delivery help

We are kittening our first litter as a breeder. They are british shorthairs, out of our very beautiful boy who has just ate up the show rings...I say this so no one flames me with 'you shouldn't have'...it was a planned litter, from a responsible mating choice.

It is mom's first litter. The first kitten's sac protruded at about 9:45 p.m. CST, we saw feet about 20 min later, and mom seemed to be making progress. We were right there with her. I didn't want to help if I was going to hurt the kitten. The kitten moved its feet until about 10:30 CST. She delivered to the rib cage, at about 9:55, where it got stuck. I tried to help with KY and sterile gloves, and we slowly made progress. Then, with just the head left, it really got stuck. I tried everything, still trying to be gentle. The kitten was delivered at 10:44 p.m.

My fiance and I tried for over an hour to resuscitate it, but there were no signs of life. He was a lovely solid blue male, and he was 118 g. (almost 4 oz) which I was told is really large.

I tried CPR, I cleared his lungs, I warmed him, but there were no signs of life. Did I do something wrong? Be honest, because I think she still has kittens to come.

Right after delivery, she was panting, like she was going to have a 2nd kitten, but having no abdominal contractions. during the hour of resuscitation, she still panted, then stopped. After cleaning the kitten up, she jumped out of the birthing box and went to eat dinner.

She is very, very pregnant--how do I tell if there are still kittens to come? How long between before I should worry? She seems totally calm, totally relaxed. Should I call the vet?

I have just been bawling for the last 3 hours, doing all of the what-ifs in the world. I guess sometimes things aren't meant to be, and we're doing this professionally, so my fiance says I should get a grip or we shouldn't breed. I told him I just needed time to grieve .

Things just seemed a lot simpler before I was holding a little cold kitten. Any help would be greatly appreciated--even a 'you did what you could' from someone experienced would help. (I already talked to my breed mentor, and she said we did what we could).

Sorry so disjointed, I'm still a little upset. Do you guys 'break the bag' when it is protruding initially? Some say yes, some no (I didn't--should I have?) When just the head is stuck, what do you do?

Sorry this is my first post ever, and thank you to anyone who has any help.

Oh darlin, I'm so sorry! Bless your poor broken heart. I know nothing about birthing kittens, so I can't help with your questions, but oh I'm so sorry. My thoughts and prayers are with you and your kitties tonight.

I was just re-reading your post, and with all due respect to your fiancee... no matter how "professional" you may become as a breeder, I hope you will never become so jaded that the death of a precious little kitten will fail to move you. You have every right to feel the way you do.

How long has it been now??? Can you feel anymore kittens??

Your queen may need an oxytocin jab to get her going again. If she has not delivered her 2nd kitten yet, then I suggest you rush her to the vet immediately!

First litters are tough for any breeder - be they new breeders or experienced ones.

To answer your question re: the 1st kitten.

Personally, I would have helped her deliver if the kitten was stuck there for nor more than 5 minutes. And yes, if the kitten was not breech, I would have broken the bag also.

Do not grieve too much. As a breeder, we must live and learn with our mistakes and move forwards to our dreams of being the ultimate breeder of what ever is our chosen breed.

When you have the time, do go to the breeders' corner, introduce yourself and read my recent experience with a first time queen - the thread is titled Breeder Woes.

Meanwhile, welcome to TCS!

I agree with Abysmom..please do get her to the vet if she hasnt had her other kittens yet. sometimes there is a pause between litters, but with her first litter, and how long the first kitten took and being breech, i wouldhave her checked. Like she said she just may need a little shot to get her going again.

Do not feel bad for grieving. Dont dwell to long with the what iffs...things will happen as a breeder.

In my girls first litters, we lost three, one from each mom..I mourned. but I look atthe postive..we had 12 healthy kittens.

Keep us updated!

please take her to the vet asap , when lilly was birthing it was her first time , she had her first kitten that was still born , then she was panting then nothing atall , everything just stoped , she started eating and as though nothing had happend , but i knew she had more . i phoned the emergancy vet who told me to waite untill morning (this was at 3am ) so i waited like they said untill 8am when i phoned my normal vet they told me to bring her in straight away as i should have only waited a cupple of hours.( i wasnt to know) when we got there they did an x ray which showed 3 more kittens , he gave her 2 lots of oxytocin which didnt start her labour off again , so they did a c section , but by then it was 2 late , 2 of the kittens died an hour after 2 hours and the 3rd died 4 days later, if i had gotten there sooner maybe they would have survied.
i hope everything is ok , please update when you can.

Are you out there? I hope things went better through the night... but either way, please let us know. Our thoughts are with you...

Call your vet and get her in there. Sometimes you lose a kitten no matter what you try. Its part of breeding - the sad part but a growing part. I've lost a few kittens thru no fault of mine. But the joy of raising healthy kittens is worth it.

Hopefully everything is ok with the rest of the kittens.

Any word on this? Did you get her to the vet? Hope mama and babies are ok.

i do hope everything has gone ok.

nothing yet. I do hope she does post to us again. I am curiouse as to how the others are and if ther was just 1.

First and foremost--I cannot say thank you enough for the support that you guys all gave. I'm sorry I didn't post back sooner, but it has been a hectic few days!

It seemed at first that she wasn't going to deliver any more (there were four hours between 1 and 2) but then she started panting/purring again, and it went quite quickly from there...

I have mostly good news! While the first kitten (who died) was the nicest of the litter (isn't it always? ), there were three more after him, and while all needed assistance, all are healthy! Mom was so neat--she birthed the kittens on the bed between my fiance and I, and let us be part of everything...it was really, really neat.

There are two blue-and-whites, and a black-and-white. We think the two blue-ands are females, and the black-and a male. Everyone said--when they're first born it is easy--it didn't seem 'easy' to us!

I'm sorry to post more questions so soon after you all helped me, but they're good ones (I think) 1) the black-and was born with one eye already open--is that okay? He seems to mewl a LOT more than the other two--even for a 10 second weight he has to tell mom how horrible it is to be away

2) Is there a such thing as gaining weight too fast? They were all between 105 and 115 g. when born, and have gained 15 g. per day for the last 3 days...bellies seem soft, and they have been 'going', so I don't think they're holding anything in...just wanted to make sure I shouldn't be worried...

and 3) How do you get a neuter with his feelings hurt about the new 'intruders' to calm down again? Our Korat neuter (Max) was my 'baby'--the birthing room is 'our' bedroom...but we needed that room for the warmth for the kittens--I'd like to keep them together, but he is really being a jerk to the queen--his posture is submsisive, but he is growling, chattering, and howling...should I be worried? any advice?

congrats on the 3 babys and im so sorry that the first didnt make it , rip little one
to your questions , being born with an eye open should be ok , i think you just have to be more vilgent about infections , so just keep an eye out.

15g a day is about right for kittens , they normally say 10-15 g so that sounds fine.

his feelings wont be hurt if he gets neutered , he will be a bit hissy with the new little ones , its all a different smell to him. he should calm down after a few weeks , but we do advise that you do introductions at about 4-6 weeks , and do this supervised , but after a while he should be fine.
if you dont get him neutered him and mum could get up to things and being so close to have this litter , we dont advise this.
but good luck , i hope i have helped with your questions.

Originally Posted by bkellar

1) the black-and was born with one eye already open--is that okay? He seems to mewl a LOT more than the other two--even for a 10 second weight he has to tell mom how horrible it is to be away

2) Is there a such thing as gaining weight too fast? They were all between 105 and 115 g. when born, and have gained 15 g. per day for the last 3 days...bellies seem soft, and they have been 'going', so I don't think they're holding anything in...just wanted to make sure I shouldn't be worried...

and 3) How do you get a neuter with his feelings hurt about the new 'intruders' to calm down again? Our Korat neuter (Max) was my 'baby'--the birthing room is 'our' bedroom...but we needed that room for the warmth for the kittens--I'd like to keep them together, but he is really being a jerk to the queen--his posture is submsisive, but he is growling, chattering, and howling...should I be worried? any advice?

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To answer your questions:

1. Open eyes at birth are not uncommon. Keep a close eye on it for signs of infection.

2. Average weight gain for a SH cat is 10-20 grams daily. You should supplement feedings only if weight gain is 5 grams or below.

3. Your Korat will calm down soon. He's just wondering who has usurped his position as "da man" in your life. Give him time. Do pay him the same amount of attention you usually do. Korats are naturally super possessive of their humans anyway.

You're doing fine.

you guys are great. Thank you so much!

>>>update<<<

The Babies are now one week old and getting much bigger- now all three are at or very close to 200g- two more days and they will be double thier birth weight. other eyes are starting to open, and they don't like it when mommy leaves them in their rubbermaid tote alone. The Korat has mellowed- last night he peeked his head in the door of the tote and hissed- once...twice....three timesBAM!!! mama came flying through the hole and started beating the snot out of him! he retreated into the bathroom, jumped onto the scrating post as if it were home plate, never expecting her to follow..(there's only room for one ) I jumped up and seperated them and took Max out of the room for a while till things settled. about an hour laster I brought him back, and the two have been great together. He stays out of the way, she ignores him; they now have an understanding, but it was scaryat the time...

Congrads do we have pictures yet