Calling Tortoise owners

mooficat

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So my friends neighbours tortoise has had babies (again) and I´m going to see them tomorrow - dont worry - will get some photos ! The tortoise lives in the garden (we are in Spain) and the babies just keep coming, they say tortoises are hard to breed, not these little blighters

Thing is, I know that once I see them I will want one, they are only about as big as a sand-dollar
so any owners out there that can advise me will be greatly appreciated. Especially owners who also have kitties
 

sharky

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I had a turtle when I was younger great pets but not for small kids
/.///

Tortises like to be outside but you need to make a fenced area that you dig down at least 4 ft and wire ( chicken wire fencing worked)... reptile rescue gave me that
 

stormy

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The cats get along ok with Shelly. At first they were kind of afraid of her when we'd let her out to get some exercise. Now they just ignore her.
 
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mooficat

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Tortoises not on my agenda anymore due to the arrival of said little kitty Teddy

My friend is having two though, he went to pick them a couple of days ago, and can you believe it he didnt know which ones he liked the best
dont they all look the same.......or maybe thats a bit offensive to a tortoise
 

karmasmom

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I use to own 2 russian torts. They were great I miss them dearly and would love to get more. You need to do ALOT of research befor getting one. Everyone alwasy goes "oh ow cute I want one". No one thinks about the future with them. Torts can live between 40-100 years , are you ready for that? We had to find someone who would give care incase they out lived us. Also even with a small breed like a Russian they require a ton of space. For the ones we had the 4 foot by 4foot enclosure was not big enough. To really be happy and healthy they would require a room about 12 feet by 12 feet. Remember these litte ones were no biger than a hamburger, about 6 inches long, bottom measure and about 8 inches ofer the caprase(top of shell). Thats a big amount of space. A larger bread like the African Sulcata would require about an acre of land plus the abillity to dig holes that could be as deep as 6 feet. I have a number of books about it. I realized that even though I loved my 2 there was no way I could provide the space and time needed to care for them. Just feeding toktime. You have to cut everything up small enough for them to eat plus do a ton of reaserch so you can give them variety. If a baby tort eats head letuce it will imprint and will not eat anything else, unfortunately it has absolutly no nutritional value so in the end could kill the tort. I got my first one with out doing reaserch because it was cute. Once I owned him and took him to a vet that knew tort I found out a lot. I waited 3 years before getting the 2 one and I still was not ready for her.

If the shell has a pyramid effect they are lacking many nutrients and it is not good. You want a smooth shell, no bumbs. They are prone to infections, a cold can kill. THe larger ones can take off a finger in one quick bit. Once a tort gets you don't expect to be let go. They grab and pull their heads in, taking you with it. I have heard to many stories about people having to kill the animal just to get their finger back.

Some torts are very hard to bread. They require the perfect conditions, obviously your freind has the perfect conditions. In the U.S. it is illegal to sell torts under 4 inches because they run the risk of disease and many die. For some torts that 5-10 years latter. A baby need VERY special care and has VERY differnt need than a young adult or an adult.

Do you know wht kind it is? I can give you all the info you will ever need. Not only did I research my Russians but I reaserch most of the others as well.

Someday I would love to own a Sulcata but will need a BIG yard plus for the fench you have to dig a trench about 12 feet doun and fill it with cement just to prevent escapes. Torts are the Houdinies of the reptile world. They don't move fast but they love to explore. I cant tell the number of times I put my boy Henry down to play and the next thing I knew he was inthe other room undre a pile of clothes or in a dresser or closet. I could never keep up with him. The girl Lilly was worse. She was like a 6 inch mac truck
. She did not care, she sould just push everything and anything out of her way, including us.

I know you love your cats and only want whats best. Its the same for Torts. Please do your reaserch and realize it is a lifetime commitment. They require a lot of work and time. They can also be very costly if injered or sick. A papre cut can kill them. They have horrable immune systems. What may be nothing to us or a cat will kill them.

Just some food for though. PM me if you have any questins. Next to cats they are my favorite animal. Its a tie between the two.
 

strange_wings

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Originally Posted by KarmasMom

If the shell has a pyramid effect they are lacking many nutrients and it is not good. You want a smooth shell, no bumbs.
Pyramiding is caused by too much protein in the diet and not enough calcium and/or D3 to absorb the calcium. I'm extremely careful with my baby boxies to prevent this.

Originally Posted by KarmasMom

In the U.S. it is illegal to sell torts under 4 inches because they run the risk of disease and many die.
The law was never intended to protect turtles or tortoises, it was because RES hatchlings where being sold everywhere or given away as prizes at fairs, carnivals, etc. With the increased handling of these turtles by young children there were many cases of salmonella linking back to the turtles.
The real reason the 4 inch law was passed, turtles under 4" can fit in a child's mouth...
Silly that we need a federal law because parents were too irresponsible to make sure the animals were handled safely.

While it did decrease the number of aquatic hatchlings being sold as pets (there's still food and export use of them) it caused problems for other types of turtles. The years needed to raise a turtle to legal size makes breeding them rather costly so people still collect large amounts from the wild instead of captive breeding, thus hurting the wild populations in some areas. Combine that with the damage done by roads and you get endangered species in some areas.
 

karmasmom

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Thank you for clarifying the law, I never looked into that to much. I just went off what I was told.

You know how much reaserch is need to have healthy turtles and torts. It takes time to make sure that everything is right fromm the foods to the enclusure.

What kind of Box Turtle do you have? Do you consider it a turtle or tortoise? I know ther is a debate on which it is because it has simalar traits to both. I think Box's are one of the most perfect. You get the best of both worlds.


Thank you again for clarifying its been a few years since I owned one so my knowledge is a bit rough. I knew the lack of calcium absobsion and D3 was part of it forgot about the too much protien bit. I remember having to substitute vitamins and minerals because of the strickly vegitarian diet. Luckaly we never had that problem. I had help from my vet and a few breaders, they made sure I had things right. I just did not have the room any more. We wanted to bread but we just never got the right conditions. For Russians I would have needed 3-5 females for the one male. They like choises
. We just could not swing it. They now live with a breeder in a big yardwith other torts and have produced babies
. I know they are healthy and happy. The breeder did comment on how impressed he was with them. They have become his best specimans. So I guess I did something right.

I did just go a pull my books out again. I still want to read about them and refresh my memory.
 

strange_wings

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Originally Posted by KarmasMom

What kind of Box Turtle do you have? Do you consider it a turtle or tortoise? I know ther is a debate on which it is because it has simalar traits to both. I think Box's are one of the most perfect. You get the best of both worlds.
They're a turtle, they still need water to soak in and drink. Though the native species for this area has to be able to go without it for long periods, it's often very very dry here. Mine are Ornate box turtles, Terrapene ornata oranta to be exact.
(there's pics in the pic section on here, if you haven't seen them) When spring comes the babies will be going outside. Like tortoises, they're not an indoor pet at all. There's only a few native North American tortoises and I know 2, if not all of them are protected.
I have to add vitamins and calcium to my turtles food as well, they're more carnivorous, but no captive care can completely emulate the wild and the variety they would find there to keep them healthy. They still require a lot of veggies too.

Have you seen this site? http://www.tortoisetrust.org/articles/webdiet.htm
The 4th and last 3 pictures are horrifying! And a good reason why anyone else lurking/reading this post should study up on diet if they have or want a turtle or tortoise.


As for info about the 4 inch law, it's usually complained/debated about on turtle and tortoise forums regularly
it's a much disliked law.


Cats have never given me problems, outdoors they could care less what an adult turtle is doing. Too much curiously results in hissing and snapped at noses or paws. Babies will have locking lids on their pen, I'm far more worried about people and the local oppossum in the area. Tomas did jump in with them once, unfortunately to play in the dirt.
In any case if you have to keep a reptile inside with a cat the key is to use a lid.
 
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