Plan Z

jpawz

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Plan Z: As grain - free as we can be

A) Avoid wheat glutens
B) Avoid rice protein concentrates
C) Avoid questionable grains & as many fillers as we can

What else do we know for sure at this point? Let's compile/add.

I may be gambling but I think whole rice and (most 'wholes') are 'good'. As it's been stated various places, when processing begins, who knows what results. So for those worried about the latest rice issues, focus on more 'whole' if at all.

Let's regroup. Who is making *more* new changes? Anyone sticking with their current kitty plan?

Innova question: There is both an adult cat formula and a kitten/cat formula? Is there a preference as to which to feed adult cats?

I am transitioning my cats to more premium foods, as many of us are, and going through a few tummy rumbles along the way, with a healthy dose of cat pickiness/stubbornness.

Innova will be brand new for us.
Chicken Soup has been excellent (and no wheat/rice issues).
Merrick has also been good.
Natural Balance Ultra Dry has had mixed reviews
Natural Balance wet (havent' tried v&p) has had mixed reviews (comments on the wet v&p??)

Now, to paraphrase Beandip ( I think it was) we all have to determine what is 'safe' for us and what is 'best' for our unique set of cat households. She also made a good point that it's more the *ingredients* we must pay attention to; it's not soley about the manufacturer. And to paraphrase myself, any and all new changes we make, even gradual, may become issues themselves, as our cats may only become more confused/stubborn, with possible gastric rebellions.

Sharky--Your food information/detail has been *awesome*. Thank you.

So,
!!
 

gingersmom

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I'm now feeding Nature's Variety Raw Instinct for dry. It has no grain whatsoever, and my babies like it and are doing quite well.
 
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jpawz

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Originally Posted by GingersMom

I'm now feeding Nature's Variety Raw Instinct for dry. It has no grain whatsoever, and my babies like it and are doing quite well.
Oh, thanks for that; I just ordered NV. I previously had stated that I wasnt' going to do any online ordering until I got to a feed store this weekend, but I am not waiting. This last recall, though voluntary, is expanding, probably more as we speak
 

wmarcello

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In your opinion, should I be worried about any of the ingredients in Felidae?

Cat + Kitten Formula:
Chicken Meal, Turkey Meal, Brown Rice, Lamb Meal, Chicken Fat, (Preserved with mixed Tocopherols), Herring Meal, Eggs, Flax Seed Meal, Sun Cured Alfalfa Meal, Sunflower Oil, Chicken, Lecithin, Linoleic Acid, Amaranth, DL Methionine, Taurine, Kelp, Cranberries, Apples, Monocalcium Phosphate, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, Rosemary Extract, Sage Extract, Dried Enterococcus Faecium, Dried Lactobacillus Acidophilus Fermentation Product, Dried Aspergillus Oryzae Fermentation Extract, Dried Bacillus Subtilis Fermentation Extract, Inulin (from Chicory Root), Dried Saccharomyces Cerevisiae Fermentation Solubles, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Mixed Tocopherols (source of Vitamin E), Zinc Amino Acid Chelate, Manganese Amino Acid Chelate, Iron Amino Acid Chelate, Copper Amino Acid Chelate, Cobalt Amino Acid Chelate, Vitamin A supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Ascorbic Acid (source of Vitamin C), Niacin, Thiamin Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Riboflavin (source of B2), Beta Carotene, Calcium Pantothenate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Calcium Iodate, Folic Acid, D-Biotin, Sodium Selenite, Papaya, Vitamin B12 Supplement.
 
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jpawz

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Originally Posted by wmarcello

In your opinion, should I be worried about any of the ingredients in Felidae?

Cat + Kitten Formula:
Chicken Meal, Turkey Meal, Brown Rice, Lamb Meal, Chicken Fat, (Preserved with mixed Tocopherols), Herring Meal, Eggs, Flax Seed Meal, Sun Cured Alfalfa Meal, Sunflower Oil, Chicken, Lecithin, Linoleic Acid, Amaranth, DL Methionine, Taurine, Kelp, Cranberries, Apples, Monocalcium Phosphate, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, Rosemary Extract, Sage Extract, Dried Enterococcus Faecium, Dried Lactobacillus Acidophilus Fermentation Product, Dried Aspergillus Oryzae Fermentation Extract, Dried Bacillus Subtilis Fermentation Extract, Inulin (from Chicory Root), Dried Saccharomyces Cerevisiae Fermentation Solubles, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Mixed Tocopherols (source of Vitamin E), Zinc Amino Acid Chelate, Manganese Amino Acid Chelate, Iron Amino Acid Chelate, Copper Amino Acid Chelate, Cobalt Amino Acid Chelate, Vitamin A supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Ascorbic Acid (source of Vitamin C), Niacin, Thiamin Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Riboflavin (source of B2), Beta Carotene, Calcium Pantothenate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Calcium Iodate, Folic Acid, D-Biotin, Sodium Selenite, Papaya, Vitamin B12 Supplement.
I am going to save this one for Sharky. I will say that Felidae, for those who have used it, has been great. I was going to order it too but forgot (dangit) That's a pretty good ingredient list, imo. Brown rice isn't a processed one, afaik? But again, this isn't my strong area.

Hmmm can I bump a post to you, Sharky?!?!?!

Let me just add this link for quick references-- http://www.canidae.com/
 

naturestee

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Brown rice is the least processed rice you can get, as far as I'm aware. White rice is the processed version of brown rice.

If you're looking for few ingredients but quality food, try California Natural. It's made by the same company as Innova and comes in two dry varieties and several wet varieties. Pricewise, it's much less expensive than Innova. It's made with few ingredients for cats with allergy problems or sensitive stomachs, and works well for my cats.

California Natural Chicken and Rice Dry:
Ingredients:
Chicken, Chicken Meal, Ground Brown Rice, Chicken Fat, Sunflower Oil, Flaxseed, Vitamins/Minerals, Taurine

Herring and Sweet Potato Dry:
Ingredients:
Herring, Barley, Oatmeal/Rolled Oats, Herring Meal, Sweet Potatoes, Sunflower Oil, Herring Oil, Natural Flavors, Taurine, DL-Methionine, Choline Chloride, Vitamins/Minerals
 

sharky

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Originally Posted by wmarcello

In your opinion, should I be worried about any of the ingredients in Felidae?

Cat + Kitten Formula:
Chicken Meal, Turkey Meal, Brown Rice, Lamb Meal, Chicken Fat, (Preserved with mixed Tocopherols), Herring Meal, Eggs, Flax Seed Meal, Sun Cured Alfalfa Meal, Sunflower Oil, Chicken, Lecithin, Linoleic Acid, Amaranth, DL MethionineLITTLE HIGH up for me , Taurine, Kelp, Cranberries, Apples, Monocalcium Phosphate, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, Rosemary Extract, Sage Extract, Dried Enterococcus Faecium, Dried Lactobacillus Acidophilus Fermentation Product, Dried Aspergillus Oryzae Fermentation Extract, Dried Bacillus Subtilis Fermentation Extract, Inulin (from Chicory Root), Dried Saccharomyces Cerevisiae Fermentation Solubles, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Mixed Tocopherols (source of Vitamin E), Zinc Amino Acid Chelate, Manganese Amino Acid Chelate, Iron Amino Acid Chelate, Copper Amino Acid Chelate, Cobalt Amino Acid Chelate, Vitamin A supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Ascorbic Acid (source of Vitamin C), Niacin, Thiamin Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Riboflavin (source of B2), Beta Carotene, Calcium Pantothenate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Calcium Iodate, Folic Acid, D-Biotin, Sodium Selenite, Papaya, Vitamin B12 Supplement.
Normally all I would say is not as digestable as things like Cal natural ( org) or Natural choice.... BUt AS my vet reinterated rice is rice , be it br , white , gluten , concetrate,bran or flour... it all orginates as brown or white hence somewhere is contaminated the rest of it ... It has two full grains and two mimics( alfalfa and flax).... Most mimics were kicked out of my house a while back... Now ALL GRAIN has been

Brown rice is like human brown has the Germ or bran intact ... White is more digestable and still nutritious ... I say compare your brown rice to white at home... NON INSTANT of course ... Likely 1 gram of fiber and some b vitamins that are lost in any cooking process will be the differences
 

followedbydolls

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My plan? firstly banging my head on a wall, yeah not in the least productive but at least gives me something else to think about


I got nowhere with the wellness core so i went back to the indoor health which i new they did like because i had tried a sample bag, long before any recalls had began, they seem to be taking to it well..

For now i will mix it in with the DVP UP.. i will NO longer be buying natural balance brands for the cats[or the dogs] i am annoyed, worried and a whole bunch of other emotions with them, my bag said "grain free" the very fact they added, changed ingredients without so much as a "new" label leaves me feeling untrustworthy.

I do need another dry formula, i try not to be only on one brand. I have a sample of a food called performatrin chicken & brown rice it's from my pet valu how good it is i am unsure, but from reading on the site etc..it's sounds ok, but whether anyone will eat it, remains to be seen as i have yet to try it..

website http://www.performatrinultra.com

My wet food options are still undecided.. for now
i am using fancy feast, but i will continue to try other wet brands.. in hopes i can find something they will eat that is not only wheat gluten free but/and better quality.

I am not avoiding all rice, i can't.. firstly my attempts at grain free in the past have failed.. innvoa evo was rejected as well as wellness core, i realize other brands exist but quite frankly they are truly beyond my ability to afford them as a routine/exclusive food, not saying i have totally given up the idea.. i will continue to see if i can find an affordable option that they will eat but it will have to be a secondary food not primary regardless.

I think i just wrote a novel, i'm sorry lol .. i guess i really don't know if i have "a plan"..other than finding a safe food, my purrboxes will do well on, that i can afford and can easily obtain?
 
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jpawz

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Followedbydolls~~

Yeah, I haven't been this harried and nervous in a long while. It's all the uncertainty....if we only could be sure of SOMETHING then this all would be manageable.

I looked at the link--quite a list of ingredients. Looks healthy for sure, but again, I can't specifically comment just because I lack the info.

I said somewhere else that I had to pull out my shelved cans of FF wet. It was the only thing that one of my 'off' cats was willing to eat. Very frustrating.

Yes, about the Innova; I have heard not all cats are going to take to it. But at this point I do have to give it a shot. Ideally I would like to be grain free but I know it's going to be challenging.

PFD is out of stock on some wet brands (Felidae for one)....options are going to be limited and demands skyrocketing.
 

misty8723

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Originally Posted by sharky

Normally all I would say is not as digestable as things like Cal natural ( org) or Natural choice.... BUt AS my vet reinterated rice is rice , be it br , white , gluten , concetrate,bran or flour... it all orginates as brown or white hence somewhere is contaminated the rest of it ... It has two full grains and two mimics( alfalfa and flax).... Most mimics were kicked out of my house a while back... Now ALL GRAIN has been

Brown rice is like human brown has the Germ or bran intact ... White is more digestable and still nutritious ... I say compare your brown rice to white at home... NON INSTANT of course ... Likely 1 gram of fiber and some b vitamins that are lost in any cooking process will be the differences
What kind of dry food is grain free, except Evo, which mine won't eat?
 

sharky

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Raw Instict is the one I like the best

Core

Orijen I like how this reads but avail is an issue
 

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I have a question: Regarding dry food - I thought anything "MEAL" was bad, but I'm probably confused. Like at my food store, the first ingredient of something (Innova?) I just looked at was chicken meal.
so confused.
 

sharky

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Originally Posted by kluchetta

I have a question: Regarding dry food - I thought anything "MEAL" was bad, but I'm probably confused. Like at my food store, the first ingredient of something (Innova?) I just looked at was chicken meal.
so confused.
MEal is concetrated that meat ... think beef vs beef jerky ...

by product meal is concentrated by products...
 

beandip

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Originally Posted by kluchetta

I have a question: Regarding dry food - I thought anything "MEAL" was bad, but I'm probably confused. Like at my food store, the first ingredient of something (Innova?) I just looked at was chicken meal.
so confused.
Look how slow I am. LOL...2 posts down now.


Sharky might need to correct me, but I believe she said that chicken "meal" is chicken WITHOUT the water and fat...so it is actually a more concentrated protein, not a bad thing at all.
 

followedbydolls

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Originally Posted by Jpawz

Followedbydolls~~

Yeah, I haven't been this harried and nervous in a long while. It's all the uncertainty....if we only could be sure of SOMETHING then this all would be manageable.

I looked at the link--quite a list of ingredients. Looks healthy for sure, but again, I can't specifically comment just because I lack the info.

I said somewhere else that I had to pull out my shelved cans of FF wet. It was the only thing that one of my 'off' cats was willing to eat. Very frustrating.

Yes, about the Innova; I have heard not all cats are going to take to it. But at this point I do have to give it a shot. Ideally I would like to be grain free but I know it's going to be challenging.

PFD is out of stock on some wet brands (Felidae for one)....options are going to be limited and demands skyrocketing.
I hope the innova works for you! I never fed these guys FF it was my old cats who spent their lifetime[17 & 19yrs] on it and cat chow
but at this point since i have tried sooo many wet foods, it's either the FF or no wet which is not what i want at all. I did download a cat cookbook and i will give some a try.. but i admit i am no fan of cooking unless it's desert
 

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Meal is good, better than just chicken as a first ingredient. That is because in a food label if chicken is first that means the chicken before the water is removed. Chicken meal is after the water has been taken out. So even though chicken might be the first ingredient on a bad of food, once the water is removed the weight drops so that it should actually be further down on the list and chicken is not the most abundant ingredient any more. If chicken meal is at the top of the list then you know that chicken is the most abundant ingredient in the food.

People say poultry meal and bone meal etc. are bad because they are none specific (what kind of poultry, what animal did the bone come from). That is my understanding of it at least.
 
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jpawz

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Wow. Cat Food Ingredients 101. Crash course!

I give in. I am taking one of my cats to the vets at at 3. I just tried to hand feed him wet and no go. He took some dry by hand but strangely, without chewing. His hind legs are shakey and he can't jump up well. His haws are showing now. No purr, nothing. I am pretty panicked. He showed signs of life yesterday but we are worse now. Probably have to take 2 toddlers with me too. Not ideal.

All other cats are fine and dandy. Cant' be food issues. I am going to *CRACK* if Grayboy was fine, then last week's vet check up actually brought this on. Very possible. Very frustrating. I am shaking mad/upset.
 
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jpawz

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For those whose cats love the Chicken Soup line (http://www.chickensoupforthepetloverssoul.com/)


They updated their home page to state:

"Wheat, wheat gluten or rice protein concentrates is not used in any of our dry, canned or treat products"

While not entirely grain free, it seems a good compromise. Canned ingredients:

Chicken, chicken liver, salmon, turkey, duck, chicken broth, whole grain brown rice, white rice, oatmeal, potatoes, barley, egg product, guar gum, flaxseed meal, kelp, carrots, peas, apples, dried skim milk, cranberry powder, rosemary extract, parsley flake, taurine, dried chicory root, carrageenan gum, vitamin A acetate, vitamin D3 supplement, vitamin E supplement, niacin supplement D-calcium pantothenate, riboflavin supplement, thiamine mononitrate, pyridoxine hydrochloride, vitamin B12 supplement, biotin, folic acid, menadione sodium bisulfite (source of vitamin K), copper sulfate, calcium iodate and sodium selenite


Dry ingredients:

Chicken, chicken meal, cracked pearled barley, chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), ocean fish meal, white rice, potatoes, oatmeal, millet, natural chicken flavor, salmon, turkey, duck, flaxseed, sodium bisulfate, egg product, methionine, potassium chloride, choline chloride, dried chicory root, taurine, kelp, carrots, peas, apples, tomatoes, blueberries, spinach, dried skim milk, cranberry powder, rosemary extract, parsley flake, yucca schidigera extract, L-carnitine, Enterococcus faecium, Lactobacillus casei, Lactobacillus acidophilus, Saccharomyces cerevisiae fermentation solubles, dried Aspergillus oryzae fermentation extract, zinc proteinate, vitamin E supplement, niacin, manganese proteinate, copper proteinate, zinc sulfate, manganese sulfate, copper sulfate, thiamine mononitrate, vitamin A supplement, biotin, potassium iodide, calcium pantothenate, riboflavin, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin B12 supplement, manganous oxide, sodium selenite, vitamin D supplement, folic acid.



Ok off to the vets. I suspect Grayboy is constipated or he picked up an infection from his vet visit 10 days ago. Both fit the timeline and the symptoms. **SIGH**
 
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