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Need comforting words about CRF (and a little help)

post #1 of 26
Thread Starter 
He's not techinally my cat, he's my moms, but he's been in the family since I was 8 years old. His name is Fire. He is 14 years old and we just got some bad news. I took him into work for his vaccines and a complete bloodwork because he is having a dental cleaning next week. We got the bloodwork back and his BUN and creatinine are elevated. I started crying as soon as I saw the results. He is in the begining stages of CRF.

BUN - Result 40 -\t Range 14-36 mg/dL
Creatinine - Result\t2.5 \t - Range \t0.6-2.4 mg/dL

It looks like we caught it just as his kidney enzymes where starting to go up. My vet suggested a low protein diet. They said that they would still go ahead with the dental cleaning since his kindeys aren't too bad yet. He also has a grade 2 heart murmur.

I know this isn't the end for him right now, but I also know that there is no cure for it. All we can do is buy time. He is such a sweet and loving cat... I just dont want to see him go...

Does anyone know of any nonprescription low protein cat foods? The clinic I work at has NF which we are going to try, but I was hoping that there were some soft foods that where low protein... Any suggestions?

Other then that, I am just hoping for some prayers that he will still have many years left with the family...

post #2 of 26
what food is he eating? if you want to save him try homeopathy. homeopathy cures, allopathy palliates. don't vaccinate for any reason, it weakens the immune system and when given to a compromised pet as yours is it equals disaster...always trust your common sense. feed high quality protein in wet form, no dry food if you can as it taxes the kidneys, no by-products, no salt, no phosphates or phosphorous, lots of water and loads of love.

was he well hydrated when the tests were taken? dehydrated animals will aften give falsely elevated readings...

http://www.thecatsite.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=114036
post #3 of 26
Nf for a Rx has decent ingrediants and the cats like it ... i used it as the intial CRF stabalizer ....

Ask for extra fluids during and after surgery.... I have a CRF girl and that is what she get when she goes under ..

As for diet do the research ... I do raw , homemade and canned dog and cat food .... BUT I also have a holisitic/ conventional vet who has yrs of experience dealing with CRF .... QUALITY Over quanity is what I found with protein... My girl get about 40-55% protein and stays stable ... TALK TO your VET

Try to avoid DRY food at all if you can ... Kandie get s dry for cookies only
post #4 of 26
LOW phos NOT NONE ....

Vaccinations depend on age at diagnosis .. and local laws ... I dont but I live in an area where most dieseases are low insidence and laws are only for dogs ..


SO folks say a water fountain helps with hydration... no personal experience I do cups all over the house
TALK with your VET
post #5 of 26
It looks like you've caught Fire's CRF in very early stages which is good news. CRF isnt' a death sentence and cats can live for years with it. You might want to take a look at this website which is excellent - it was recommended to me when my cat had some high values (he doesn't have CRF but is at the high end of normal). It lists non prescription foods that have a low phosphorus level.

http://www.felinecrf.org/

Diet is very important in early CRF. It's good that this was picked up via a routine blood test rather than due to symptoms as it means you can get to work straight away on helping Fire. I know of someone on another forum who's cat has CRF and thyroid problems but has recently tested normal for urea and creatinine.
post #6 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by sharky View Post

Vaccinations depend on age at diagnosis ..
no, vaccinating an immunocompromised pet is not only irresponsible and bad science but a crime. actually, vaccinating at all is irresponsible but that's a whole other thread...

and vaccinations have nothing to do with diagnoses...they are supposed to be...supposed to be preventative... but... they are not.
post #7 of 26
I will be praying for him. WHat did the vet say about time?
post #8 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by tuna View Post
no, vaccinating an immunocompromised pet is not only irresponsible and bad science but a crime. actually, vaccinating at all is irresponsible but that's a whole other thread...

and vaccinations have nothing to do with diagnoses...they are supposed to be...supposed to be preventative... but... they are not.
You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but I'll have my cats vaccinated just the same as I would have my children vaccinated against Polio and other human diseases and just as I would have vaccinations myself if I were travelling to more remote parts of the world or areas where there were diseases my body did not have natural immunities to.
post #9 of 26
yosemite...and no one can stop you. when i get the time i will start a thread about vaccines if there hasn't been one already...i only brought it up here because i understand there was a compromised pet being vaccinated...even some mainstream vets are against that...thankfully.
post #10 of 26
I have nothing to add other than my thoughts and prayers for Fire.
He's a beautiful boy.
post #11 of 26
Fire is a lovely boy. You are right, this was caught very early. Please when you go to the site previously suggested in this thread - www.felinecrf.org, read up about Calcitriol. I have used this with each of my crf kitties, and am convinced it is one reason Patrick lived for almost 4 years with his crf staying stable and in the early stages, and his passing not related to his crf.

I don't like by-products, but a food I am currently using with Tippy, as I want him on a wet food diet (he has stomatitis and seems to be eating wet food better) is Hi Tor Neo - it is formulated as a lower protein, lower phosphorous food and is available, non-prescription via petfooddirect.com (be sure to get the one that describes itself as for kitties with kidney issues). The only thing I don't like is that this food has by-products. I took one of the cans in, had my vet compare it to two of the prescription foods she had, and it was lower in protein than one, and lower in phos than the other so very comparable, and she gave me the okay to feed this to Tippy.

I think with good care, you can keep Fire with your family for some time to come.
post #12 of 26
Just sending to you and good vibes to Fire.

Laurie
post #13 of 26
Thread Starter 
I talked with the vets I work with, they said he could have 4-5 years left. The problem is, they think that the heart murmur maybe hypertrophic cardiomyopathy. SOOOO, if his heart starts to get worse, were kinda in a lose - lose situation. Lasix aren't really a good thing but put a cat with kidney problem on.
Our plan is to check his kidney levels every 3 months. When he has his blood drawn, they will also check and see if the murmur is progressing. We will also be checking his urine every 3 months to see what the specific gravity is.
As for his dental, the vet doing the procedure, already informed me that we will be giving him fluids prior to surgery. We are also going to start him on antibiotics a couple days before hand because his teeth are bad and will most likely be needing extractions. They are only going to be using gas anesthesia. NO injectables.
As for the vaccines, they are required in order for him to stay in the hospital.

Thank you all so much for your help... Fire is one of the first cats I join my family and one of the reasons I now have sooooo many little fur children. Its just the terrible realization that I might lose him one day. I have not had any of my cats have to be put down yet. My oldest who lives at my moms house is 16. Its just really scary knowing that the time I have left with him is running out. Even if he does live for another 5 years.... It just doesn't seem long enough. He is the sweetest and most gentle cat ever. He has never even scratched anyone. I have a 4 year old neice who will pull on his tail and he just gets up and walks away. I love him and I'm not ready to lose him.....
post #14 of 26
I have no experience with CRF kitties. I just want to send hugs and {{{long life}}} vibes to Fire. It's good that you caught the CRF early so that you can work on diet and a care plan that will give him the best possible chance.
post #15 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by tuna View Post
no, vaccinating an immunocompromised pet is not only irresponsible and bad science but a crime. actually, vaccinating at all is irresponsible but that's a whole other thread...

and vaccinations have nothing to do with diagnoses...they are supposed to be...supposed to be preventative... but... they are not.
How is a cat with renal failure "immunocompromised"?
post #16 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mermaid View Post
How is a cat with renal failure "immunocompromised"?
When one or more body systems are not working properly many folks that are thinking more naturally will say immmune comprimised... the kindeys not fucntioning at normal levals stresses the other avenues for waste elimination... thus leaving the body a little more open to infection or adverse reaction/.... Hope this makes a lick of sence
post #17 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty14788 View Post
As for the vaccines, they are required in order for him to stay in the hospital.
Fwiw, if Fire has been regularly vaccinated his whole life, if it were my vet and my vet's hospital, they do not agree that an elderly cat with a condition such as crf must be vaccinated. Tyler was hospitalized when he developed a free floating hematoma post bladder surgery several years ago, they did not insist on vaccinations...now yes, that was an emergency, but he also just had a dental this year...they did not require it.

The belief now is that q 3 years is adequate for vaccinations, and many vet practices now follow this as I believe it is now current guidelines (I was told this years ago by a vet I worked with after a conference she attended, and quit vaccinating every year at that time)..but there is also discussion that vaccination as an adult (after a kitten series) may be enough for life.

The bottom line I believe they can do a titer to see the level of protection is adequate (off the top of my head, as I recall, the vaccines are for panleukopenia, calicivirus and ? darn, forgot the 3rd )

Anyhoo...consider asking them to waive it for Fire if he's been up to date at this point, again, I think this is discussed on the www.felinecrf.org site.
post #18 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by sharky View Post
When one or more body systems are not working properly many folks that are thinking more naturally will say immmune comprimised... the kindeys not fucntioning at normal levals stresses the other avenues for waste elimination... thus leaving the body a little more open to infection or adverse reaction/.... Hope this makes a lick of sence
Yes it did!
post #19 of 26
I've had a couple of cats with CRF. One of them was like yours in that it was caught early. I elected to put him on diet that was lower in phosphorous using the listings below. He did not like the Hill's K/D so I chose a food that he liked from the listing which was lower in phosphorous than most foods. He did very well on the diet and was able to maintain his kidney function for 5 years before he required sub-q fluids.

http://webpages.charter.net/katkarma/canfood.htm
http://webpages.charter.net/katkarma/dryfood.htm

Personally, I feel that diet is the best way to control CRF. Some people feel that it is better to continue to feed a high protein diet and give sub-q fluids but many cats do not tolerate sub-q fluids very well.
post #20 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty14788 View Post
He's not techinally my cat, he's my moms, but he's been in the family since I was 8 years old. His name is Fire. He is 14 years old and we just got some bad news. I took him into work for his vaccines and a complete bloodwork because he is having a dental cleaning next week. We got the bloodwork back and his BUN and creatinine are elevated. I started crying as soon as I saw the results. He is in the begining stages of CRF.

BUN - Result 40 -\t Range 14-36 mg/dL
Creatinine - Result\t2.5 \t - Range \t0.6-2.4 mg/dL

It looks like we caught it just as his kidney enzymes where starting to go up. My vet suggested a low protein diet. They said that they would still go ahead with the dental cleaning since his kindeys aren't too bad yet. He also has a grade 2 heart murmur.

I know this isn't the end for him right now, but I also know that there is no cure for it. All we can do is buy time. He is such a sweet and loving cat... I just dont want to see him go...

Does anyone know of any nonprescription low protein cat foods? The clinic I work at has NF which we are going to try, but I was hoping that there were some soft foods that where low protein... Any suggestions?

Other then that, I am just hoping for some prayers that he will still have many years left with the family...

Have ou joined the feline-crf-support on yahoogroups? if not PLEASE do! The people on there have delt with this at least once and some are back with their second cat. They can tell you what Vets don't even know and give you a list of foods low in phosphorus.

I am one of the members as my Tiny Missy girl has CRF AND she refuses to eat. I don't think I could cope without them!
post #21 of 26
You're lucky to have caught Fire's CRF early. I've had several kitties with CRF over the years, and I understand the immediate feeling of "OMG, he/she is going to die!"
Quote:
Its just really scary knowing that the time I have left with him is running out. Even if he does live for another 5 years.... It just doesn't seem long enough
While we all know that the time we have with our fur-babies is limited, the reality is never easy to face.

Quote:
Have you joined the feline-crf-support on yahoogroups?
I totally agree; these groups are full of people with not only loads of experience, but they know just what you're going thru.

Sending lots of good wishes to Fire and your family.
post #22 of 26
Still sending prayers and hugs from Mississippi for you and your mom and your cat.

I hope he feels better soon.

post #23 of 26
Any update you can post?
post #24 of 26
Our family cat is 18 and has been living with CRF for 3 years. Her BUN is always around 60 which is high but it stays at that level and she's been doingn great so I have good hopes for your moms kitty as long as you keep up with treatment. Especially subq fluids.
post #25 of 26
Thread Starter 
We started Fire on Purina's NF. He really seems to like it... (Obviously from the previous picture, he likes just about any food you give him)

The dental cleaning is tuesday. I'm a little nervous. I know that the gas anesthesia is the safest, but I always get a little nervous when any of my animals have to go under.

My mother is now spoiling him rotten. Fire is HER baby. He picked her as his favorite. (He loves anyone who will touch him but he loves her the most) She tries her best to come across strong, but I know that its upset her knowing that there's something wrong with him. She really hadn't wanted to do the bloodwork at all (money's been a little tight) but after she found out he had CRF, she was willing to do whatever had to be done. The food is on the pricey side ($21 for 8 lbs), but she didn't even flinch at getting it for him. I told her Fire would need bloodwork every three months, she just said "OK. Remind me when its time for him to come in."

Even my father is willing to do whatever it takes for him. (My father is "mister hard-@$$ construction worker") I told him that down the line, Fire might need subQ fluids. He was more then willing to step up to the plate to do it.

Fire came to our house as a stray. (ALL the strays in the neighborhood have always known where to go) He was malnurished and desperately wanted someone to love on him. My mother took one look at him and that was it. Within 10 seconds he was in the house livin the good life. Fire and to deal with me and my little brother carring him around the house, picking at him, and all the other stuff 5 and 7 year olds do. But he NEVER once tryed to scratch us. If he's annoyed, he will simply get up and walk away. He's the gentlest cat I have EVER known.

This is Fire when we first took him in...


I'm feeling better now, knowing that we are doing all that we can for him. I just have to think of it like I think about Neville (For those that dont know, Neville has a brittle bone disease called osteogenesis imperfecta) One day his time will come. But it's not today. So I'm not going to worry until its time. For now, I am doing all I can for him and I'm going to spoil the living tar out of him.
post #26 of 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty14788 View Post
One day his time will come. But it's not today. So I'm not going to worry until its time. For now, I am doing all I can for him and I'm going to spoil the living tar out of him.
That's all we can do whether they are well or ill. Just love'em up.
You should look up my threads on Frankie...a starving to death girl we took in just over a year ago..she too has crf.
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