Bengals/Ocicats

Originally Posted by Kai Bengals

Just to be clear, the first ALC domestic crosses were from a couple of cats from India. Loosely referred to as Indian Mau's. They were subsequently registered as E. Mau's with CFA but I have seen their pictures and they don't look like good examples of Mau's. More like a sorrel DSH mackrel tabby with very broken up striping.

Burmese were used in early breedings, but I don't think anyone used siamese. Of course I could be wrong, we're talking about 20 to 30 years ago.

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Hmm, I know Bagheera's originally breeder mommy said that her (breeder/kitty) lines date back to the original Indian Mau's. It was my understanding that almost all the Mau's in the US today dated back to them, and certainly there is a lot of crossing of the family lines in her recent pedigree. Gosh, and I can't remember but I'd understood there to be another two cats introduced to the line, perhaps from Europe? I'm just not up enough on Mau breeding to know for sure how it all worked out. I would have thought that there would have had to be some other genes brought in somewhere, or that there would be serious consequences with the breed.. but I'm not a breeder and I'm definitely not up on genetics, so, that's just my errant thoughts on the matter.

Aren't Burmese similiar in a lot of ways to the Siamese? Although, Tavi exhibited traits that I know come from Siamese.. it doesn't mean that another breed doesn't have the same traits and she didn't get it from there.

Anyway, to get back to the OP.. which I've been deviating horribly from.. as far as I had heard (and again, not a very experienced opinion) ocicats were not a part of the line. We'd considered Ocicats as opposed to the Bengal but we really loved the personality (what *was* I thinking?) and the coloration of the rosettes..... hehe, j/k. I do adore the little beasties.

Originally Posted by GoldenKitty45

Nial, what's in your breeding contract that might specify what cats he/she can be bred to?

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That's one of the problems, my contract doesn't specify that. At the time I sold her the stud, I was completely unaware that she was also breeding Mau's. She is a member of the international bengal cat society and had to sign the same code of ethics that I did, so I plan to pursue this through them. Problem is, all they would be able to do is ban her, which won't stop her from doing what she's doing.
TICA doesn't allow any outcrosses other than the ALC, so she can't register litters unless she's "hanging papers" on them.

I've learned my lesson, our new breeder contract is 4 pages long.

That's horrible. I'm sorry to here that. This probably may sound naive, but you'd think she'd stop after knowing how unhappy you are about what she is doing. But I imagine it was her intent all along, and that is why she wasn't forthcoming when she got a kitty from you. I'm sure there is some Bengal breeder out there who could care less what she did. She should of got one from them. Makes me angry and I'm not involved. Shame on her.

Nial, any way you can "buy back" your male?

Originally Posted by GoldenKitty45

Nial, any way you can "buy back" your male?

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I've tried that! One of our breeder friends tried to buy him too, she won't budge.
She knows she has a good thing. He's a triple grand and was TICA's best seal mink spotted bengal, SW region for 2005.
Titles that I got for him, she doesn't show her cats.

I know, why'd I sell him? We had to make some room for new lines, he got the short straw.

Rodeo is his son and the plan is to take him further than his sire.

Can you contact TICA and see if they can do anything. Or at least be aware of what she's breeding him to.

You have nothing in the contract about legally getting your cat back under certain circumstances? Maybe talk to a lawyer about how to get him back - imo I don't see why you can't just go get him - give her the money back and go from there.

Originally Posted by siameseohio

That's horrible. I'm sorry to here that. This probably may sound naive, but you'd think she'd stop after knowing how unhappy you are about what she is doing. But I imagine it was her intent all along, and that is why she wasn't forthcoming when she got a kitty from you. I'm sure there is some Bengal breeder out there who could care less what she did. She should of got one from them. Makes me angry and I'm not involved. Shame on her.

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Yes, she hasn't been very up front about alot of things. Takes all kinds to make the world go round.

Photo galleries of Bengals and Ocicats...

The bengals:
http://www.gotcatsonline.com/picture...y/bengal-cats/

The ocicats:
http://www.gotcatsonline.com/pictures/gallery/ocicats/

Here are the ones that look a little similar to me. Can YOU tell which is which?

1.
2.
3.
4.
5.
6.
7.
8.
9.
10.
11.
12.


(*Note, I'm only going by what other people say these cats are. I also purposely left out the rosetted bengals, because the difference is obvious in those instances. And no fair checking my links to see which is which!)

More:

13.
14.
15.
16.
17.
18.
19.
20.
21.
22.
23.
24.

OK, let's see how good I am at telling the differences

1 - Oci
2. Oci ? (picture is too small to tell for me)
3. Bengal
4. Bengal
5. Oci
6. Bengal
7. Oci
8. Bengal
9. Oci
10. Bengal (?)
11. Oci
12. Bengal
13. Oci
14. Bengal
15. Oci
16. Bengal
17, 18, 19 - all Oci's
20. Oci
21.-24. Bengals

How many did I get right? (and which are wrong?)

Thanks Tiff. This is the first time I've tried - was pleased to find out (from you) I got 16 of 24 right. Hubby just took the test (not seeing my answers or yours) and got 16 of 24 right.

And he's just started in cats !

Sheesh Tiff, difficult much? Here's mine..

1. Oci
2. Bengal
3. Bengal
4. Oci (Chanan took the pic)
5. hmmm Oci maybe
6. Definately Bengal
7. Bengal
8. Bengal
9. Oci
10 & 11. Bengals
12. Oci
13 & 14. Oci
15. Bengal
16. Bengal
17. Bengal
18 - 20. Ocicats
21 - 22. Ocicats
23 - 24, Bengals

How'd I do???

Originally Posted by GoldenKitty45

Thanks Tiff. This is the first time I've tried - was pleased to find out (from you) I got 16 of 24 right. Hubby just took the test (not seeing my answers or yours) and got 16 of 24 right.

And he's just started in cats !

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Your husband has a great eye for a newbie! I POSTED the pics and I have to refer to my answer sheet for answers.

Originally Posted by tiffanyjbt

Here are the ones that look a little similar to me. Can YOU tell which is which?

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Okies, here we go.. and I make the disclaimer that I have no real knowledge of Ocicats except that I've seen them here and there at a show in cages and occasionally in a picture online. I'm basing this on my Bengal knowledge and that is limited other than directly related to my two (one of which is a marble), so.. I will probably get many wrong, lol.

Ocis: 1, 4, 5, 6, 9, 13, 15, 16, 17, 19, 22, 23, 24,

Bengals: 2, 3, 7, 8, 10, 12, 14, 18, 20, 21,

11, I just can't tell, but I would hazard Oci.

Nyeh nyeh GK - I got 20/24!!! It's all in the muzzle and the eyes! BTW, according to the quiz master we only were wrong on only one of the same!

You guys are pretty good at this. I'll give everyone the weekend to figure out who's who, and then I'll post the answers in the thread. This is fun!

1 Oci
2 Bengal
3 Bengal
4 Oci
5 Oci
6 Bengal
7 Bengal
8 Bengal
9 Oci
10 Bengal
11 Oci
12 Bengal
13 Oci
14 Oci
15 Oci
16 Bengal
17 Bengal
18 Oci
19 Oci
20 Oci
21 Oci
22 Oci
23 Bengal
24 Oci

K folks, I'm gonna be offline for a while, so if I don't answer right away don't think I'm ignoring you.

I got 20 out of 24 correct. On the whole, I'd say I know my Bengals.