6 Things I Learned from Our Ringworm Plague (book length....)

[eliandkoby]

I was up late watching the video that you posted.  I didn't get thru it all, but YES I learned alot.  Maybe I won't obsess quite as much.  I now understand the enemy just a bit more.   I will call around today and see what info I can get from different vets and I will watch the rest of the video today. 

Eli my 5 yr old boy is the one I am most worried about.  We caught his RW very early because we had a heads up from the kitten and knew what to look for.  His appetite is ravenous for canned food, and yet he has lost weight.   I mentioned it to the vet when I took him in for his last culture and all she said was losing weight is a good thing.  Hm.....he's not heavy to begin with.

Koby the kitten doesn't have an issue in the world.  He's all happy and well, just happy to have a home with servants and a playmate. 

I am in Michigan.  I don't know how much they see ringworm around here.  Koby was adopted from a rescue that I volunteer at.  I usually foster dogs.  Note to self. 

Two years ago at the rescue, they had a ringworm outbreak.  Cat/kitten rooms were all closed down.  Two and half wks after my dd adopted Koby, he came down with a spot on his lip.  I immediately called the rescue to ask if any other kittens in the room came down with it.   All the kittens had been adopted, so there was no mention or calls back about ringworm.  ONLY ME!   I'm not pointing any fingers, but Koby could of ONLY contracted it at the rescue.  

Thank you again for all the help. 

 

[bunnelina]

See if you can stop the medication for the cats now that they've had one negative culture and weren't bad cases to begin with. Weight loss is not good; I'd also be very worried about Eli — and also the kitten, too. I'd request some liver tests to make sure there's no toxicity.  Is there a veterinary school in your area? They might have staff with more experience or know what local vets have dealt with ringworm and consulted them.

I am lucky to go to a cats-only vet clinic. There are at least three around Boston. They see so many more cats than mixed practices do, and they have more time to keep up with cat-specific medical literature. 

Was Koby born at the rescue? If he was born outside, he could have picked it up there, as a baby. But you're probably right about the shelter. Not every cat will get ringworm unless the place is inundated. Kittens are susceptible because they have weaker, developing immune systems, for example. But strong, healthy adults can fight it off. 

My kitten, a feral, came from a small, rather poorly run rescue that couldn't handle their ringworm outbreak. It was just two women operating out of a house with a small shelter in the backyard. I think they disbanded; they are down near Rhode Island, and I know they had disagreements about how to treat the animals and broke up the partnership.

We adopted a kitten from Maine last month. It was sort of an accident. We were happy with four cats in our tiny apartment. But this one wormed its way into our hearts via some Facebook friends who are all cat-rescue people, over a couple of months. He's incredibly loving and sweet. But he got this little spot on his nose and you can imagine how worried I was, as in NO NOT THAT AGAIN.... It was a scratch and went away. But the whole nightmare came back to me. The next time we adopt, and I hope it won't be for many years, I will take the kitten or cat straight from the rescue to the vet for culturing and a "preventive" lime-sulfur dip (unless that less-stinky Malaseb stuff also works). Fool me once....

Keep me posted, okay?

PS:  Video? I'm glad it was helpful (!!) but I thought I was only posting a PDF!

 

[queensmoon]

I apologize if I am too off topic, but has anyone experienced any side effects for them from the dips?  I have recently developed some puffy/baggy eyes and have a minor head cold that seemed to begin right after we started to do the sulphur dips.

 

[bunnelina]

I don't think you are off topic, this is where we all come to share problems in the trenches! 

I was allergic to the Derma-Pet lime-sulfur solution. I was sneezing, hacking, and my eyes were watering after the cats came home from the groomer. It was a strong, immediate reaction.  For the next round of dips, we switched to the Vet Solutions product and that was a huge improvement; I could tolerate it. I have allergies (ragweed, trees, cats!) and, rarely, asthma. I don't usually have symptoms beyond a sniffly nose (15+ years of allergy shots). But lime-sulfur can be irritating to the eyes and lungs.  I could not have handled dipping the cats myself. It is strong stuff.  That said, my cats didn't seem to have any ill effects from the dips aside from smelling like firework and turning slightly yellow. Some say it soothes irritated skin!

 

[eliandkoby]

Yes little Koby was born outside at a construction site in a storage trailer.  Maybe he was carrying the little RW on him all this time and after he got into the rescue and neutered around 4 mts old, he never actually recovered from the stress of it all.  He would just huddle in his crate or in the corner of the kitten room and could not adapt in the flurry of activity.  I'm sure all of this led to his outbreak.  He was not grooming and they had to feed him separately from the others.  By the time I fostered him, he was skin and bones.  A few days of a calm home and good rest, he came around looking for love and getting into mischief!   This was just before Thanksgiving.

Koby picked up weight, and back to the rescue he went mid December, coordinator thought he might get a home because he was looking quite amazing.  But then the same behavior started all over with.  Hiding, afraid, not eating, and no one adopted him.  Back to my house he comes end of December.  My daughter and I decide that she needs to adopt him because he just cannot go back to rescue.  Mid January, we see hairless spot on his lip, and the whole nightmare began.   Koby is the white kitty, Eli the brown taffy, and Lacey the tuxedo.   This was taken in December when all was fine! 

Three cats.jpg

• eliandkoby
• Mar 13, 2014

Two calls into vet clinics looking for other avenue's to take before something bad happens to my cats!!!!!

 

[bunnelina]

Thanks for the story and that photo. It's great that you and your daughter saved Koby!  I wish you luck in contacting vets today. 

I'm learning from my very comforting, affectionate new kitten that one can't always be sure of just who is rescuing whom... Koby may "rescue" you someday, and repay you and your daughter for what you've been going through.

 

[catmom110]

Hi - bunny and everyone else! Bunny you helped me tremendously when I went through the "plague" that began in early September and while I was ready to have a nervous breakdown I survived - Jacob and Jonah my new kittens was brought home and had the run of the house along with my existing cat - i got lesions first, then my husband and then my son - Jackie had a spot by her eye and ear. Jackie was at the vet for almost a week while I had my house cleaned professionally by a trauma company....(I was cleaning like crazy myself) and my two new kittens went back to the shelter to be dipped and then I brought them back a month later - my older cat who stayed at the vet for 6 nights was started on intraconzol - one week on and one week off for 6 weeks. I think very cat gets a different dosage depending on their weight - while in hospital she had two anti fungal baths and once I brought her home, while still on oral liquid intraconazol...:I took her for weekly baths for 3 weeks - when the kittens came home I didn't isolate them as those spores fly and for another month I would vacumne everyday and change sheets and towels 3 times a week. And clean like crazy over and over again to the point of exhaustion - but I got through it and coming from me who has 1600 square feet of wall to wall carpet....it doesn't last forever! Once everyone was back home I didn't get any more lesions and after a month because I was clear....I felt and prayed I was out of the woods! Sounds like you did and excellent job and may this never ever happen to you again!

 

[eliandkoby]

Well it's good to know that there is life after ringworm.  Thanks Bunny and Catmom!   Just talking to others and seeing what you have done really helps.  I'm a huge fan of message boards because real people have things that worked for them or at times gives others (like me) questions for the vet!

Catmom - you called in a trauma company!  OMG how the heck much did that cost?  I actually had a professional carpet cleaning company come in and do my large family room and furniture.  I did not tell them about the contamination of ringworm because I was afraid they wouldn't help me.  They cleaned, sanitized, and put a prevention coating on everything.  $400 later, I pray that they got it all.  This was the room that the cats hung out in the most and of course it's carpeting!  I've done the best I can and can only hope and pray that it has been enough.

Sorry about the confusion Bunny regarding the 'video' that I watched.  I found it when I was researching, what else?  RINGWORM.  I know you said to not obsess....but well I have to come clean.  ITS ALL I DO!  

  I tried to post the link to the webcast, but it's not working.  Maybe you could post it for others.  I found it very helpful and Dr. Morellio talks and gives examples that most people can understand.  it is geared for shelters, but I found it very informative.  (how to beat ringworm in shelters, maddie's fund, dr morellio)  Something like that.  Have you guys seen it?

In her webcast she talked about the different oral meds.  I of course focused on what she had to say about terbinifine.  Dr. M does a 21 straight day course with it.   I decided yesterday that we are done with it.  Our cats have been on it 45 days, so twice as much.  I've got to think that this Dr. M has alot more experience with ringworm than my own vet.  

Tomorrow Eli is due for his one month culture, so he is seeing our vet.  I am going out of town, but my DD will take him.  She will ask vet if they can come out of the room.  I know she is just going to say that they need two negative cultures to be supposedly RW free, but we are at the end of our ropes.  I can't see why we cannot continue to bathe twice a week and wash all covers, and vacuum daily. 

Time will tell I guess.  Again, thanks so much. 

 

[eliandkoby]

Last night was bath night.  I walked into den (daughters bedroom now) with towels draped on my head and shampoo in hand.  "guess what day it is honey?"  We started to laugh because we are so sick of this journey.   But we will get there, hopefully very soon.

Koby has not had the best life so far, but his lucky day was getting into a rescue.  The poor guy didn't know that he was in good hands.  After his neuter, he just didn't bounce back.  It could of been all the activity, the buzz of the rescue, the kitten room, who knows?   He was skin and bones when he came to our house in November.  I am glad that we took him under our wings to foster.  I could of skipped this whole ringworm ordeal, but I am so much more informed now.  Will I ever foster another kitten?  Probably not.  I'm kind of sad about that as I love kittens.  But I'm going to forever be afraid of RW!!!!!!

Didn't plan on adopting him because we are a two cat household who normally fosters dogs.   I know things happen for a reason.  Look at him a month after fostering?  The little KING!   Koby would like this nightmare to be over with too.  I'd like to be a normal cat now who has an awesome home.  Nothing could be better! 

Alby 12122013 002.JPG

• eliandkoby
• Mar 14, 2014

 

[catmom110]

Awe what a sweetie pie! I promise this will pass! You asked about the trama company - well I paid a small fortune - under $3000 but at the time no money was too great - although they had hazmat suites on!! After being on that oral medication..if you find no more lesions on yourself or any other human for 2 weeks or so....I'd think you'd be clear - I was ok in my house with no isolation of the kittens because they had been away back at the shelter isolated together and dipped on a regular schedule - my other cat when this first happened, stayed at the vet and when she came home was isolated for about 2 weeks or so in my den with bright windows and tv and we covered everything with old king sized sheets that I washed daily - one day she got out while I was coming in and I forgot to close my bedroom door..and my husband and I were so exhausted....Jackie ran to my bed, got comfortable in her usual spot and we just let her be - and I was lucky .....I didn't get any lesions and my cats lesions were getting better - it's hard to remember exactly everything from then because I drank a lot of wine.....even with my own oral lamisil - hope fully you'll begin to forget it and run from the memory of this experience!

 

[eliandkoby]

Thanks for your input Catmom.  I am thinking the same thing about what has been done in this house for the last 6 weeks.  I can't for the life of me get WHY our 16 yr old cat didn't GET IT.  I am forever thankful and prayed that she would be spared.  She is a healthy girl and we've been so lucky with her. 

The thing is, no one got the fungus here but our daughter.  One spot on her chest maybe two wks after Koby's dx.  He slept with her and the cats hang out in her bedroom alot, so I'm sure many spores were flying in that room of hers, plus she doesn't clean like she should.  

I am wresting with this decision of letting the cats out.  But so help me if this comes back to bite me in the arse, I'll end up in some psychiatric ward. DD will ask the vet today, which is kind of useless, but oh well.

I'm surprised I haven't burned up the washer, dryer, water pump (on a well) or the vacuum.  Not yet anyways.

 

[catmom110]

Ha ha! You have to do what you think is best for you and your family - re letting the cats free roam - Jackie had been out of the house for almost a week at the vet and the kittens were out getting 2x a week dippings - I was catless for a week. Jackie had already started her intaconazol while she was away and in Jackie's case....after two weeks she was less contagious after the first round of oral/liquid fungal meds - I think it was one week on, then one week off or maybe it was 10days on and 10 days off to reduce the risk of the drugs harming her liver. I think I had so many lesions because I have wall to wall carpet and I had been stressed over my other cat who had just passed from lymphoma....and my immune system was down - because it was less than a week that I had adopted my ringworm brothers after my Jason went to the bridge we also used miconazole ointment on Jackie's actual lesion. And I would "wash" the crusty bits that were healing with a warm soft washcloth and a very mild baby shampoo to expose the new skin before applying the fresh miconazol. And I prayed a lot - look at it this way....it's just some heavy spring cleaning once the ringworm brothers came back...it took me a month to want to cuddle with them, my house was clean, and while I had PTSD from the experience and felt itchy all the time...it soon passed and now it's over 5 months that everyone is well and over that plague - Seems like you're past the worst and on your way to a speedy recovery of life as you once knew it!!

image.jpg

• catmom110
• Mar 15, 2014

 

[catmom110]

This is Jackie back in September when she first caught ringworm from the above two kitten who by the way never showed any signs -

image.jpg

• catmom110
• Mar 15, 2014

 

[eliandkoby]

Awe your Jackie could be Eli's sister!  I love my tabby and white kitties!   By looking at your picture of Jackie's spot, this is almost exactly where Eli had his.  He then had another spot just below the other ear, and then that was it.  We got right on the medication and bathing from the get go.

DD took both cats to the vet this AM.  (I had to be out of town)  I left a list of things to ask the vet.  One of them was the terbinifine and it's side effects of long term use.  Another was his voracious appetite and his weight loss.  The vet had to go out and look it up.  She came back and said that the only side effect of the meds was vomiting.    I don't know if this med is new for cats or not and maybe they just don't have enough history on it.   But I feel that 6 wks is enough time for it to do it's job.  She put the lamp on him, and could only see a small tiny bit of glowing under Eli's chin, so she plucked from there to culture it.   

Koby is fine.  Nothing glowing.  He is gaining weight and as far as vet is concerned, he is fine now.  So my daughter and I are going to have a pow wow tomorrow and decide if we just let them out and continue to clean, cover stuff, and pray.

Goodness this is nerve racking!  Do I or don't I?  Maybe I'll just flip a coin.  Heads they come out, tails they stay in.  My daughter asked the vet about letting them out into the house, and she hee hawed around and didn't really have an answer.  I said that is because she just doesn't know!   Who does?

So sorry to hear about your other kitty!  You jumped right out and got two little darlings....who brought you ringworm!  Must be love! 

 

[catmom110]

I just want to be clear that while Jackie was allowed to free roam after 3 weeks after this had started, she stilled continued oral and optical meds until she had been on 3 rounds of medication. It was about a total of 6-7 weeks that included the "off weeks" - the lesions started healing before that but to insure it wouldn't come back...she was given what was prescribed. She wasn't contagious as it turned out after a few weeks, but our course of action and prescription was for all those weeks.

 

[catmom110]

I think the terbinifine might make cats as well as people lose their appitite - my vet wasn't thrilled with Jackie being free roam but she had said to me that I should not allow her or the ringworm brothers into the bedrooms and to shut the door to those rooms....safe rooms! I did that for a few days but grew tired of their persistent cries of wanting to come into my bedroom - maybe not allowing anyone in your bedroom could be a happy compromise until you feel more comfortable?

 

[eliandkoby]

Our bedroom and our sons room has been closed off since cleaning well end of January.   Hubby will probably never feel comfortable with cats sleeping in there EVER AGAIN.  Oh well what can you do?  More laundry.

 

[emme]

I swore I'd never get into another ringworm discussion but I'll add my quick 2 cents.  I rescued a cat who escaped and came home a week later with ringworm. I have another cat and a dog.  the dog goes to daycare every day, which is run by two very close friends of mine.  Had she gotten it, it would have been disastrous for my friends' business and I would have had great difficulty finding a dog walker for her while I went to work.  it was extremely important to me that the other cat and dog not get it, so I quarantined the new cat, whose name was Gilligan.  Gilligan was epileptic and the quarantine was very stressful for him.  His seizure activity increased dramatically while he was quarantined.  I kept his room as clean as possible, swiffering floors daily, walls every other day or so, ceiling every week at least. Scrubbed trim and floorboards, bleached the litter box weekly, etc.  I also scrubbed/bleached the rest of the house several times while he was quarantined and swiffered and/or vacuumed the floors every day, and the baseboards and corners and the joint between the walls and the ceilings weekly.  it was exhausting.  My dad had just been diagnosed with stage 4 cancer before this, and I got sick in the middle of this with a muscle infection so this whole thing was a nightmare.  I was wary about spending time with my dad because he was on chemo and immunocompromised and his getting ringworm would have been terrible, so I didn't see him for a few weeks.

Gilligan was quarantined for 11 weeks, I think.  He got 3 clean cultures and I then returnd him to the rescue on Jan 4, the day his last culture came back negative.  I was not a good home for him to deal with the increase in seizures caused by the quarantine stress, and my own health and my Dad's made it just too hard for me to deal with all of it.   The rescue kept him in foster care for 4 weeks to monitor his seizures then put him up for adoption. I am so joyful to report that he found a great home the very first adoption day he attended.  My infection cleared up eventually as well, but sadly my Dad dad died on Feb. 16.  I can honestly say the past 6 months were the absolute worst of my life and the ringworm had a lot to do with that.  The stress of it all was incredible.  I threw out a lot of furniture, my rugs, curtains, pillows, etc just to do all I could to make sure the dog and other cat did not get it, and that I couldn't transmit it to my dad or to my best friend, who is also on chemo.   Neither the dog nor cat got it, neither did my Dad or friend.  I never got it either.  Had I not worried so much about the dog's getting it I don't think it would have been quite so stressful.

Ringworm is a nightmare.  I didn't think I could ever clean again after this but the animal hair in my house is back to epic levels.  You will get through it.  I remain wary of my remaining cat, who is a sweetheart.  I am terrified of ringworm invading again. I can't wait till spring when I can open all the windows and air everything out and repaint every room in this house.  You WILL get through it, though.  That's one thing my vet emphasized to me at every visit for Gilligan and the culturing of my dog and other cat (they each got 2 cultures also).  She kept telling me that everyone comes out ok on the other side of this eventually.  I never dipped Gilligan.  His ringworm seemed isolated to his ears and a tiny spot above his eye, so I had topical miconosol I used on him.  We also started using griseofulvin on him, which I understand is not necessarily what all other vets recommend, but I ended talking to 3 vets about this and they all said it was fine and often the first line treatment.  After he'd had at least one negative culture we switched to itraconazole, which was SO much easier to give but had to be obtained from a compounding pharmacy.  Simply for ease of administering I would try this first if I ever have this happen again.  From what I've read on the internet, 11 weeks from diagnosis to cure isn't that bad, so maybe Gilligan just didn't have a particularly bad case or strain.  I am just glad it's over.

I wish all of you the best getting through this.  Let's hope someone finds an easy cure for this one day soon so we never have to think about it again.

 

[eliandkoby]

Thanks for sharing your story Emme.  I am so sorry to hear about your dear Dad. I also lost my Dad to cancer many years ago and I still miss him every day.

I can see how you had ALOT on your plate with everything going on in your life, and yet you endured for Gilligan getting him cured of RW.  Sometimes things happen for a reason in regards to you surrendering him, but it sounds like it went well and he now has a home.    I can honestly say that I will surely do things different next time on letting a kitten come into our home!  I have fostered many kittens over the years, and I never even knew about ringworm!   I do now!! 

We are going on week seven here, oral meds, and baths twice a week.  Our 16 yr old kitty is my reason for getting this under control.  I can see how worried you would of been with your dog going to daycare.  Yes so scary isn't it.  The cleaning is unreal.  All this time I thought I was pretty good at it, ha!  Ya no spring cleaning will be done in this house.  I got it done in Feb and Mar. 

There is so much conflicting information on the net, and our vet seems a bit unclear on answering most of our questions, so we are in limbo on so much.   I did call three other clinics asking what their protocol was for treatment.  I heard back from only one (so far) and all the vet tech had to say was that it depends on the situation, how bad they are, how many animals you have, and well, we would like you to come in for an appt.   I will try the other two again.

Can a cat get it again after going thru a round of ringworm?  I am finding conflicting information and it's making me MAD!  Just give me answers.  I like things to be concrete, but this information on this fungi is NOT.

 

Spores can live forever, but will a cat get it AGAIN if he's already had it?   (if a new one came in....then maybe yes?)

 

[emme]

I think they can get it again because I read a lot about the risk of reinfection when a cat is let back into the environment unless the environment had been as contaminated as possible.  I have not yet thoroughly decontaminated the room where Gilligan was quarantined.  I threw out the furniture in there except at desk, and his dishes, toys, little box, etc.  I need to get in there but I'm trying to wait until I can open the windows to keep the fumes down.  I wonder if that room will always make me a little afraid.   There is nothing fun about this. I have had cats and dogs all of my life and had never heard about ringworm other than little kids getting it in school or whatever.  I am now completely paranoid about it and frankly can't see myself owning another pet when my current two go.  It's sad because all of my prior pets were rescues and I feel bad that I can't rescue any more, but I can financially support rescues and shelters, so I guess I'll do that.

There is a lot of information about this on the internet.  I know Dr. Moriello is considered one of the great experts on this, but my vet had more traditional ideas and luckily they worked out.  My vet did not know much about itraconazole until I told her about it and I suspect it will now be her first treatment option.  I really trust my vet.  She pretty much single handedly kept another dog of mine alive for 12 years.  The griseofulvin was 5ml 2x a day, plus I had to give 5ml of corn oil 2x a day. It was horrible for Gilligan.  the itraconazole was 1ml 2x a day but I suspect he was pretty much cured by the time I switched meds.  Such a scourge.  I hope it passes quickly for you and never returns.

Keep going, you'll get through.