need suggestions till Monday

I am so glad that you had a wonderful visit with toe, I know that it did you and him both a world of good, now he knows too that you just didn't run off and leave him. He will be home with you soon.

I am so glad he is doing well and was happy to see you Jenn. I agree with PurrPaws, you can't just put healthy cats on c/d - and the UK formula do say there is a time limit that they can have it for - I know someone's vet told them that they just put that on for EU regs and it doesn't mean anything, but it makes me wonder. I would go for something that has things like cranberry extract, or other ingredients for Urinary Tract health - RC's Neutered male has something in it for that, and if you can afford it, more wet and less dry.
Beandip - free feeding is supposed to be worse for UTI's, I just can't remmeber the reason why off hand.

wow........so many comments.

All I can say about the CD food is that the vet said it is a great maintenance food for male kittes to keep the urinary track healthy.....

If he is there tomorrow, I will ask for more details.

And....

I noticed that you mentioned going to "meals" instead of "snacks", with Toe's condition in mind. I was under the impression that it was the opposite - meaning that the urine pH takes a big jump (encouraging crysal formation) after a big meal, whereas the pH would stay more stable when the cat is able to nibble throughout the day. Maybe I have it wrong, but I thought that's what I had read.

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This is absolutely correct. When I was discussing meals, it was because I am trying how to figure out how to seperate food for different animals. It would be much easier to free feed which is what I feel is best and is also easier. If 20 lbs last your cats 4 weeks and I ahve 24......[hehe], then I would need 60 lbs for a month.... I could do that. Then they could all eat the same thing. I spend approx 60.00 on cat food a month now more or less a few bucks. At 40.00 per 20lb, that 120.00 a month for great meals and less vet bills in the long run and probably less on litter as well.. I will see..... I spend approx 60.00 on litter a month as well. What's the difference in poop using
science diet? Does anyone know?

Jenn

Glad to hear he is getting better, hope all goes well when they take his catheter out, the vet sounds great.

Catching up on this and so glad to hear the good news. We all feel so guilty when something goes so wrong that we need vet treatment, let alone nearly losing one of our beloved animals, but I think you were incredible that you manage to look after so many and still notice when something is wrong. It is great that Toe is recovering. Good vibes for the next stage of the catheter coming out.

i'm goint to see toe tomorrow and Juan is driving back through that area from the airport on Thursday and he is going to visit Toe...

so Toe will have daily visitors... We miss him... Juan has called me every day several times to update him on toe's progress...

I remember Juan holding Toe when he was 5 weeks old, swaddled in a towel like a baby, rocking him. hehe the only part of toe you could see was his little face. Everything else was tucked in his towel. Toe loved it.

I am so glad to see these last posts of yours Jenn, I am so glad that toe is recovering so well.

Please continue to keep us updated on him.

When I was discussing meals, it was because I am trying how to figure out how to seperate food for different animals. It would be much easier to free feed which is what I feel is best and is also easier.

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I see...that makes sense.

What's the difference in poop using
science diet? Does anyone know?

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Hmmm I didn't do much of a study on the output but it does take considerably less (compared to supermarket stuff ) to fill them up, so it would only make sense that the output would be less.

I have 2 male cats who are predisposed to UTI's and struvite crystals. I would NOT recommened feeding everyone C/D because, like someone mentioned earlier, it is a food made to change the pH. If your other cats don't have problems, it could actually cause them to make calcium oxilate crystals and you would be right back where you started from.

I feed my cats purina one or proplan urinary tract formula. The second I try to buy something esle i'm at the vet with a cat that has a UTI and struvite crystals. I use it for all of my cats (I have 7) and I have never had a problem with it. Its also very important to make sure a cat who is predisposed to crystals, drinks plenty of water. By drinking more, the pH is more regulated. They also urinate more which will help keep the crystals from clumping together so there is less risk of a blockage.

Blockages are deadly so you and toe are VERY lucky. You made a very god decision not to wait. I work for a vet and I can not tell you how many cats we have lost because people decided to wait to bring there cat in. If they are blocked for to long they can rupture their bladder or go into kidney failure which will lead to complete organ failure. It can be a VERY long road to recovery.

Lastly, I am betting that you had toe neutered at a young age. The younger they are when they are neutered the greater chance they have of developing this problem. If they are neutered at a young age their urethra doesn't get a chance to develop to a large as it should be and is much more easily blocked. Many shelters neuter kittens as soon as they weigh 2 pounds. Which is normally around 2-3 months old. This is why MANY vets recommend waiting until they are 6 months old before neutering.

BEST WISHES TO YOU AND TOE. HE'S A LUCKY LITTLE BOY BECAUSE HE HAS YOU!

OHHH and just so you know... Science diet is more filling because it is higher in fiber.
Now what does a high fiber diet make people have to do........... POOP.
So yes, You will have much more to scoop if you go with science diet.

Just talked to hubby on the phone and he said he will believe it when it see it that 60 lbs will feed them for a month.. So I believe a study is in order. I will talk to the vet this morning after I do my running around and see which type he recommends for all the cats.. I want to find someting that they can all eat. Including Toe....

Blockages are deadly so you and toe are VERY lucky. You made a very god decision not to wait. I work for a vet and I can not tell you how many cats we have lost because people decided to wait to bring there cat in. If they are blocked for to long they can rupture their bladder or go into kidney failure which will lead to complete organ failure. It can be a VERY long road to recovery.

Lastly, I am betting that you had toe neutered at a young age. The younger they are when they are neutered the greater chance they have of developing this problem. If they are neutered at a young age their urethra doesn't get a chance to develop to a large as it should be and is much more easily blocked. Many shelters neuter kittens as soon as they weigh 2 pounds. Which is normally around 2-3 months old. This is why MANY vets recommend waiting until they are 6 months old before neutering.

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And yeah, we feel so lucky. He was nearly gone when the vet started working on him. His hair already had that different dead feel to it. It was pretty bad. I can't wait to see him today. And actually toe was 2 yrs old when he was fixed. At that time, I was a lot dumber than I am now.....

I have to go to town and pay bills and then go see Toe. Will update soon.

I don't want to go off track with the food discussion...but just for the sake of information...to my knowledge the C/D, and the Purina One Urinary, and the Pro Plan Urinary all work on the same principle, "Helps Maintain Urinary Tract Health by Reducing Urinary pH". It would seem to me that the risks of feeding these 3 products to healthy cats would be equal.


C/D

Purina One Urinary

Pro Plan Urinary


On the fiber / poop issue, the fiber content of the Purina and the Proplan are 2%. The C/D is 1%.

Please wish Toe a continued recovery

Thinking of you Toe

I would assume that because you have some many cats cost would be an issue. Which is the main reason I suggested the purina and proplan diets. Purina ONE is the cheapest of all the urinary tract diets that I have found that actually work.

Purina also has a veterinary diet called ST/OX that works AMAZINGLY well. Like the C/D it is more costly but works great. One of the Vets I work with has a female cat who gets struvite crystals all the time. She had her on the c/d and would still get crystals every couple of months. She switched her cat to the purina st/ox and has not had a single problem since. The vets I work with have told me it is safe to feed to all cats (even those without problems). And it is safe for long term use. I'm not sure how, but it makes the cats who eat it have to drink more. Which, in turn, helps maintain a healthy pH level.

One more thing, never feed toe purina indoor formula. Within a week of feeding it to my cats, my poor little Spaz developed crystals and almost blocked. We rushed him to the emergency vet who said that his bladder was still small enough to wait til my regular vet opened. (it was 2am so 7 am wasn't too long of a wait.) I'm not sure why, but its has been the WORST for my two boys (Spaz and Pheelicks). Both of them ended up with crystals.

Keep updating!!! Let us know how Toe is doing!

Originally Posted by jcribbs

Just talked to hubby on the phone and he said he will believe it when it see it that 60 lbs will feed them for a month.. So I believe a study is in order. I will talk to the vet this morning after I do my running around and see which type he recommends for all the cats.. I want to find someting that they can all eat. Including Toe....

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Jenn,

I'm feeding 19 cats Nutro MAX CAT Gourmet Classics because it is designed for urinary tract health. I think it takes about 80 to 100 lbs. a month free feeding. This is a bit of a guess because last month I bought 60 lbs and run out. Bought another 40, but also mixed in some Royal canin SO I got from the vet. The vet said there is no danger for the other cats to eat the SO, other than the fact they may put on weight due to higher fat content or something. (I don't really remember the why of it all, just the basic facts.).

My guys are indoor/outdoor so can't say on the litter issue since I do get a bit of a break there.

I agree with your husband that I don't think you can get by with just 60 lbs. a month.

Originally Posted by booktigger

I
Beandip - free feeding is supposed to be worse for UTI's, I just can't remmeber the reason why off hand.

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The reason is because every time they eat, their urine becomes temporarily a little more basic. If you free feed, every time they nibble a tide of basicity will hit the bladder. Whereas if you meal feed, it will only become basic as often as you feed them.

You can confirm this if you're lucky enough to be able to collect a urine sample soon after they eat.

I bought 17.5 lbs of hairball science diet today for 34.00. We'll see how long it lasts....

This ought to be interesting. I don't even want to guess.

Also......toe........ Toe is bleeding again. He is eating good but something is still not right with him. He has been on the SD for two days now and today ate really good. But when i picked him up, blood ran out of the cath. the vet was not there. The assistants had no idea he was or had been bleeding. They are going to tell the vet and I already have a call in to him.
Glad I went up there...

I want my little toe man home with me..

I want to find Purina ST/OX... and I want a :censor::censor::censor::censor::censor::censor::censor::censor: damn miracle.

I also got worm pills for all the cats except toe from the vet plus the little pluger wormer thingamagadet and shots for 8. Then all will be done. Only doing core shots direct from the vet.

Now I have to clean house. My house is a wreck. I have done nothing for three days. It's time to wake up .......

Here is a link to the purina veterinary diets
http://www.purinaveterinarydiets.com...l.aspx?prod=18

They have a phone number on the website to locate vets in your area who carry it. If your vet does not carry it normally, many will special order it for you.

Like I said before, it can be a long road to recovery. I have seen it take up to two weeks before a cat could urinate on his own. I hope for yours, toes, and your pocketbooks sake it doesn't take that long. The average time seems to be about a week.

ooooooooooo boy....... He has not pooped since he has been at the vet.. Since Friday actually... Today he ate great. So what goes in, must come out..

Need poop vibes and stop bleeding vibes. Husband is tripping out right now because Toe is bleeding and they don't consider it an emergency.. I am wiped out. He will be home tomorrow and can take over...

We are using a little nest egg on Toe right now... We call it our special fund... and Toe is special....