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2nd Pregnancy :: Odd behaviour

post #1 of 20
Thread Starter 
My little cat had kittens back in september. She is pregnant again (I think) and she must be getting close. She has not been outside since at least november 29th, since we moved to a new apartment.

At first she was just acting like she did when she was about to have the other kittens (they are now about 17 weeks old). But now it is like she is in heat all of the sudden. She is bothering me to go outside, but she won't when she sees how cold it is, and all the snow.

Is it possible that she is just trying to find a place away from her two little 17 week old kittens? She has been terrorizing them the last few days. And all day today she has been squirming around on the floor.

Help! Please
post #2 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by LorEye View Post
My little cat had kittens back in september. She is pregnant again (I think) and she must be getting close. She has not been outside since at least november 29th, since we moved to a new apartment.

At first she was just acting like she did when she was about to have the other kittens (they are now about 17 weeks old). But now it is like she is in heat all of the sudden. She is bothering me to go outside, but she won't when she sees how cold it is, and all the snow.

Is it possible that she is just trying to find a place away from her two little 17 week old kittens? She has been terrorizing them the last few days. And all day today she has been squirming around on the floor.

Help! Please
Lor....has she been seen by a vet to confirm that she is in fact pregnant?? Also, I would highly recommend that if she is done nursing her previous litter, that now is the time to give her her own room where she can prepare to have this new litter. She definately needs to be confined indoors until she weans this litter and can be spayed. Her kittens from her first litter are now old enough that they can also be spayed/neutered.

Katie
post #3 of 20
No offence intended but two pregnancies in less then 4-5 months is not good for your cat at all! I would suggest you get your cat checked by a vet to either confirm the new pregnancy and/or get a spay appt. At 17 weeks the litter should have been fully weaned already. I agree with Katie, keep her indoors!

Good luck!
post #4 of 20
Thread Starter 
how can it be unhealthy? It's only natural.

When at first we thought one of the kittens was a boy, I said he had an appointment with the snippy doctor. It's an easier procedure, and also I don't want to be responsible for getting other people's cats pregnant. But my girls are my choice. And I will eventually get it done. But until I have the time and the money I am perfectly happy having kittens around.

The guy who owns the local pet store is a friend of mine and he's always looking for healthy kittens from healthy families.
post #5 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by LorEye View Post
how can it be unhealthy? It's only natural.

When at first we thought one of the kittens was a boy, I said he had an appointment with the snippy doctor. It's an easier procedure, and also I don't want to be responsible for getting other people's cats pregnant. But my girls are my choice. And I will eventually get it done. But until I have the time and the money I am perfectly happy having kittens around.

The guy who owns the local pet store is a friend of mine and he's always looking for healthy kittens from healthy families.
LorEye....it isn't healthy to have litters close to each other because the mom cat oftentimes does not have the same level of nutrition and the subsequent kittens can be less healthy than the first litter. That is why even breeders tend to only have a couple of litters in a year...it gives the mom cat a chance to build up her nutrition levels and also ensure healthier kittens.

Additionally, every time you allow your female to mate outdoors with a cat of unknown origin you risk her contracting a disease. So it is our recommendation that all cats be spayed/neutered unless the cat is part of a pedigreed breeding program.

Katie
post #6 of 20
Mods (Katie), if this post is wrong, please feel free to delete!

Most breeders will let their queens to rest for at least 8-9 months between matings. This is purely for the welfare of the cat in question.

And again, I have to agree with Katie, allowing your female to mate with outdoors cats can bring all sorts of feline problems to your home...the least problem being fleas and lice, the worse being FIV or FeLV...

The fact that you're talking to a petshop owner and seller of kittens worry me...there are more than enough strays to go around...do you really want to be part of a problem?
post #7 of 20
Thread Starter 
I came here for advice of behaviour in my cat. but everywhere I go I don't get answers, I get lecture on getting my cats spayed or neutered.

This is a case of class. Different people will get there cats in different places. If I am the kind of person who thinks I will get a good cat at a pet store, then I will buy one at the pet store. Or get one from a breeder for a "registered" breed fancy cat, depending on my social bearing.

If I just want an easy companion I search the newspaper. Or I know a friend who just had kittens.

Or people who adopt strays from the street. But how often are these "strays" actually strays. I thought I found a stray and I almost took him in, he even spent the night a few times, until I learned that he belonged to someone.

What I don't understand is you are speaking of adding to the problem. What of third world countries with orphaned children, starving children, who's parents can't provide for them. Should we as people be adopting children from these places instead of having our own? To fix the problem?
post #8 of 20
Quote:
What I don't understand is you are speaking of adding to the problem. What of third world countries with orphaned children, starving children, who's parents can't provide for them. Should we as people be adopting children from these places instead of having our own? To fix the problem?
Lor...you are talking about 2 different things..and two different types of choices. Cats do not choose to have kittens...it is their hormones at play and we as responsible owners, must weigh our decision to allow them to breed carefully.

I'm sure you are a very caring owner to your cats...that is not at all in question here.

Katie
post #9 of 20
Yes, she will try to hide from the older kits. At this time, she will need all her time and energy to be completely devoted to the newbies. After the new arrivals are walking about, she may allow them to all socialize. You might try giving her some cardboard boxes with old towels, as disposable birthing centers. But the 2 older kits may want boxes of their own, for both sharpening claws and to hide and play in. Sending {{{prayers and vibes}}} for an easy, healthy birth! Susan
post #10 of 20
I second the suggestion of giving your momcat a room of her own. She does not trust other cats to be around her new kittens and will want privacy for the birth.

It is indeed unhealthy for her to have kittens so often; having repeated litters is one of the main reasons that feral (wild) cats only live for 2-5 years if they survive kittenhood. Technically, having repeated litters for 2-5 years gives the cat more chance of passing on its DNA, and is thus supported by natural selection; so it is "natural". However, "natural" doesn't mean "best for the cat".

After all, it's "natural" for human women to have a first child at 14-16, have six to ten children, most of whom don't survive past infancy, and then die in childbirth before age 40... But these days, we know that despite the former being the best strategy for passing on one's genes, we'll live longer if we take care of ourselves.

In the wild, that is what cats do: They die young, because they spend all their energy giving birth. (Males spend it fighting for mates, and usually die of wounds or disease.) But domestic cats, like today's "domestic" humans, can live longer through medical care that eliminates the problems caused by repeated litters.

Your cat's kittens may be well taken care of (though you are not assured of this if you do not charge a fee for adoption, and pick their owners yourself). However, they will be taking up "space" in folks' homes that some other cat will not be able to take advantage of--a cat which may be euthanized in a shelter, or stay uncared-for on the street, because the one who owns your cat's kittens already has a cat and does not want another.

I'm sorry I'm lecturing... I guess you don't want me to lecture; but I've volunteered at shelters, and watched feral cats, and I know the problem of feline overpopulation really does exist, and really is horrible. They may not be sentient creatures like we are; but the fact that we are smarter and more powerful means that we have a responsibility to protect and manage the domestic cat--a species we have essentially created.
post #11 of 20
Thanks everyone for your posts back to LorEye....I do feel that the reasons why we recommend spaying/neutering have been well covered. If Lor does come back, I would like to turn the focus of this thread to helpful suggestions on addressing her cat's current pregnancy.

Lor....our moderator Gaye has a wonderful thread on getting ready for a cat's pregnancy. Having been through this once, I'm sure you are familiar with most of it..but you may find some of her suggestions useful.

http://www.thecatsite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=80724

To repeat an earlier comment that I made (it may have been overlooked) I do think now is the time to seperate your pregnant cat from her kittens. Her behavior isn't at all odd given that she is expecting a second litter and is probably wanting her own space.

Katie
post #12 of 20
Make an appointment to get her spayed NOW. Not later. Wind, rain, snow will not stop a determined cat from breeding. Its FAR too soon for her to get pregnant again. Its not healthy.

How many litters has she had? This should be her last one. And yes, many females will start "picking" on a previous litter of babies if they are coming back into heat. Its a "kick out of the nest" thing to make room for more.

The important thing is to NOT let her outside to get pregnant. Please call your vet and hopefully get her spayed this coming week.
post #13 of 20
Lor, I strongly advise you to go visit your local shelter and have someone show you the many dogs and cats that are put to sleep EVERY day and give you the statistics of letting your mixed breed cat have litter after litter.

Maybe that will change your views about what you are doing. Puppy/Kitten mills breed their animals all the time - at every heat cycle. They don't care if the babies live or die or where they are sent. Most pet shops get their animals from these commercial mills OR from backyard breeders - like yourself. They also do not care who lives/dies or what happens to the kittens.

Please, please don't be part of the problem the shelters have to deal with - putting down litters of unwanted kittens. Sooner or later you will run out of friends/family to take your kittens. Do you really care WHO has your kittens?

And HOW many kittens/litters has this mother had so far - how old is she? And if you have any offspring (males) that are not neutered they WILL breed to their mother and you will have worse problems as the kittens will not be healthy - its called "inbreeding".

If you really love your cats - get them spayed or neutered
post #14 of 20
What if your female who you allow outside to reproduce comes back one day bloody and beat up from an agressive male? What if she gets Feline AIDS or Feline Leukemia from the unknown male she mates with? The problem is cats aren't smart and can't choose who they breed with. She may also b attacked and mated with multiple males at once leading to all sorts of problems.

We answered your questions that you asked but we are also concerned for the welfare of your cat. This board is all about keeping your cats healthy by spayed and neutering. Do you know the 17 week olds, if they are males, can get siblings or their mother pregnant? They are nearing that age...

Just keep in mind the diseases you are letting your cat be at high risk for. Not to mention various others I didn't even mention. Plus cancer is a risk too when she is older, going so long without being spayed.

All we ask is that you keep those things in mind before letting your female out to breed wth roaming intact males. They are the most likely ones to be carrying disease. What about genetic disease as well? She is at risk for carrying things down to her kittens too. Do you think allowing an unspayed female out to become pregnant by random males is really a wise and healthy choice?

Plus many of us here spend a lot of time and money of rescuing cats, strays, roaming females whatever and getting them fully vetted and into responsible homes. It saddens us when there are people doing the exact opposite and allowing their cats to randomly breed. It just puts our hard work one step backwards.
post #15 of 20
Thread Starter 
Sorry we got off on the wrong foot. I'm setting up Spooky's own room in our spare bedroom, I have the closet door open slightly, with a some boxes making a kind of yard outside the closet. There's some old clothes that she likes, and some towels.

Extra food and water dish close by. It's kind of like how I set up the spare room before, once the kittens before were walking around I moved her from my bedroom into the big spare one and had everything she needed in there.

I also gave her the option of the space under my bed that she loves so much, and my walk in closet that she loves so much.

I am going to find a convienient way to block the hallway so the kittens can only get as far as the bathroom litter box and Spook will have territory from beyond there, sans kittens
post #16 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by LorEye View Post
Sorry we got off on the wrong foot. I'm setting up Spooky's own room in our spare bedroom, I have the closet door open slightly, with a some boxes making a kind of yard outside the closet. There's some old clothes that she likes, and some towels.

Extra food and water dish close by. It's kind of like how I set up the spare room before, once the kittens before were walking around I moved her from my bedroom into the big spare one and had everything she needed in there.

I also gave her the option of the space under my bed that she loves so much, and my walk in closet that she loves so much.

I am going to find a convienient way to block the hallway so the kittens can only get as far as the bathroom litter box and Spook will have territory from beyond there, sans kittens
That's probably a good idea. Spooky needs her own space to "get away" it is were. When I foster pregnant mom cats...I find it is actually easier to train the kittens when mom has been confined into a room with the food/water and litter close by. That way, the kittens learn to eat solids and also use the litterbox by mimicing what mom does.

Katie
post #17 of 20
Thread Starter 
that's like what I did last time. I kept the little box very clean, because before the kittens actually used it, they thought it a very cool place to play. Just like mum... kind of.
post #18 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Callista View Post
After all, it's "natural" for human women to have a first child at 14-16, have six to ten children, most of whom don't survive past infancy, and then die in childbirth before age 40... But these days, we know that despite the former being the best strategy for passing on one's genes, we'll live longer if we take care of ourselves.
I don't want to step on toes or get into an argument, and I TOTALLY see where you're coming from with this statement, however, this is not an accurate statement and it's a little bit offensive IMO. I know of many women who have over 10 children and aren't in the slightest risk of dying in childbirth... and the children are all healthy and happy and very much alive. One of my friends is one of 20 children, and I have several other friends who have 8 or more children of their own... all healthy and happy children, and the Mom's are in good health. In fact, many studies have shown that repeatedly hindering the conception process and allowing our bodies to menstruate every month for years at a time can actually CAUSE health problems, such as multiple types of cancer. Many fertility problems are also caused by the repeated ongoing use of birth control pills. I don't know how it is for cats, and I wouldn't presume to know what is best for them, but I do know that the high incidences of mortality that you speak of are mostly seen in third-world countries where there are other issues involved such as poor sanitation, poor diet, etc. I just wanted to say that really quick. Again, I have no desire to argue or detract from the point you were making - I just felt compelled to reply to the inaccuracies of this statement.
post #19 of 20
I think the point was just that cats should be spayed/neutered. Period. The "natural" argument doesn't hold up. This was an extreme way of demonstrating it, but it's shocking enough to grab attention. More than 70% of cats who end up in shelters end up being euthanized. If people would stop letting their own pets have litter after litter, there would be room in people's homes for these poor animals. We as humans have the free will to make this better, to prevent needless pregnancy and reproduction. Cats do not. The cats and kittens who end up euthanized in shelters have done nothing wrong but be born. We have done everything wrong for not preventing their birth and their needless deaths.
post #20 of 20
I agree with everyone who says spay and neuter all of these pet cats/kittens, but if the original poster does not agree with the many, many suggestions of posters. Then please read the research out there from accredited vets, or the opinion of the http://www.avma.org/ about spay and neuter. I can send many, many links, to prove that spay and neutering your animal is beneficial to them, just as keeping your cat indoors at all times. If you would like more links, please feel free to ask, I would be happy to share more.
Also, I am sure you could open up the phone book and call just about any vet and ask them the risks of not spaying or neutering your cats, and most will tell you, it is best for them.
I don't want you to feel offended by my post, I just happen to feel very strongly about spaying and neutering, and advocate it as much as I can. I am the neighbor, who goes out and spays or neuters the neighbors cat, if one will continue letting it outdoors unaltered. We do the same with strays in our neighborhood, and if the stray is friendly, we find a home we feel is best, or if the cat is too feral, we take it out to a farm with many acres, and a barn for shelter from the elements.
We know we aren't ridding the world of overpopulation, but I would like to think that we are helping, and when you read the posts on this site, it is clear that there are many with this view, who realize why we need to spay and neuter our pets. You can be one more who helps in the cause, by spaying the 2, 17 week old kittens, and the adults when you can. We should all step up and be responsible for getting pets spayed and neutered.
I can also understand that you may like having a pregnant Mom and little babies running around, which is why I think you may like helping foster pregnant Moms, and kittens, until the shelter can take them, get them spayed and neutered, and off to good homes, where they will never contribute to the overpopulation of unwanted pets in this country or to the number of pets being euthanized in shelters due to lack of room and funding.
As you read my post, please realize this is just my strong opinion, and I am not trying or meaning to offend you.
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