Looking for 2 purebred kittens: Help with breed selection, please

lnbandcats · Jun 25, 2007

I, too, have enjoyed reading this thread. I am the proud new meowmy of an adorable ragdoll boy from Celestialrags - you can see photos of Cosmo in the fur picture forum! Cosmo is totally running my household right now - after only 10 days. He is a little demon kitty - into everything and running around like a total nutcase! Because that's what kittens do! But, he also totally respects the space of my 7 yr old Sophie (who hasn't adjusted to him 100%)
Cosmo is very aware of that and leaves her alone. I would suggest that you meet the SoCal Ragdoll breeder - they are wonderful cats. I think that there have been a few posts from Ragdoll advocates on this thread! Let us know what you decide to do, too! Good luck!

bahger · Jun 25, 2007

As always, thanks everyone for your interest, everyone.

I thought you may be amused by the latest developments so here they are:

We went to see a litter of Aby-Ocis yesterday and I found myself battling emotional blackmail not just from my children but from my otherwise level-headed wife, too; they all wanted to commit to a pair of kittens from this all-male litter of seven on the spot. I'm afraid I was the spolier and had to put up with a lot of dramatic sighing on the journey home. The kittens were delightful, alert, playful, happy to be handled, gorgeous, with Oci characteristics such as the spotted tummies and Aby characteristics such as a reddish glow to their coloring. However, they do not have papers (not that I doubt their provenance for one minute and the lower price fairly reflects this) and I can't help feeling that if we want "purebred" cats why go for the first kittens we see when they are a hybrid?

We may make a two hour journey down the coast on Sunday to see a brand-new litter of Abyssinians whose breeder seems very distinguished and experienced. Mindful of the warnings here about the boisterous nature of the breed, however, I find myself a little concerned about what it's going to take to proof my house against exceptionally lively, escape-minded cats. We live in a very "indoor-outdoor" California mid-century modern house which has never needed air conditioning just because every area has access to outdoor decks via french windows. Don't get me wrong, catproofing to DEFCON 5 can, and probably will, be done but there are aesthetic challenges and we are going to have to be very vigilant; one slip-up by the children (or housekeeper who comes once a week) and it's bye-bye Abys. I am not, however, allowing this consideration to put me off getting one of the livelier breeds.

A breeder closer to home has a litter of Ocis which I'm hoping to visit as soon as she calls me back. Jenny and I were struck by the lithe beauty of the Oci mother of the Abi-Oci kittens we visited over the weekend and this breed has always been high on my list.

Hedging my bets just a little, again in response to the sage advice offered here, I also have calls and emails in to breeders of more placid cats: Burmese and Russian Blues. Again, I'm waiting to hear back.

After nearly twenty years of grooming a pair of Persians several times a week my wife has rebelled against a long-haired breed, hence the less than likely prospect of acquiring Ragdolls. I appreciate the enthusiastic advocacy here, however, and I promise all this thread's Ragdoll-lovers that, if she wavers, I'll jump into the breach with all the compelling arguments in favor of this lovely breed.

I hope these folks call back today.

siggav · Jun 25, 2007

Bahger, I just want to say it's so much fun reading through this thread and seeing how the kitten search is going. I'm quite set with my bengal girl, she really doesn't like other cats so I'm not adding to my household for quite a while which means I'm now living vicariously through you

You're a strong man being able to not go for the very first kittens you see. The kittens you end up with are very lucky to be going to live with you and your family.

I can't help you with the cat proofing though. I live in Scotland however so being forced to have my windows closed is not really a problem.

hopehacker · Jun 25, 2007

I would think any breed of cat, even a sedate Persian will try to get outside, if there aren't screens on your windows. So, I would feel that as long as you have screens on your windows you should be safe with an Aby. I LOVE Aby's myself. I think they're SO beautiful. I don't have A/C either, and I open my screened windows and none of my cats have been able to get out, nor have they tried. They do love to lay in the windows though, and look out and enjoy the sunshine and the birds.

familytimerags · Jun 25, 2007

Originally Posted by Bahger

As always, thanks everyone for your interest, everyone.

I thought you may be amused by the latest developments so here they are:

We went to see a litter of Aby-Ocis yesterday and I found myself battling emotional blackmail not just from my children but from my otherwise level-headed wife, too; they all wanted to commit to a pair of kittens from this all-male litter of seven on the spot. I'm afraid I was the spolier and had to put up with a lot of dramatic sighing on the journey home. The kittens were delightful, alert, playful, happy to be handled, gorgeous, with Oci characteristics such as the spotted tummies and Aby characteristics such as a reddish glow to their coloring. However, they do not have papers (not that I doubt their provenance for one minute and the lower price fairly reflects this) and I can't help feeling that if we want "purebred" cats why go for the first kittens we see when they are a hybrid?

We may make a two hour journey down the coast on Sunday to see a brand-new litter of Abyssinians whose breeder seems very distinguished and experienced. Mindful of the warnings here about the boisterous nature of the breed, however, I find myself a little concerned about what it's going to take to proof my house against exceptionally lively, escape-minded cats. We live in a very "indoor-outdoor" California mid-century modern house which has never needed air conditioning just because every area has access to outdoor decks via french windows. Don't get me wrong, catproofing to DEFCON 5 can, and probably will, be done but there are aesthetic challenges and we are going to have to be very vigilant; one slip-up by the children (or housekeeper who comes once a week) and it's bye-bye Abys. I am not, however, allowing this consideration to put me off getting one of the livelier breeds.

A breeder closer to home has a litter of Ocis which I'm hoping to visit as soon as she calls me back. Jenny and I were struck by the lithe beauty of the Oci mother of the Abi-Oci kittens we visited over the weekend and this breed has always been high on my list.

Hedging my bets just a little, again in response to the sage advice offered here, I also have calls and emails in to breeders of more placid cats: Burmese and Russian Blues. Again, I'm waiting to hear back.

After nearly twenty years of grooming a pair of Persians several times a week my wife has rebelled against a long-haired breed, hence the less than likely prospect of acquiring Ragdolls. I appreciate the enthusiastic advocacy here, however, and I promise all this thread's Ragdoll-lovers that, if she wavers, I'll jump into the breach with all the compelling arguments in favor of this lovely breed.

I hope these folks call back today.

I think your wife sounds as if she has her mind set on a shorter coated cat, and I have to be the negative one in the bunch, I am not sure a Ragdoll is the right cat. It is a medium to longhair cat, it fur doesn't typically matt, but there are the exceptions, and they do like being groomed as well. You are also going to still have the seasonal shed, that I am sure you are already familiar with, with your persians, so while I love Ragdolls, and love the enthusiasm of the Ragdoll fans on here, I think this family would be most happy with a shorter coated kitten. Keep us updated, we are enjoying reading updates as you get closer to adopting your newest addition into your family.

bahger · Jun 25, 2007

@ Siggav, I'm a British expat, so I do understand the reason not to fling open your windows in Scotland as one does in SoCal!

Ocis! A breeder has two or three kittens aged about twelve weeks and wants to bring them to my house, obviously to evaluate their potential living conditions.

These Ocis are gorgeous, chocolate silver, like miniature snow leopards. She's not sure if she wants to sell one of them, who is a show-quality male, but she may be persuaded, she says. I told her I would favor the lighter background colors as it accentuates the spots, and that I would only get spotted Ocis as opposed to, what do you call them, tabbies? Anyway, she only breeds the spotted cat.

If all goes well, we may find ourselves owning two new kittens a little earlier than I had expected. I have to cat-proof my house quickly, i.e. proof it against escape routes. I don't really like flimsy, squeaky screen doors everywhere; is anyone aware of a better solution? I think I'm going to investigate making custom screens that can be inserted into a doorway and secured by small rotating clamps, enabling us to put them away entirely when the doors do not need to be open to the world. What do you think? Also, I have to look into some interior system of interlocking, sturdy, standalone mesh screens that I can use for a week or two to cordon off the new kittens so that our old Persian can look at them without feeling that her territory has been completely invaded. Might anyone have any ideas about that? I hate to sound precious but the house is a modern architectural and I just can't be installing screen doors everywhere. Rest assured, though, that the house will be both a lovely and escape-proof home for these felines.

goldenkitty45 · Jun 25, 2007

I'm glad you are checking out more then one breed before making a decision. Ocicats are wonderful (I want another

) but wanted to let you know that the aby-oci's ARE considered Ocicats - they would be pet only - cannot be shown and still are purebred. That is why they are lower price.

When breeding Oci's you can get one of four "types" (spotted are the only ones that can be shown and are the most popular). Because of the influence of the abys, siamese, and american sh cats - the ocicats can look like all of them - (1) ticked coat like the abys, (2) classic tabby pattern like the ASH's (3) ghost ocicats - are more pointed with blue eyes from the siamese ancestors and, of course, the beautiful spotted pattern.

So don't be put off on the different patterned ocicats or think they are not purebred - they are. Abys are allowed as an outcross till 2010 - after that only ocicat to ocicat will be allowed.

This is the breeder I got my Ocicat from - if you go in Gallery (pictures) you will see Charlie's 1/2 brother - Stradivarious and Charlie's father - Albus Dumbledore

http://dotdotdotocicats.com/

BTW which breeder are you getting your cats from?

bahger · Jun 26, 2007

@ Goldenkitty45, that's an impressive breeder page. Pity for me they're so far away!

The breeder I'm talking to is Jeannie Dolan in Santa Monica, CA. Below are links to her listing in the CFA directory and her web site. She's bringing three Oci kittens to the house tomorrow afternoon. They are ready to go so I guess we need to see if we and the children like the kittens and vice versa and she needs to see if she approves of the living environment here.

http://secure.cfa.org/ViewCBRSListing.aspx?id=231

http://www.tassajara-ocicats.com/

I'm going to need to spend much of today figuring out custom screens for french doors.

familytimerags · Jun 26, 2007

Originally Posted by Bahger

@ Goldenkitty45, that's an impressive breeder page. Pity for me they're so far away!

The breeder I'm talking to is Jeannie Dolan in Santa Monica, CA. Below are links to her listing in the CFA directory and her web site. She's bringing three Oci kittens to the house tomorrow afternoon. They are ready to go so I guess we need to see if we and the children like the kittens and vice versa and she needs to see if she approves of the living environment here.

http://secure.cfa.org/ViewCBRSListing.aspx?id=231

http://www.tassajara-ocicats.com/

I'm going to need to spend much of today figuring out custom screens for french doors.

Hopefully GK knows this breeder and can comment, but wanted to wish you the best, I am excited to hear about another Oci. The group with Oci's growing!!! Okay, Charlie and Demetrius are both chocolate right? What color are these Oci kittens? I am excited for you, keep us posted.

kluchetta · Jun 26, 2007

Originally Posted by Bahger

... Also, I have to look into some interior system of interlocking, sturdy, standalone mesh screens that I can use for a week or two to cordon off the new kittens so that our old Persian can look at them without feeling that her territory has been completely invaded. Might anyone have any ideas about that? I hate to sound precious but the house is a modern architectural and I just can't be installing screen doors everywhere. Rest assured, though, that the house will be both a lovely and escape-proof home for these felines.

Have you thought about baby gates to keep them in one particular room?

familytimerags · Jun 26, 2007

Originally Posted by kluchetta

Have you thought about baby gates to keep them in one particular room?

Baby gates are wonderful for dogs, and training and such, but with a determined kitten or cat, they jump or scale it within seconds. Although I have had a determined outside whole male, (we TNR), but we had our windows open in our sons room to have some fresh air, and the cat had almost tore himself inside, so a determined cat, with sharp claws can go through a screen with enough time and effort.
To allow the Persian a space to herself/hisself, I would get a special kitty door, in a master closet or large bathroom, with a special collar that allows only that cat or kitten to open the kitty door, to allow the persian time on her own with a place to escape the fn 2 kittens can have.

bahger · Jun 26, 2007

@ FamilytimeRags: I believe she's bringing a pair of twelve week-old chocolate silver kittens but she's tempted to hold the male for showing. Because she knows we want a pair, therefore, she's also going to bring another litter-mate (or possibly a younger kitten from another litter), not sure about the color. I told her that I think I prefer the lighter background colors.

@ Kluchetta: It would be great if I could find baby gates cleverly enough designed to be adaptable to different widths, high enough that the cats could not leap over them and made of a fine enough mesh that a kitten could not crawl through the gaps. I think I will research this -- among all the other possibilities -- today.

kluchetta · Jun 26, 2007

Originally Posted by Bahger

@ FamilytimeRags: I believe she's bringing a pair of twelve week-old chocolate silver kittens but she's tempted to hold the male for showing. Because she knows we want a pair, therefore, she's also going to bring another litter-mate (or possibly a younger kitten from another litter), not sure about the color. I told her that I think I prefer the lighter background colors.

@ Kluchetta: It would be great if I could find baby gates cleverly enough designed to be adaptable to different widths, high enough that the cats could not leap over them and made of a fine enough mesh that a kitten could not crawl through the gaps. I think I will research this -- among all the other possibilities -- today.

I have heard about using 2 baby gates stacked on top of one another. There are also enclosures that you can buy for "outside" like little corral fences

and those might work because they are actually made for cats.

Stormi

goldenkitty45 · Jun 26, 2007

That was one of the breeders I did check out when I was looking - but they were too far from us (in Minnesota) and at the time we were looking for a retired chocolate spotted male (which the breeder didn't have).

If Charlie's breeder does not have a chocolate-silver when we are ready for another Oci, I may consider this breeder as she specializes more in the silvers and I do like her cats. Not sure if we will get a altered show male or just as a pet, but we only want males - not females

So yes, you should be getting a very nice pair of kittens from her - let me know how you like them, etc. if you this are the kittens you choose

FTR - Charlie's a chocolate spotted, Demetri is a chocolate-silver and Sadie is a chocolate spotted but more of the "hot" chocolate color (reddish)

bahger · Jun 26, 2007

Originally Posted by GoldenKitty45

That was one of the breeders I did check out when I was looking - but they were too far from us (in Minnesota) and at the time we were looking for a retired chocolate spotted male (which the breeder didn't have).

If Charlie's breeder does not have a chocolate-silver when we are ready for another Oci, I may consider this breeder as she specializes more in the silvers and I do like her cats. Not sure if we will get a altered show male or just as a pet, but we only want males - not females

So yes, you should be getting a very nice pair of kittens from her - let me know how you like them, etc. if you this are the kittens you choose

I will post all details right here!

Can you explain your preference for males? Two males might be an option for me. Our Persians were a male/female pair and it was interesting to note the differences.

catsarebetter · Jun 26, 2007

Overall, you might just consider getting a large crate to put them in for the time being if you want to segregate them. It might be easier, since you won't have to build it, and might be cheaper in the long run.

In all honesty, gradual integration does not work in my house.. but then I have a bunch of goofy cats. I know it's the way you're *supposed* to do it, but.. try telling that to my crew. But in any case, I think just using a crate might be easier, and I think they do sell the double tiered, larger ones for cats.. they're nicer than the metal dog crates.

goldenkitty45 · Jun 26, 2007

We like the male's personality better. I've had both pedigree and non-pedigree cats (both sexes). In my experience the males are more outgoing, friendlier, and overall more loving then any of the females I've had. The females tend to be more reserve and have an attitude of "I'll sit on your lap when I choose - not when you want me too".

Plus all my males have accepted new cats much quicker then the females. We've had Charlie since end of December and Ling still doesn't totally accept him.

With Ocicats - your baby gate won't stop them from long. They are VERY active cats and can jump higher then you think! I'd confine the kittens to one or two rooms at first with a solid door. Then supervise them a little at a time with free roaming. Charlie was friends with the dog in a few days - wanted to be friends with Ling too, but she didn't like him and it was on her terms (about 2 weeks later) that she didn't hiss at him when meeting face-to-face.

bahger · Jun 26, 2007

Yes, in my experience, neutered males are often sweeter by temperament.

I'm hoping not to have to use a crate. I have a little library that can be cordoned off from the living room with sliding wooden doors but I'm going to try and place a less solid barrier there so the cats can at least look at each other. The idea is that Chelsea will still have the run of her territory downstairs and the kittens will have access to the downstairs library and the downstairs hallway (sealed off from the living room). Of course, the children will screw it all up and it will be chaos. But I'm determined to try.

goldenkitty45 · Jun 26, 2007

A few tricks:

Try sprinkling some cornstarch (NOT talc) baby powder on all the animals in the house (new and old) so they smell the same to each other.

or

Put a dab of vanilla extract on their noses and butt so they kinda smell the same.

Expect hissing and swatting but Oci's are pretty outgoing, take charge cats and usually don't back down from something new

Oh and make sure ALL nails are clipped on all the cats before they meet.

bahger · Jun 26, 2007

Wonderful advice, thank you!

I'm ordering four four foot-high Japanese-style wood and ricepaper folding divider screens so I can cordon off parts of the house and the cats will still be able to be aware of each other and the human occupants. I hate the thought of having them completely sealed off. I realise that the fully grown cats will be able to jump four feet but by then I will hopefully have a more permanent design solution in place, i.e. modular mesh screens that will be essentially transparent, lightweight, cat-proof and portable, some freestanding, others secured in open doorways/windows with spring bolts. Wish me luck.

Looking for 2 purebred kittens: Help with breed selection, please

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