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kitten colour question!

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 

Just a quick question. One of my 2 day old British shorthair babies is confusing me. She (i think) is a black but she looks more dark chocolate to me. I am told she can't be a chocolate from the mating, and when i have looked at the genetics, that seems right (theres no choc on the mums side at all). But, she looks dark brown and she has a very pinky nose and pads. Will she go darker? I am not experienced with newborn kittens so not sure how much their colour changes? I will try get some more photos, this one isn't great but have a look!

post #2 of 18
S/he looks black to me. IMO and remember I'm only a one color breeder!!!

We had a litter of two chocolates/browns and two blacks and trust me you can see the difference!
post #3 of 18
Thread Starter 
thanks, yeah she should be a black. Just in some lights looks very brown, especially round the face. i'll see how she develops i guess!! I just know sometimes u get BSH chocolates that are more like dark choc than milk choc if you know what i mean! You think she'll go darker and the pads will change? Thanks for your help!
post #4 of 18
What colours are the parents and grand parents? And, her paw pads don't look THAT pink to me!
post #5 of 18
Thread Starter 
Parents are tortie (mum) and lilac (dad). he's got choc and lilac all the way back, but she has none. Her pedigree is mostly blues and blacks. I am pretty positive the baby must be a black because of this, but as i said i am quite new to it all, so wanted to be sure! No, i guess her pads aren't that pink!
post #6 of 18
Here's a good site that may help you and it's tailored for BSH's too
post #7 of 18
Thread Starter 
Thanks, i'll have a look! I used the breeders assistant program a while back and it predicted blues, blacks, tortie, blue-cream, red or cream. i have all of those apart form cream, and choc didn't show up there so i guess i have answered that myself?! I was just curious as she didn't look that black!
post #8 of 18
I'd go with black right now - I've seen "off color" blacks and with the lilac father, you may have some off color.

But don't discount the mom NOT carrying chocolate! If you can, trace the background at least 10-12 generations for color.

Friend of mine had a chocolate (really was true chocolate) from a tortie/black mating. She had to go back 8 or 9 generations to find out that there was a chocolate rex on both sides. Took that long for the recessive genes to connect. Once you put a recessive gene in there, it stays forever.

On paper CFA questioned the color as they only had 4 generations to look at; so my friend had to expand the color genetics to prove otherwise
post #9 of 18
Thread Starter 
Ah ok, yeah i am only going back by the generations i can see on the pedigree but if she does look chocolately i'll do a bit more digging and go back a bit further. You are right she could just be a bit of an off-black. Its not the end of the world as this lot are planned to be sold to pet homes, rather than showing and definitely not breeding at this stage.

Also, as i am new to little tiny kittens, the sexing thing is throwing me slighty. The only one i can def say is a boy is the red tabby. Oh yeah on the subject of him i have been told i would have to register him as a red rather than a red tabby, even if his stripes stay, as GCCF won't register a tabby from self matings?! I don't understand that, he looks very stripey although i guess they may well fade a bit then. If you do understand why they say that please explain! Obviously i am assuming the tortie and the blue-cream are girls, and the others all kinda look similar to them down there! When is the best age to tell for sure?

Also, just wondered is it normal to get a little bleeding from the mum two days after birth? Just a drop on the vet bed this evening so was a bit concerned.
post #10 of 18
True - if mom is a tortie and not a patched tabby (do you have a picture?) then any red kittens will be self red and not red tabby. Almost every red/red tabby will have stripes. Some fade out, some don't. Even on creams you have stripes.

I had one rex litter (tortie x red tabby) that had a red classic tabby, red mackeral tabby and a solid red! The solid red was solid as it had very faint markings, so it had to be one of the few true solid reds
post #11 of 18
Thread Starter 
Yes she's definitely tortie. Yeah my cream BSH was stripey, they did fade but never went completely could just make them out underneath if looked hard. He wasn't show quality really.

Here is a pic of mum and also of red boy

post #12 of 18
What color are her parents? And the dad's? You can have a "tabby" in there that gives the markings. But on paper, you'd have to put self red.

Almost all pedigrees list red as red tabby, so there is no way to really tell if its a red tabby or not. Especially when you have a tortie. Most are produced by a tortie x black (or red tabby) male, or black female x red tabby male. And the result is a tortie - not a patched tabby and will produce more red tabbies....this probably is confusing you more.

With my rexes (tortie mom) she always had at least one red tabby - and I registered it as red tabby - even if the father was black/white. None of the associations questioned me (CFA or ACFA) who knows.
post #13 of 18
This little guy of mine looked Chocolate from the day he was born. It was a deep Chocolate, I thought. Well, he turned out to be black, as you can see below. Sounds a lot like what you have with the color above. Even the nose and pads were similar to what you are describing.
post #14 of 18
Thread Starter 
Yep thanks for that, i agree she may well turn out black! Goldenkitty - her parents are Blue-cream (mum) and Black (dad) and his parents are Black (mum) and Lilac (dad). I don't think there any tabbys in either pedigree so i guess hes a self red then and maybe the stripes will fade at least to some extent.
post #15 of 18
They may, but red tabbys usually don't fade very much. The cream tabbys have a better chance of fading so it looks more solid.
post #16 of 18
Thread Starter 
Oh well, so will he just be a 'poor' self red. As I said he'll be a pet so its not the end of the world really - he is quite stripey!!

My black still doesn't look black yet, so we'll have to wait and see on that one!!
post #17 of 18
Your black won't change till he gets more coat - a few months - don't worry about it
post #18 of 18
Thread Starter 
Ok, great! Well they are gorgeous anyway, i can't stop looking at them!!
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