Well, if you try to keep him in, you are going to have to put him down anyway, so why not take the risk? The cat is dead either way. Might want to discuss it with her, and tell her that if anything happens to your cat, her dog will have a very short lifespan. Might even offer the dog a piece of good meat in front of her, so she knows how easy it is to feed him. Don't know what else to tell you. Good luck and keep us posted.
post #35 of 47
Thread Starter 
Lets get one thing straight right now I'm a guy!

Camille Eonich - no no - we were not really too keen on drugs and euthanasia was never ever considered. Taking him to a shelter WAS but we found out that every shelter is so full of cats they are putting them down - especially adult cats with behavioral problems.

I think I was a little ticked off yesterday because we had FINALLY made Milo happy and EVERYBODY was happy. He could spend a few hours outside at 4 in the morning to 6 and he was so happy and content the rest of the day. it totally changed his attitude. You could just see it in his body language.

Then BAM!

He was a little irritated this morning at 3:30 when I would not let him out but he was back to sleep at 4:30 . . .to bad I could not get back to sleep.

We put him on a harness last night but he broke the 15 foot leash.

It's funny watching him open the sliding screen door. He will put his two left feet on it and then push backwards. BINGO.

gailuvscats - sadly we had discussed Milo's quality of life vs. lifespan and were prepared.

Here is the deal - Milo is the most loving, friendly, and smart cat I have ever had in 50 years of cat ownership. When our corgi is hyperventilating in the bathtub because of thunderstorm, Milo will sit with him to calm him

He has taught three kittens how to take care of themselves by teaching them how to fight - truly an amazing thing to watch. He has all his claws and only once has he bared them.

(once Sierra was getting on his nerves and he put his paw up in the air in Sierras face and showed his claws - she backed down).

If he was not so amazing he would be gone.

as for vets - We are in a new town and frankly did not like the old vet. We had 3 cats die in the last 4 years and they were no help - like a money pit - just doing test after test and never finding anything until the cat dies!

Then after three weeks cuts us off of Prozac and says she will come up with another idea! grrrrrrrrr

I'm sorry if I was a little ornery yesterday - just ticked off. The cat thing was just the tip of the iceberg.
post #36 of 47
I feel bad for your big fella Milo - he is adorable! And it sounds like your neighbors are very self centered, considering they let their dog run free.

Telling the neighbor to leash their dog would probably feel great at the time. Someone suggested that and I thought "yeah!" But it sounds like they are enough problem already and it will just build up to one of those horrible neighbor stand-offs. So my advice is not to talk to them about anything until your kitty situation is settled.

Maybe for now just think about what will make Milo happy, since you can't control who will live next to you for the rest of his life.

My sister has 2 cats and her neighbor's cat drives her cats crazy. She does have a fence, and the cat comes under the fence, so I suggested she put aluminum foil and sticky tape near the openings and also talk to her neighbor about her cats being old and stressing out, and letting the neighbor know what she is doing. For now it is working.

With your Milo, maybe for now you could try supervising his outdoor time and going with him. Let him out for a shorter amount of time and be there with him. If he starts to go to the neighbor's yard, pick him up and bring him inside. Or pick him up and take him to the other side of the yard away from the neighbor and give him a treat. It sounds like he does want to sniff around and walk around a bit. If you lead the way with toys and string he may go along just for kicks, even if he doesn't care about your toys.

That is what we've done with our cats, even though it is an investment of our time. Over time the cats have substituted our attention with "outside" and now we do their play sessions indoors using the same toys (fishing pole with toy on it). Just having that time to play and have fun seems to do the trick and it gives them their fix for outside. But indeed when summer rolls around and especially if we are sitting outside, our Toby (same as your Milo) just howls and cries pitifully.

We can't let them out now because we have two ferals outside that we care for, and my indoor cats chase them when they are all outside.

In our old house, we had a fenced in back yard but our one girl kitty could easily get over it into the neighbor's yard. The neighbor complained and we told him to please do shoo and yell at her and scare her back to our yard without any water or violence. He was fine with taking that responsibility, so we had a truce. But it sounds like your neighbor expects you to manage it, and that is perfectly understandable even if she is rude about it.

Good luck. On the enclosure, you will probably need a building permit for anything you do, so that is something to consider. I am guessing the ban on dog kennels is to limit barking(?). I recently read an article about neighborhood associations and apparently they can be very powerful and scary. I hope that is not the case with yours. If I were you, I would visit your municipal building and become friends with all the people there informally. It sounds like you may need them.
post #37 of 47
Barb, I've seen several different kinds/types of portable cat enclosures that would work for letting the cat sit in them for a few hours. That's what I suggested in the beginning.

It is his responsibility to monitor his cat when outside - no matter WHO the neighbors happened to be.
post #38 of 47
Yep I'm pretty sure that is what my post said.

On the enclosures, I hope it works out.
post #39 of 47
I don't see why the cat should suffer because you have a difficult neighbor. You're in a rural area and it's perfectly reasonable for a cat to be outdoor/indoor.

So far it sounds like you've only spoken once with the neighbor... I think it's far from a foregone conclusion that she would really harm your cat.

I think you have to have a talk more with the neighbor to work out the situation.

See if you can make peace with the neighbor... I suspect that a cat would not actually hang out near a dog that could hurt it; they have a strong protective instinct. So either the neighbor isn't being truthful about the cat going near it, or the dog isn't dangerous. It could be that the neighbor is just dramatic or controlling, or really that she dislikes cats and doesn't want to see them.

Maybe you could improve your fence at the points where the cat is getting out, or sprinkle cat repellent along the perimeter where the neighbor's property is. Try training the cat to avoid that side of your yard. You could try saying "No" and putting the cat inside whenever he tries to go that way; with a lot of repetition it might work. Or if you do go for a radio-control system, you could attach it to a harness, which is much harder than a collar for the cat to get out of.

Or you could provide some cat repellent for the neighbor to sprinkle on her property. Maybe if you explain that this is an outdoor cat and what happens when he's kept inside, the neighbor will relate. Other talking points might be the fact that there is no law against outdoor cats. If you can't find a friendly agreement, you might involve a mediator.
post #40 of 47
I'm not going to attack anyone here, but I do want to say this first...

If Grinder a Doberman Pinscher who howled and cried and made himself miserable if he wasn't allowed to roam, and bothered the neighbors and their (admittedly, unleashed) dogs.. would you say the same thing?

That's where I are coming from, and most likely where Goldenkitty is coming from as well, though I won't presume to take the words out of her mouth.. YOU are responsible for your pets well-being and to keep them properly contained, etc. Essentially that is your duty as their owner, their caregiver, and their 'mom' or 'dad.' Just like it would be with your children.. although let's hope invisible fences aren't being marketed for children! Basically what I am saying is take responsibility for your actions.

Grinder, It would probably be easiest for you to fence/screen in underneath your deck. I am going to suggest you have at least a waist-high wall of some sort, even if it's lattice, to keep things out. Some amazing links were provided earlier on in the thread.. something like that, wit the mesh and such, would work well. You can even tile/pave/brick/etc a part of the enclosure, and put some beautiful shade-loving plants in there. It's a great chance for you to make a quiet, peaceful, haven for yourself and your kitties where you can enjoy the outdoors. Mine LOVE our screened-in porch.
post #41 of 47
Originally Posted by emmylou View Post
I don't see why the cat should suffer because you have a difficult neighbor. You're in a rural area and it's perfectly reasonable for a cat to be outdoor/indoor.
Outside sure go ahead but rural does not equate to safe in rural areas. Also I live in a rural area and as much as I love cats and dogs I don't except people to allow their animals on my property to do gosh knows what just because they wanna allow their animals to roam. It is not reasonable to allow your pet to wander on my property. I pay the taxes on it, I maintain it, I pay the mortgage (or rent) on it for my family and pets use. Not for the neighborhoods pets.
post #42 of 47
I agree that the neighbor has every right to not have someone else's cat on their property.

The fact that the cat doesn't know it is ticking off the neighbor, but the cat's guardian does know, is a pretty clear case for the guardian needing to be with the cat every time it it outside, OR, the guardian negotiating an understanding with the neighbor, OR, the enclosure which I think is safest.

I think the enclosure is safest because a) only one neighbor has bothered to speak up that the cat is ticking her off and there may be others; b) the cat may be ticking off other loose dogs or cats and they can't be reasoned with; c) if anything happens to this gorgeous lovely kitty, it is his guardian who will suffer along with kitty.

I empathize with Grinder because I have feral cats and while I am working to get them safe, it is not overnight. In the meantime it is scary to see them go all over the place. I have talked to almost all the neighbors whose yards may be part of their area, and asked them to please let me know if there are any problems. After their TNR they are better, but it is still scary.

But in this case the neighbor has spoken up and needs to be respected.

I liked your analogy norudoru. In fact one of my neighbors has a coon mix old dog that she recently rescued. This is the sweetest dog, but he does get loose and comes right up to my porch where my ferals are. They don't seem to mind each other terribly, but as you can imagine the ferals do hit yellow alert (not red alert yet that I have seen). The neighbor explained the dog loves to hunt and kill raccoons and we have about 6 under our porch, so that is what he smells. I am sort of lukewarm about the dog visits. I don't think I want raccoon carnage and since my ferals sleep near the raccoons depending on the weather, I don't want him to make any mistakes. So anyhow, yeah I know where you are coming from. Other peoples' pets are just that- not yours. It is a terribly sensitive area.

I'm glad that Grinder posted this thread because a lot of thoughtful conversation is coming out of it.

The adoption group I work with will absolutely NOT adopt to anyone who puts on the questionnaire that they will let their cat out. Neighbors or no, this is a very controversial area. It is interesting to see all the opinions.
post #43 of 47
Yes you are right Noludora; I love my pets just as much as any of us here - but I also take responsibility for their actions and I respect my neighbors (whether good or bad).

We have some neighbors (long story) who had 4 cats - all unspayed/neutered and the males SPRAYED. Granted they were tied out, but they still sprayed on whatever was closest. We've talked and talked to them (long story short - they no longer have the cats - they were taken from them when they were evicted). We refused to allow them to bring their cats (on leash) in our yard....we did NOT want them spraying on anything and upsetting our indoor cats!

Whether its a cat, dog, or a child - YOU are responsible for their actions if left unsupervised. What would the OP do if the cat was a child and was over bothering the neighbor and/or neighbor's dog? Would they still find it acceptable to allow that to continue?
post #44 of 47
Yep GoldenKitty, that actually happened with 2 of my sisters- I mentioned one of them in an earlier post where the neighbor's cat was freaking out her 2 cats with daily visits but I did not mention the spraying.

My other sister had a wonderful grammy kitty (now over the Rainbow Bridge )also in a fenced-in yard, and her neighbor also had a male cat who came in and scared her cat. She was able to block off where he was coming in. This kitty then started coming to her front porch and pouncing at her cat in the window where she sunned herself in her golden years.

My sister talked to the neighbors and they sort of shrugged it off. She was so upset, she was going to go to the police. I told her to get a hiss matt but she went back to the neighbors and was able to get them to keep this cat in long enough to where her cat could get some peace. Actually I think they may have simply neutered him.

I saw the other cat one day when I was visiting my sister (in NJ!) and he was sleeping on his own porch with another kitty. He looked so calm. When I think of where the situation could have gone without the neighbor taking responsibility, it makes me very unhappy.
post #45 of 47
Yes this is really fascinating. I would like to ask you all - would you keep your child locked up inside for its entire life?? Because you all keep saying if the cat was a child you'd do this and that, well a cat is a CAT, it's an ANIMAL and it is in its NATURE to go OUTSIDE! Yes, it is a big bad scary world, and bad things happen, I know, my baby girl died in January, but I am not going to keep my cats wrapped in cotton wool in case they die too, although I obviously worry.This is the price we pay for loving. I think my cats would be utterly miserable kept inside all the time, and I've never met anyone who does this. I would also never give my pets mind-altering drugs that I would never take myself, I'm not suprised all your cats seem to have so many problems, stuck in a prison on drugs! Let your cats just be cats, they are independant creatures by nature, and deserve a bit of freedom.

This is just my opinion.
post #46 of 47
To me there is a huge difference between my kids going outside and my cat going outside. My kids I can teach them not to go in the road, not to go in the woods, not to mess with or get on people's cars, stay out of people's yards, do not mess with a dog or any animal for that matter. Can I teach any of that to my cat...NO. I have seen to many cats and dogs dead in or on the side of the road inmy rural area because people thought it was ok to let them roam outside.

My cat is very happy inside. After he was neutered he has ZERO interest in going outside. And before his neuter he very little interest in being out there. He has been raised since 5 wks old inside period. He has no idea what outside life is or the dangers he is missing out on. My cat does not take mind altering drugs but I do understand why some poeple have there cats on them. My cat also has tons of toys for inside play, 3 kids to chase and play with, he gets the best food. My cat has a great inside life and his not miserable with us inside.
post #47 of 47
i'm just a new cat on the block here but after skimming this thread i want to offer the following...

i agree with the "you are ultimately responsible the well being for your cat/dog/ferret/rabbits (insert pet here). if that means keeping him off your neighbor's property, so be it. i sure don't appreciate my neighbor's cat coming here digging in my garden beds, eating the birds, chasing the baby rabbits. the cat enclosure looks like it would work perfectly under your raised deck area. it does not appear that it would protrude or distract from the "openness" of your yard in any way.

i have two cats that are indoor kitties. one does cry to go out and she goes on a leash, on the deck and i sit out there with her until she/or i get an "outdoor fix." if a leash or harness or some type of restraint isn't doable for your cat, get up an enclosure and be done with it.

quite frankly, you asked for ideas and it seems that most everyone here offered some great advice and fixes for your situation. you can continue to deny there is an issue with your neighbor and your cat and you're not going to back down. ultimately your pet will suffer one way or another for it.

i live in a farming community where there are strays animals everywhere. there are also coyotes, bobcats and other critters that would not hesitate to have any one of the strays and/or outdoor pets for dinner. you say you are in a farming community as well. you cannot predict where your cat is roaming no matter how well you think you know your cat. that's the beauty of cats; they are not predictable and always keep us on our toes. you do need to do what's best for your pet and i'm sure you already know what that is, no matter how long this thread goes on.............

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