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Illegal immigrants in US - Page 6

post #151 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
Most of Mexico isn't poor, and most of the people from the other parts of Mexico aren't trying to come here or come here legally (Spanish teachers, businessmen, etc).

But the areas near the border and in other parts, such as ones that are mostly indigenous peoples, are third-world. How are you gonna say somebody whose roof is made out of a cardboard box, and that roof covers the house of eight people who don't all fit inside at the same time, aren't poor?

I agree, the US should be taking care of people in America before going of spending trillions to invade other countries to find people to "help".
I totally agree with you there Z. If I were living in squalor and the "land of milk and honey" was a stone's throw away, I would be coming here too.
I don't think anyone could say, being put in that position, they would do anything different. That is what makes the entire situation so tough.
post #152 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckblv View Post
I totally agree with you there Z. If I were living in squalor and the "land of milk and honey" was a stone's throw away, I would be coming here too.
I don't think anyone could say, being put in that position, they would do anything different. That is what makes the entire situation so tough.
I know I couldn't! You're right, too often people refuse to think of the immigrants as people, like there is no possibility any of us could *gasp* ever be in that situation, so we don't have to understand the desperation or need, just that they take up a couple extra tax dollars (somebody posted welfare percentages earlier, it's nothing) and we think it's unfair.
post #153 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
I know I couldn't! You're right, too often people refuse to think of the immigrants as people, like there is no possibility any of us could *gasp* ever be in that situation, so we don't have to understand the desperation or need, just that they take up a couple extra tax dollars (somebody posted welfare percentages earlier, it's nothing) and we think it's unfair.
"A couple" extra tax dollars???? They are my hard earned tax dollars and I begrudge giving them to illegal innigrants OR lazy legal citizens. They are not entitled to MY tax dollars. kittymonsters is right IMO, hard-working law-abiding jegal citizen ARE entitled to social benefits in their times of need (i.e. job loss, medical issues.) And if those welfare percentages are "nothing" feel free to subsidize them yourself and relieve me and others from the burden.

Anyone who has the time might enjoy this read: http://www.usillegalaliens.com/

There is a TON of information there, WITH sources. Not just babble from talking heads on TV or liberal newspapers who want us to feel sorry for the ILLEGALS.

I feel bad for the people waiting on legal immigration means to allow them to become citizens. 12 million LAWBREAKERS are about to leapfrog over them unless the people of this country SPEAK OUT. And an internet forum is not the way to do that. CONTACT YOUR REPRESENTATIVES!
post #154 of 165
http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html

The net deficit caused by illegal immigrants is 10.4 billion. I don't know how many trillions of dollars in taxes were paid this year, but that's not a big percentage. We spend more than that on single pork barrel projects that don't help anybody all the time. So, sure, if you really begrudge them the few dollars of your taxes that fed a child or helped someone get stitches at the hospital, I'd be glad to pay yours for you.
post #155 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html

The net deficit caused by illegal immigrants is 10.4 billion. I don't know how many trillions of dollars in taxes were paid this year, but that's not a big percentage. We spend more than that on single pork barrel projects that don't help anybody all the time. So, sure, if you really begrudge them the few dollars of your taxes that fed a child or helped someone get stitches at the hospital, I'd be glad to pay yours for you.
Sure, just send me your info so I can have them deduct my payroll taxes from your account. And when you get about 45 years older, you can thank yourself that you have NOTHING to show for the tens of thousands of dollars you have paid in Social Security taxes, not to mention the local and state taxes that were deducted AUTOMATICALLY from you. When you or someone you love is injured and needs Medicaid or SSI and can't get it, don't come to me whining about "there's no money and I paid in all those years." Cause that's where this is headed. There is NOT ENOUGH money to keep up ILLEGALS.

I think you are pretty young, so I am chalking up your willingness to "help save the ILLEGALS" to the fact that you have never been personally damaged by them. I have been. I lost my pregnant 18 year old daughter, unborn grandson and my son-in-law to illegal Mexican drunk drivers almost 5 years ago. Drunk ILLEGALS that didn't have the moral decency to check on them and RAN into the woods to hide because they were ILLEGALS that already had FELONY arrest warrants on them. Soon as they get out of prison in Georgia in like 39 years, I'll send them your way. You can take care of them with what you have left from your Social Security check.
post #156 of 165
I came to terms long ago with the fact that I'm going to pay thousands and thousands into Social Security and never get a cent of it back. The AARP is the strongest lobby in Washington and has made sure that a lot of completely unsustainable fiscal policies have continued. But that has nothing to do with illegal immigrants, who aren't going to get SS.

I'm very very sorry for what happened to your family, but the fact that hit-and-run coward criminals happened to be illegal has nothing to do with the other millions of illegal immigrants.
post #157 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
I came to terms long ago with the fact that I'm going to pay thousands and thousands into Social Security and never get a cent of it back. The AARP is the strongest lobby in Washington and has made sure that a lot of completely unsustainable fiscal policies have continued. But that has nothing to do with illegal immigrants, who aren't going to get SS.

I'm very very sorry for what happened to your family, but the fact that hit-and-run coward criminals happened to be illegal has nothing to do with the other millions of illegal immigrants.
And where do you think the money for all those programs comes from???? There's not some FUND THE ILLEGALS block on my paycheck, is there on yours? It comes from borrowing against Social Security, just like all the other Federal programs do.

And yes what happened has EVERYTHING to do with ILLEGALS. They are ILLEGALS. What do you not get about that? I L L E G A L S. ILLEGALS. Brandi and others who live in the state of Georgia should be that they are having to keep up the two ILLEGALS in prison for their 44 year sentence.

And the statistics about ILLEGALS committing a disportionate amount of crimes compared to their population percentages do not lie.
post #158 of 165
I didn't mean to upset you, and again I am very sorry, and your anger is understandable. It's just that those people would be awful no matter where they were, and the fact that they are illegal immigrants doesn't reflect on the rest of the population of illegal immigrants.

Any group of people who is disproportionately poor has a high crime rate, it's a function of poverty and socioeconomics, not of race or citizenship.
post #159 of 165
Did you bother to read the link I posted earlier? This page alone http://www.usillegalaliens.com/immig..._addendum.html with its footnotes stating the sources, should be credible enough to show anyone with any common sense the true gravity of the issues with illegal immigration.

I would think that statistics would make an impression with a college educated person like yourself. Myself, and a number of others here, apparently prefer to make our choices based on real life experiences. Those of us who are opposed to ILLEGALS have made our points against them quite often here. That they are our real life experiences doesn't make them any less legitimate than your statistics that you like to quote.

Your professors should be pleased with you at least. You seem to have remembered a lot of the theories they taught you in class. Too bad they are just that, theories.
post #160 of 165
Let's not let things get too heated here. Sometimes you just have to agree to disagree.

One thing that really hasn't been mentioned here is agricultural subsidies, and how those paid by the U.S. and E.U. governments, along with crop surpluses given as food relief, but mysteriously showing up at dumping prices at Third World markets, often ruin the livelihoods of farmers in developing nations, forcing them to emigrate in order to survive.

Is switching to biofuel going to cause corn prices to increase so much, e.g. in Mexico, that even more people will be desperate to cross the border?

Just beefing up border security and revising immigration laws isn't going to stop the flow of illegal immigrants. Governments have to pay more attention to fair trade, and how their agricultural and energy policies affect developing nations, if they want to reduce the pressure of illegal immigration.
post #161 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
Have been to all of the places you mentioned. It's not the same at all.

Really??? American citizens living in leaking buildings with no running water,no health care, no transportation, little to no food, un-immunized in competely unsanitary conditions is not the same? Why, because they are American poor and not Mexican poor? Just what reservations did you go to? To say there is nothing in this country to equal the poorest and most destitute of Mexico is not facing reality.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Zissou'sMom View Post
"entitled to" just because we're born north of an imaginary line? I'm not saying we should just open the border up either, but the idea that I am somehow entitled to something because I was born here instead of there doesn't sit well with me. I don't believe I'm inherently better or more deserving because I was born in Ohio instead of Chihuahua. I mean, I don't pay many taxes either, I get most of them back except Soc Sec, and there are millions of people who receive the most benefits and contribute the least. I don't think it's a matter of paying into the system that makes you deserving of help either.
Actually yes. Entitled to becauses we are American Citizens. I don't get the benefits of French, British, Greek , Canandian or Mexican Citizens, why should illegel aliens get my benefits?

I am sure the Canandian provinces and their citizens woud love your logic here. Maybe the US should send all our uninsured to Canada because Cananda has national health insurance. I am sure the Canandians wouldn't mind paying for all of them.

Being entilted to something because you work hard and earn it, as a citizen of whatever nation, does not equate to saying those people are inherently better than anyone. You made that response to me based on your quotes, where did I say such a thing? In fact I don't recall anyone in this entire thread saying that they or Americans in general are better than any other nationality. What is being said is that we do not want to pay for the Citizens of other countries that enter the US ILLEGALLY.

Of course persons who have less want more. I would love to have what Bill Gates or Donald Trump has, but that is not my lot in life. If I just went and took it, I would be a thief, yes a CRIMINAL, and I would go to jail for my crime.

Why are illegal aliens allowed to break the law? Why are allowed to come here and steal what belongs to the citizens of this country. Going to public school in this country illegally is stealing from our citizens. Why are we supposed to feel sorry for them and say....oh thats ok?

If Everyone were allowed to break law as they felt best fitted their own personal needs and wants we would have Anarchy! No one, and I repeat NO ONE should be allowed to be above the law.

Lucky you that you don't pay much taxes. I pay a boatload, which I don't mind as long as they go to help keep this Nation, healthy, well fed, safe and secure...FIRST!

LEGAL immigrants I will give a helping hand to any time. Legal Permanent Residents also. BUT I refuse to have to support criminals of any sort and I should not have too.
post #162 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcat View Post
Let's not let things get too heated here. Sometimes you just have to agree to disagree.
In light of that, I'm done here. I don't do personal attacks.
post #163 of 165
Right now, we all have a way to actually do something about this. Write to your Congressional Representatives. Let them know how you, as their boss (constituent) feel about this issue. There is a lot of junk in that bill, IMO, that goes way, way beyond what we're being told in the news, but the problem is that the news isn't covering what this bill contains. I realize that it's over 1000 pages, and that isn't even counting whatever amendments they have or will tack on. It's up to US as their electors to let them know how we expect them to vote on this VERY important issue. It rather saddened me that when I started a thread about the legislation, there were only maybe 3-4 replies. While this thread goes on for hundreds of posts. The passion and interest in the topic are here, so why no interest in the actual legislation they are trying to pass about this issue?

Regardless of where you stand on this issue, it seems to me that this bill isn't measuring up to any person's standards on this board. We need to remind the people in Washington just who they do work for. And we need to tell them what we think.
post #164 of 165
I read through the first seven pages of this thread. This is a very delecate subject obviously. I have to say in all honesty that I am not racist, nor do I lack compassion for humanity. However, I believe that the poor people of America should be helped before anyone else. It is just plain common sense.

Where I am living we are just loaded with immigrants. What I have seen personally is that the spanish speaking population is being catered to. There are signs and written material in English and Spanish. The Africans and Asians and others do not have their language included. I'm sure they find that insulting and resent the fact. These immigrants all speak English when they feel like it. Seems to me it is the language that ties us all together.

Someone had made a comment about people only knowing one language as being ignorant or something to that effect. Perhaps it easy for some people to learn another language, but for some of us it is not. Are we to learn every language of every immigrant that comes here? I think not. I do not wish to offend anyone here with my comments, that is not my intention.

I have seen so many places change drastically. Storefronts, restaurants etc all in Spanish with very little English. No matter where you go all you hear is spanish. I feel as though I'm the one who left my country.
post #165 of 165
Quote:
Originally Posted by valanhb View Post
Regardless of where you stand on this issue, it seems to me that this bill isn't measuring up to any person's standards on this board. We need to remind the people in Washington just who they do work for. And we need to tell them what we think.
I definitely agree with you there.


And to brush on the topic of languages and signs being in Spanish.. which wasn't what valanhb posted about..

The reason why Spanish is being considered the second language for the USA is because not only is it the second most largely spoken language in the USA as well as in the world (partially because immigrants or non-English speaking and non-native Spanish speakers often learn multiple languages and Spanish is quite often one of them)...

Chinese is the language spoken most across the world, but it doesn't make a whole lot of sense that Chinese be the top language of the USA, since our citizens usually don't speak it natively, it's generally not taught at high school level and is not usually the second language learned in the US.

It only makes sense if the USA is going to pick a second language, it should pick the second most commonly spoken language.
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